Erny

Hi Jeff If only my girl would chase the lure .... If I went, it would only be for the entertainment of others whilst I chase the lure and my dog sits and watches .....

or smell their dogs farts! Feeding human grade roo mince can produce some nasty smells too, though ....... (Not arguing against raw whole meals ... I'm in favour)

You just had him, we are taking back whats ours ;) stand in the line and wait your turn Yeah, but we're a dominant species type ..... we take what we wanna when it's good ;) (but we're happy to share!) Anyways, you've had more turns than us ..... (shouts "not fair" whaaaaaa!)

Of course, you won't forget us Melbournites, will you .....

What do you consider "mean" ?

HR! You're a cheeky .................................... eavesdropper!

Not to mention false impressions. IE x%protein as advertised by the can (and remember ... they don't normally quote on a "dry weight" basis, so the % can be misleading), can in fact be indigestible. Ergo, dog doesn't receive the % protein you might expect. Also, the fact that canned food is heat sealed - cooking food destroys the natural enzymes and microbial content, preventing the natural process of decay. Unfortunately, it also destroys natural vitamins, essential fatty acids, amino acids and proteins contained in the food and renders many minerals unavailable for absorption from the gut. Apart from the food then becoming nutritionally deficient, the absence of valuable enzymes (which assist not only in slowing the ageing processes but also the digestion of the food) forces the pancreas to work harder. This may result in a number of canine related diseases, including Pancreatitis, Pancreatic Insufficiency and Sugar Diabetes. What you don't know is what quality is of the food substances contained in many of the products. Is the meat content derived from high quality sources, or from dead, dying, diseased or disabled (4-D rule) animals and/or whether the meat has been chemically treated to prohibit it from human consumption. Do you know if the grains or vegetables etc used are high grade quality, or whether they were deemed unfit for human use due to excessive chemical contamination in the fields or perhaps the production remains swept up off the manufacturing plant floor. "Give Your Dog a Bone" by Dr. Ian Billinghurst (pp 17-25) gives such information, as does the Vets All Natural website. There's another link called Understanding Dog Foods and Dog Food Labels you could look at too, although I haven't looked at it for a while, so I'm not sure if it is still current. Hope you might find some of this information helpful. As Anne suggested, a google search will avail you a number of other "horror" story/accounts regarding canned food. Having said this, I'm not suggesting or claiming that all canned food is as bad as the worst, but there's no way of knowing for sure (unless you work where the commercial foods are processed.

I've already emailed Steve, but unfair to keep my testaments 'under wraps'. I commend Steve on well thought out and sensical training methodologies. I enjoyed his approach to training and methods to achieve high excellence (and fun) in that field. As a trainer of many different dogs (breeds and temperaments alike) for many varied people with many varied lifestyles and requirements, I know I will be able to (in fact, I've already started) implement his methods, either as a whole or by the adoption of segments (depending on what suits the dog and owner/family at the time). As I said to Steve, I left the daytime workshop and evening seminar richer for the knowledge and deeper understanding I gained that day. Thanks again.

I know, Phatdex .... but I'm such an "innocent" (Actually, I think it's 3 or 4 vids - I kept stumbling over them whilst searching for Aggressive Tibbie)

Panda - I posted in the other thread too. I'm sure Steve Austin runs obedience classes too.

I can't find it. And the "search for a video" under "Aggressive Tibbie" came up with nothing. And I wish they'd get rid of the video titled "into 1" ..... I so don't need that

When the glint for life has faded from your dog's eyes ...... Your Mum will know when the time is 'right'.

I can't offer any suggestions either, other than what Kelpie-i has given .... even then, if they're not prepared to put in the effort with what they're putting up with now, my feelings are that the threat of expense will only result in their resolve to put the dog to sleep. Only thing I can think of adding is to tell them if they're not prepared to make the effort, this should be their last dog and that they should perhaps own goldfish instead (if any animal at all) - ever. People are frustrating and down right disappointing. If they do opt to put the dog to sleep, I hope they can be made to watch it. Only other option is to send the dog to boarding and training kennels - although by the sounds of it, they wouldn't be interested in the expense. I know it means the dog still has to go back to them, but improvement in the dog might inspire them to listen and heed more than what they're doing now.

I've PM'd you, Ari. Unfortunately, it doesn't sound like much hope for this dog if it stays with this family. What can you do if the family aren't really interested and dedicated?

Thank you for understanding.

So .... all the things I say about you HR have been a waste of time? (sorry, couldn't help myself)

I remember - it was at the "Assistance Dogs Australia" fun/picnic day at Albert Park Lake. Perhaps HR took some pictures and could post some up under a different thread/forum. I'll speak to him on Wednesday.

Anne - unfortunately not. All the dogs there are members and, as such, have been assessed (so they have an understanding of temperament and training levels) and have had vaccinations checked off (and any other issues discussed and advice given). They'd lose control of things if ppls could turn up with non-member dogs. It's a safety (for all) issue. Sorry.

Poo .... I missed it. What did it cover?

Hey CF! Good for you .... I'll look forward to meeting you one of these days. Work shops and lectures are going to keep me busy for the next couple of weeks, but I hope to get back to class training early December. Have fun in your training sessions. Gooooooo Murray!

Sidoney - what I was trying to say, but you said it better. And one more thing to add .... YB - if people are doing this to you, it's because they recognise you as "worthy competition". They're frightened of losing their status. Take heart by and be proud of that.

YB - I don't know what's happened to you this week to obviously dampen your spirits - but what I will say is don't let it stop you. IMO, those who go on the "attack" are quite often jealous of your accomplishments and are without the knowledge and capabilities of achieving what you have. They want to bring you down to their level. If it's working for you and your dog .... then keep going. People are disappointing sometimes ... your kindness and generousity of information and help is sometimes taken as a threat to their perceived "skill" ranking. Shrug off any deflamatory comments and know in your heart of hearts and mind of minds that you're doing the best with your dog (even in the face of your personal difficulties), that you've been willing to help (as opposed to being selfish) and it's the other people's choice as to whether they wish to take advantage of it or run you down for it and so remain ignorant. ETA: Congrats on your successes!

Thanks Phatdex. I take that as a real compliment, because she is the one I speak of who, when I adopted her, was fear aggressive to other dogs and (to a lesser extent and technically speaking) to people. I brought her there in the afternoon for 'socialisation' purposes only. I grab every opportunity I can to do that - I've determined she has critical period issues, which means I have to keep adding layer upon layer upon layer of good association. I was pleased to see her relax enough to roll on her side/back for a tummy scratch. I had to leave quickly to go to an evening seminar, elsewise I would've loved to have spent time with her saying "hello" to everyone. I'm sorry I also missed Goukie exhibiting his hidden talent for walking/heeling on a loose lead! What a bonus to achieve that! Hope his training continues to go as well.

Yeah ..... we were all so scared Thanx also from me, Julie and Steve. It was both an informative and pleasant day (lucky with the weather too). I didn't miss being at work one little bit. Oh .... and I hope no-one minded all my questions (typical Erny trait, I'm afraid )

I've PM'd ISH with my mobile too, and some directions (I'm 99% sure they're right!).