Lablover

Wondering, who on DOL has actually adopted a dog from the RSPCA?

O, phooey, retrieving training and trialling is not included in the header.

Wooo hoooo another K9force seminar. Steve has held seminars on our property. At the initial seminar, I was simply going to help set up, then go about my business. But hour after hour, seminar after seminar, I sat transfixed as he is a great communicator and IMHO has many good ideas. Steve and a few other more dedicated retriever (overseas) trainers, remain on my shoulders every time I train my four competition dogs. Gee they get heavy sometimes, especially in this heat!!!!

I do not know what you mean, .......remembering of course, I am easily confused, he he. Is your question dog age related, (our) requirements/standards etc? Experienced handlers normally know what their dogs problems are and work on their dogs weak points (hopefully not boring the dog in the process).

Oooppps, give me working labs with drive!!!! Love em.

Like today?? I set up 3 cold water blinds (hidden retrieves/bumpers), in a long channel, (channel being 40 yards across), one retrieve at 100 yards, one at 130 yards, and one at 200 yards - 40 yeards from the bank, so straight or correct angled entry was important. After the dog returned from the 1st retrieve, suction to the 2nd was thus created and so forth. Conclusion: Dogs have to stop to the whistle, turn and take relevant casts. Awesome!!! Tomorrow at this new training "farm" (pretty snake safe - due to lack of cover - but I will check first) I will include marks/seen retrieves, which I will no off, to pick up the hidden retrieves. Make sense?

Pretty good??? Not good enough, 100% is required.......or at least 99%.

PAX, Hopefully Tommymc will return. When I imported Yank for example, the first dog for YEARS, I had not bred myself, due to him being reared during winter etc (fun stopped and he was crated) he used to run away (ACTUALLY HE BOLTED LOL), when called. I changed that behaviour quick smart with rewards and short recalls.

I live near you, drop by one day, and I can check out your dog (and you) if you like. Free, as my husband supports my insanity.

Good for you, and especially with Grace.

Not that my reply is worthwhile but .......number one rule: Without focus, we have nothing. Dogs do what works for them. Your line....the more we take from the dog, the more he will give us.....confuses me.......but I am easily confused!!!!

Belgianpup, Just wanted to add - OUTSTANDING, that you are researching before pup arriving.

I must be a bad trainer, mind you my dogs to not counter surf, as correction when young was applied. But today, two of my labs remained in the house, while I was crating two others, I looked up and one was up on the kitchen bench, looking through the window.

Good post especially CONSISTENCY. Mind you good consistency.

Looking forward to Sunday. I feel sure we can solve the dog training problems of the world, once again LOL.

Remember to tie it around your neck, so it is close at hand. Dorks unite!!!!!! PS Just in case you leave it on, have a quick release, if jammed in a door for example. Strangulation and all, eeeeeeeck.

Myszka and everyone, Lately my favourite tool has been a fly swatter (on a lanyard), I look like a dork but who cares!!!! (1) Dogs can retrieve it (2) Dogs can be stroked with it (3) Dogs can be corrected/reinforced with it (4) I can shoo the flies away. (5) Mrs Joe blow public thinks nothing of it, even though as mentioned.......I look like a dork, mostly when I forget to take the damm thing off my neck, when visiting the general store. Must be more uses, but that will do for now. LOL. All for a one dollar tool.

Depends on the situation: Did the dog hear me in the first place? What other distractions are around? Could the dog be sick or injured? Is it an emergency and a response is needed now? Is it training for a sport? Am i asking them to lie down because they are infront of the TV but they are busy being focused on the snake in the tank next to the TV????? Usually would just give a low level verbal praise eg "thankyou". If it was an emergency then the relief of pressure would probably be adequate because the cue would have had some urgency within it. I will often release after the dog has complied from a mutiple cued response and give the chance to get it first go and receive a bigger reward (particularly if there is a distraction). Better come over early on the 16th. We need discussions. I am more of a practical trainer. Too stupid to understand your reply. Show and tell Sunday, we can call it. Talking dog training is fun, doing it, is better.

I think my reason for this thread was not made clear, for which I apologise. Unfortunately I am short on time, but will return after the weekend. May I add quickly, I am very happy with using motivational techniques. Frankly one of my exports to the US, who returned as a stressed worker, with severe panic attacks, whose road to resolution, would never have been able to reach the standards achieved so far, without looking outside my square. ie this dog when stopped on a whistle used to crawl back on his stomach even at long distances - 150 yards (dont worry when I saw THAT behaviour I changed to shorter distances, quick smart). When I was his panic/stress, by close observation 24 hours per day, his confidence was reattained. A few of you have seen him at Obedience training. His focus is outstanding on his reward toy. The world could crash around him, and he would not care. I will be back. I promise, dinner party to organise.

Myszka, I have never met her, simply read her book. Pam J Reid earned her Ph.D in Psychology from the University of Toronto, where she specialized in animal learning, behaviour and cognition. Of course reading the book in full has better value. I always go back to basics, instinct is a wonderful thing, heck.........the way newborn born pups locating teats being one. The instinct to retrieve another, which I obviously enjoy, as do my labs. Then of course to train them for retrieving trials, where the criteria is sometimes contrary. Stop go, stop go, stop go.

Thanks all. I use 1 and 3. NW, what about types of praise for the correct responses after a second cue repeat, or do you feel the relief of pressure is adequate?

Excerpt from Excel-erated learning by Pamela J Reid Motivation "As I have mentioned several times, motivation is one factor which influences whether or not a learned behaviour will be performed. As trainers, we need to be well versed in the science of motiviation as well as the science of learning theory because we can also manipulate the motivation of our animals. Motivation is like the gasoline in your car - without it, your car can't go anywhere. The car may be functioning perfectly but it needs "juice" to display it. Motivation is used to describe the forces which act on or within an animal to activate and direct behavior. A concept that you may be familiar with is the drive theory of motivation. Several top trainers have adapted drive theory to explain why some dogs react to training differently. The idea behind drive theory is that each individual animal comes genetically "equiped" with varying levels of energy for different drives. The dog might possess a particuarly strong "prey" drive, which means that he is highly likely to engage in predatory behavior extremely rewarding. Thus, the dog is highly motivated to reduce the need resutling from this drive state. According to drive theory, behavior is a result of both what has been learned and what is activated by the current drive level. If the dog is primarily activated by his hunger drive, he will engage in food-getting behaviors, particuarly behaviors he has learned are related to obtaining food. If my dog is primarily activated by his prey drive, he will engage in predatory behaviors ,such as stalking, chasing, biting, and so on. If my dog is activated by his "pack" drive, he will engage in social behaviors, such as nuzzling, grooming, etc. In the psychological literature, drive theory as an explanation for motivation has gone out of fashion because FEW OF THE THEORETICAL PREDICTIONS WERE SUBSTANTIATED EXPERIMENTALLY. It is useful, from a dog trainer's standpoint, as a mean for developing effective reinforcers for a specific dog and for identifying how a specific dog is likely to react to a given situation (in order words, what unconditioned responses are likely to be elicited by a training scenario). Otherwise, I feel the theory's value is pretty limited. The main point to understand is that the relationship between learning and motivation is so entwined that it is difficult to conceive of one without the other. For the most part, learign does not occur without motivation. Once a behavior has been learned, it may not be performed if the animal is not motivated to respond. In any training situation, you must consider the motivational state of the animal as well as the learning contingencies. You must also consider competing motivations. You may have a hungry dog that has acquired the response of coming when called in order to earn a food rewardd, but if the dog is loose and there are squirrels to be chased, you may not see the fruits of your training labours." Thankyou, my friend Fiona for typing the above. Hopefuly not too many typing mistakes. Thoughts?????????? PS Sometimes I think I am cheating having highly motivated working labradors to retrieve. Keep an open mind, has been said to be my strongest gift.

I thought this might be an interesting topic, as some mention in past posts, has been made regarding balanced trainers. Soooooooo, lets talk about avoidance/escape methods, which have received negative reactions from various people. I often wonder why the wave of purely positive training began initially, as most dogs trained to extreme levels, still receive corrections/reinforcement, during their training and careers. Which of the below is best,in the road to learning/change of behaviour? To simplify, lets say on a previously TAUGHT sit (on lead) command/cue. (1) (Vocal or other) cue then reinforcement/correction (2) Reinforcement/correction then cue. (3) Cue, reinforcement, repeat cue. (4) Reinforcement and cue simulataneously.

I gotta ask - teaching hold is cruel? Confusion over 30 days in my mind is harsher. What am I missing?

Carp, Bearing in mind you have reared this youngster and have obtained two opinions, and if the breeder is happy to take her back, and you have another dog you are concerned about.......you know what is best, in your heart. More than a few tears will be shed, but as you purchased this dog for agility competitions, it is not fair on you, or your other dog to delay any further. The long and short of it, is you have to do, what some consider selfish. I certainly do not!!! If you keep the problem sheltie, you in time will leave it more and more at home, while concentrating on your other, travelling to training and trials. Weekends away etc. You already spend 4 hours a day concentrating on this dog, training?? You deserve a medal!!! Good luck to you.