espinay2

Carrington kennels Col Weston Sheds

Not what is being said IMO. Rather ANYONE who can not provide a stable and consistent upbringing for a PUPPY would likely not be considered suitable for a PUPPY by many breeders.

Depends on their 'backup' plans and the stage of their career. I know a lots of military members with dogs. Most have family or a back up of some sort that can care for their animals in their absence. Asking about their backup plans would be one of the questions I would be asking and it would depend so much on the individual situation. A single person early in their career who can not provide a stable environment due to frequent deployment may be different from someone who has a family and/or is later in their career and likely to be more stable in their postings.

Yes, it is different from your first example as a breeder will generally have a stable community of known dogs (with a known health and behaviour history), not an ever changing one so the risk for a young dog is lessened, particularly when it comes to contracting illness. Most breeders will also establish a routine for young dogs which is consistent rather than chopping and changing that routine from week to week. In regards to your second example, just because some other situations are worse, does not mean that another situation is 'best' or even 'right' for a pup just because it may be considered 'better' on a sliding scale.

I should note that I am a snob within the purebred community as well as there are many pure breeds I would not own (so Golden Retriever and Border Collie people can call me a snob too :D ) (and please dont tell our 12 year old GSDx currently sleeping behind my chair that he is 'not good enough' either :laugh: )

An adult dog may adapt. But I would be concerned about a pup on a number of levels. Socialisation and training for one during the important formative weeks and months (Kennel staff are good, but they simply dont have the time to devote to a pup - this is not their job) and the switching and changing would be very unsettling in particular for one so young. House training may not be easy and the pup may find settling into a routine difficult. There is also the possibility of bad habits being learnt at the kennel (barking etc) at a formative age. Going from an environment with lots of dogs to one where they are the only dog each week may potentially set the pup up for problems with anxiety etc. This sort of chopping and changing may prove a real challenge when trying to give the pup a good start and is not a situation I would want a young pup going into. Exposure to illness while young is another - is she going to take holidays for the first month or two while the pup is at its most vulnerable? (kennel environments with their changing population are far from ideal for young vulnerable pups and some kennels may not even accept a young pup). the risk of contracting kennel cough/parvo etc will be considerably greater in a kennel environment for a pup.

Would people rent it? YES!!!

Same with mine. It was the French mountain farmers who were the mainstay of my breed. It did have its wealthy supporters too in later years, but it has always maintained strong roots and association with 'lowly farmers'.

And I wonder how many of these folks were first in line to get an ipad.......

I think they would be well booked mirawee :laugh: I do have a pretty good camping setup, so may just end up using that. With two big fluffy dogs I should certainly be toasty warm. But as I was going to be travelling down one day and back home the next day I didn't fancy trying to set up a tent in the dark for one night only. Just call me a woos :laugh: Though it is looking to be the easy option at the moment :laugh:

Even with a large car, large dogs don't have much room particularly if I bring more than one (no way even one crate for one of my dogs could be erected in my car :laugh: ). Yes, a new van would be nice and is on the wish list (and I refuse to own a trailer as I personally simply don't feel comfortable having my dogs travel in them for a range of reasons based on the experiences of others in my breed - interesting that they are banned in the US) My dogs are used to travelling and used to being with me in hotel rooms etc. I sleep better too if they are chilling in the room with me, and so do they (rather than guarding their territory in the car all night from every small movement like a good LGD - in the room which is not their territory they are quiet). I wan't them to perform well, so I make sure they are treated well according to what I feel works well for us. If other people don't mind having their dogs outside when travelling that is up to them - but my dogs, my call.

Thanks for the offer. Was bringing 1, maybe two dogs. No dog trailer. Does seem that there is only one place that allows the dogs inside for short term stays (everywhere else is beachhouse type accommodation and requires booking for more than one night - I only want to be there one night.) Looks like It will be tent or nothing :laugh: Will have to make sure I book well ahead of time in future if I ever want to show in Vic. For now I may just have to place it in the 'too hard' basket and give it a miss

Only 15mins from the park is www.wsternportpark.com - 6 lumeah rd Somerville ph 03 5977 3344. Beautiful quiet setting all sort of cabin / van accommodation, give this a try you have nothing to loose! It is off the beaten track, so not many know about it. I live just around the orner from it, seriously only 10 - 15 min away Good luck. They will allow dogs, but not inside the cabins/vans unfortunately

As I have said (twice now) they are fully booked! Rude much? People are offering you solutions to try and help you. You have said that the Kingston Motel is fully booked. I guess that is the same as the Discovery Caravan Park, but not everyone would know that. Apologies. Just frustrated. Thanks to all who have offered options. Seems that true 'dog friendly' short term accommodation around Melbourne is not that common. Made even more obvious after just getting back from the US where dogs in hotel rooms were generally welcome and not a big deal. I do much prefer to have the dogs in the room with me rather than sleep in the car (no trailer). Tents aren't all that much fun in winter either :laugh:

First thing though would be to check the regs re requirements in regard to DNA testing for dual sired litters to ensure that whatever testing you get done is accepted (no use doing them yourself if they require an 'acredited collector' to do the testing etc). From memory both sires must also be DNA tested. Then it is a matter of choosing a company that fulfils these requirements. there are a number out there that do it and price does vary from what I have seen. Best Idea once you have established what needs to be done would be to contact a few and discuss procedure/costs with them. (and note that the cheapest may not necessarily be the best option - got burned by that before as I have mentioned in previous threads on DNA testing)

As I have said (twice now) they are fully booked!

A bit of warm water or low salt broth in the food is not going to matter. With veggies, you puree them to break down the cell walls. Cooking does the same thing. Just as with our food 'nutrient loss' is caused by over cooking (as most of the good stuff is thrown away in the water). You will not lose any nutrients if you are just adding some hot water to the food to heat it up a little. Besides, veggies are an 'optional extra' anyway. You can bring RMB's to room temperature (I generally leave them out for the day to thaw in a container in cooler weather so they have generally reached room temp by feeding time anyway). Or put them in a bag in some hot water for a while to bring the temp up. Mine dont really mind them cold, or even frozen, if that is how they come though so I personally dont go to any effort (only enough to separate them if I have forgotten to thaw).

This just takes the cake....err...loaf

Bet that is you booked in for the June long weekend? I have left it way too late to book it seems. I know I should have done it before I went overseas and not 'forgotten' it till I got back.... Looks like I may have to freeze in a tent At least I will have the dogs to keep me warm :laugh:

Hi Take a look at www.lillydalekc.com web page that has a link to GREAT accommodation near KCC Park Chers David B Yes the Carrum Downs one is great, but as I mentioned their dog friendly rooms are fully booked. And the Frankston one doesn't allow dogs in the rooms.

Can anyone suggest dog friendly accommodation (other than the Kingston motel at Carrum Downs) near KCC park in Vic? Must allow dogs in the room. Kingston motels dog friendly rooms are fully booked for the night I want

Yes, there are agreements like that out there (I have/am doing something similar though not exactly the same) and from my experience not that uncommon (though you may find that you are paying all vet costs if you are having the litter under your own prefix and only giving one pup back - you may be able to negotiate if the litter is to be registered under the breeders prefix and you are doing all the work). Sometimes an agreement will only run for one litter, sometimes for more. Naturally it will depend on what the breeder wants to offer and that may depend on how well they know you and what their own needs are and what their situation is.

I think 'breeders terms' can be quite different in many different situations probably the most relevant being whether you as the owner will be breeding the bitch yourself (under your own prefix) or whether it is the breeder who will be having the litter (under their prefix). Of course there are so many variations even within these two groups and what is agreed is something that needs to be negotiated between the two parties. Bottom line is if you don't feel comfortable with the deal, you don't agree to it (and dont agree to it thinking that you can change something later if you want to). I have found co-ownership 'breeders terms' agreements to be useful (and I do agree that for breeders terms agreements, co-ownership is best. Doing the lease paperwork really isnt that onerous) and I do own a bitch of another breeder on breeders terms. I know of quite a range of different breeders terms type arrangements in my breed, particularly overseas and from what I have heard and seen many are very beneficial to both parties. I know of some breeders that have a whole group of dedicated pet, breeder and show homes who have co-owned their dogs on breeders terms (some with multiple dogs over the years) and both benefit greatly from the deal. I saw some of this at a recent specialty show in the US - it was so great to see breeders with their 'entourage' of happy pet owners whose dogs (or the offspring of their dogs) were there for the show. It was clear that the breeders looked after them and they in return looked after the breeders. Without them many breeders really couldn't have the comprehensive and successful breeding programs that they do and it is what has helped many breeders get to the 'top'. So really the MOST important thing though is first and foremost you have a good relationship with the other party. Without it, nothing will ever work. Second is that you put EVERYTHING in writing. Sit down and go through every contingency you can think of - all the 'what if's'. Some of these might include: What if the pup doesnt turn out suitable; what if it doesnt pass the health tests (what is considered to be a 'pass' on health tests too); who pays for tests; who pays for showing if the pup is to be shown - and is there an agreement on the dog being titled if possible as a requirement?; where will the bitch be when she is pregnant/whelps/raises the pups; Who's prefix will the breeding take place under; Who pays breeding related vet bills; who chooses or has the final say on the stud dog; what if she doesn't concieve; how many litters are covered by the agreement; what if the bitch dies as a result of breeding; how many (live at how many hours/days after whelping) pups constitute a litter; if you are having the litter what does the breeder get back (first pick of all/first pick of bitches or dogs only, second pick of whatever after you have chosen one to keep yourself etc); do you pay nothing for the bitch upfront in return for a puppy back, or do you pay for the bitch but the breeder gets to pick but must pay a set price for the pup in return (e.g. money back when they get a pup), or is some other cost agreed; at what time does the contract end? - after one litter, if it is decided the bitch will not be bred for a particular reason and is desexed etc; also what happens if the bitch is desexed without agreement of the breeder (i.e. just because you want to rather than a set reason) - is there any compensation to be paid to the breeder. And whatever else you think of depending on the individual arrangement being considered. Don't be afraid to discuss it! (and if it can't be discussed upfront that is probably a good indication that the arrangement may not work in the long run). A good upfront agreement is liberating, NOT restrictive. It may sound like a lot, but imo it really is a good idea to agree to these things and write them down - even if some of it it is an agreed and initialled (by both parties for each question/answer) Q&A attached as an annex to the main contract and referred to in the contract as being part of the terms agreed. By discussing it upfront you are taking the guesswork out of the agreement, both parties know where they stand and they can get on with enjoying the dogs the way you want to. JMHO

Depends on the breed. Also their activity levels and how they are kept (what sort of surface they are kept on, how often they get wet/dirty, allowed to run in brush? etc etc). And diet as mentioned. Generally though I use Plush Puppy Seabreeze Oil as a rinse and find that has really helped maintain coat quality. I do most of my grooming as bathing/blowdrying rather than actual brushing. The quality of your grooming tools can also affect coat breakage too - good quality brushes with polished tips and combing through rather than using dematters etc will help reduce coat breakage. Also never brush a completely dry coat - always use a spray of some kind when brushing.

Only with my express permission beforehand. I have some dogs I don't want mixing even with my own other dogs as they don't get on. Just because they come from the same household, and are in runs next to each other, does not mean they may necessarily be run together in the same exercise area. I also have entire dogs. The kennel staff don't know my dogs and their likley reactions to others - and while I try to make things clear on check in I would NOT be happy if an entire bitch was mixed by kennel staff with other dogs and she happened to go into season early or have a silent season while boarded. I am also not confident of the experience level of some kennel staff and the level of supervision they would get when in exercise areas with other dogs. Sure it may all go fine, but frankly I don't want someone taking that risk with my dogs, who they do not know, without my permission, when under their care.