Lablover

OK thanks. I had visions of handlers spinning around in a frenzy.

Kelpie-I, Could you expand on this. When my dogs are in prey drive (or what I call retrieving drive) they have no interest in food rewards. Also, how do you train a group of dogs at once using prey drive?

OK. Party pooper. In jest, in jest, in jest. I have to leave for a second now, one of my dogs is scratching at the door to come in. I wish the old girl had learnt how to open the screen door, like a couple of other ones have.

Heavens to Betsy!!!! This would take a lot of typing and frankly I am not qualified to answer. I have studied and studied videos and books, for goodness sake, in trying to expand my knowledge with training in drive. I think,pray (not prey LOL), hope I am on the right path. I am waiting for K9s arrival to check my technique, timing, methods and the like. And more importantly to learn how to apply them further with high level retrieving work. I am too much of a wuss to add my ramblings.

I think so. Links are so much easier, We all want the perfect dog and to be the best trainer possible. Poor dogs and poor us. What a mean we want health, drive, and good looks - BTW I have given up on my dogs looks. I do not care if they are purple with pink dots, as long as they are sound and want to do the work.

Hi YB, I just want to clarify your question, hope you do not mind. Increase drive? Or increase focus while IN drive?

K9 I hope will come back tomorrow. Here is a link that may help: http://realgsd.info/GSDinfo/Training/etnerves.htm

I had a lovely pup, who had a lot of drive. During socialisation which was held in a local safe park, we used to walk past tennis courts. He would start to salivate, yelp is excitement, his eyes spark up more, as he knew as soon as he heard the players, he would see the tennis balls flying around. I would give him my prey drive voice cue and because of his education his focus would revert back to me as he knew from experience where his satisfaction would come from. Training in drive is fun for the dog. I cannot begin to explain.

Here's a simple one. http://www.nwk9.com/twosqueakies.htm To tell you the truth, I have no idea how prey drive exercises could be performed in a group setting. "It" is not like food which is a drive of course, but easier to carry, and certainly less distracting and confusing to other dogs.

I am a bit tired. As I have multiple labs in the house, I cannot throw rewards when they obey me. Even if I had one dog, I could well imagine breaking every light fitting and ornament. Help this pitiful person, to compile a list of opportunities to ask of the dogs while inside. Before feeding. While opening the outside doors for them. When they bring a present, like their food bowl to tell me its dinner time. When they come up for a pat/hug/kiss. Before they are allowed on the lounge or bed. What is some more everyday chances we have? PS I do not need to throw the reward, but all the same it would be tiresome to carry one around.

I agree Yogibear. I have tried a few of the others.

Good point, or rather bad point (at the end of the stake). I have had many a scare, but touch wood (what IS that thing on my shoulders), none of my dogs have been injured so far. I make damm sure they are in hard ground also.

Sidoney - Spot on, IMO. And, if a problem exists:- the more severe the problem, the more clear and exaggerated NILIF (and other "leadership" measures) should be, me thinks. I agree. I think my dogs are pretty well behaved and trained, but more than once they have been naughty, actually very naughty when in retrieving trials. I am just trying to look into how I can train them "that" little bit further, in the house. When I was in the States, I saw more than once absolutely drop dead trained dogs in the field, but when say going to the toilet in a group, disobeyed their trainers. The dogs knew when they could disobey and when they could not.

A couple of retriever trialers make them. I think they are about $30.00. Postage would not be much. I have mailed a few to friends in the US too!!! If interested send me an Email and I will find one for you.

I have been pondering again. Very dangerous, I already have a headache. My dogs while in the house, which in reality is always, LOL, when not at training or if I am out, my labs are allowed to do as they please. They are past the puppy chewing phase and a tired dog is normally a good dog. They jump on the couch, have free access to our garden, jump up for pats and basically I do not "require" them to do anything inside. They follow me like shadows. Bit tight sometimes in small rooms!!!. At training they perform well, but I have been wondering about the BENEFITS of every time they come up for a pat, or want a cuddle on the couch, tell me its dinner time etc, should I ask more of them in return?

Because I have multiple dogs that I own and train, and sometimes train in areas where I need to walk, I use these tie out stakes. They are easy to carry, have spinning heads, you can put two dogs on each stake, you use your foot to hammer them in, and they are (depending on the dogs conditioning) quite safe. Also in retriever trials sometimes we are required to stake our dogs, after walking over very tough terrain and the stakes are the only option we have, (besides a tree if available) to tether our dogs. Depending on the dog, I use a chain, as a couple of mine are well known to chew through leads very quickly.

LL: I am already trembling, tingling, and NOW every hair is standing up on my back in excitement.

LL: How does a dog subsciously know what he/she/us want? K9: focus, control etc must be taught, but prey drive is a sunconscious desire to chase, not a learned event. LL: I understand, thanks. LL: But then again, I have Stamp, who I did not praise/to release tension/drive enough. K9 force? K9: Stamps issue was compiled from several issues, not just lack of praise but thatw as certainly a factor of it. LL: Several issues? Could you expand please. I have no shame in letting others see your reply regarding in what you think my training errors were.

Wild as far I remember from the first two articles. The article was written by Felix Ho and Shaun Ellis of Wolfpack Management Co. The three series are from the Australasian Working Dog Magazine, BTW.

Its huge, so I have taken the liberty of trimming it down in my own words. The author, a wolf expert, had a particularly wild wolf which he was researching. It had obviously had very poor, inadequate education and it had learnt that force like hitting, striking or biting was its only form of defence. One day the wolf bit the author, causing significant wounds. What he did then was for the next 3 or 4 days was go into the enclosure on all fours while holding his forearm off the ground mimicking a limp, constantly licking and feigning injury. These actions were designed to indicate to the wolf that it had injured him in such a way as that he was no longer able to obtain a food source. About a week and a half later, which is not too long for a wolf to be without food, he began to put weight on the arm and behave normally. He then went away and returned with food and shared it with the wolf. From that day forward his relationship with the wolf was completely different,. The wolf had learnt a valuable lesson that would have been well respected in the wild, to injure a pack member to the point that they could no longer contribute effectively to the packs survival was extremely counter productive.

I agree. I was reading an article on wolves last night, and certainly it made sense. Should I type the relevant paragraph? I found it very thought provoking. Not really relevant to the topic, but rather, wolves co-existing together with each other and the human relationship.

My dogs sleep with us from time to time, are allowed on the funiture, and are spoilt terribly. I do not think it negates anything I want them to do. Just joining the conversation. If dogs are like wolves, are we like apes? This line always springs into the grey matter that remains in my head.

Just re-asking this question because it seems to ahve gotten missed and I'm very curious. No. A well trained dog may look like a robot, except of course they look as if they are having a wonderful time, wagging tail, thrembling, salivating and keen eye focus. In retrieving trials they are expected and do hunt on their own, mostly out of sight of the handler. A good question all the same!!!!! and one that is particularly relevant in all aspects of training.

Um, er, sure.................but I have also seen many a time, praise given when totally unwarranted, in my humble opinion, which may/can/does confuse the dog. Many a time, I have praised my dogs, and I think, in reality, it makes me feel better, not the dog. LL, here you go again...tempting me to hijack a bit. I've been thinking about this a lot lately. I got told at a herding seminar recently..."Quit praising that dog! She doesn't need it & you're just irritating her!" I think what he was trying to say is that for her the work itself is the reward & every time I stopped to praise her, I was really interrupting her work unnecessarily and for her it was almost a negative thing rather than a positive one. I see it sometimes in agility too...I'll stop & reward for something tricky done successfully. Sometimes I think she's indulging me by letting me reward her, she knows the sequence will continue & would much rather be doing that. It's kind of... OK I'll tug if I must, but c'mon, hurry it up...we got a course to complete! Hey, Vickie, I am glad you are not a good quoter either. I wish I knew how to multiple quote. One day I will remember to ask a visitor. I think handlers praise too, thinking their dogs attitudes may lift - particulary when the requirements are multilevel, instead of simplifying the task (even a little) and breaking down the handlers requirements. As this thread is on prey drive control and focus, I think it is wonderful that we are all interested, but when it comes down to it, in my humble opinion, not many dogs particularly those not considered "working" breeds, training using prey drive may not be the drive to train with.

Just an add on, if I may