Kavik

When I use a clicker, I am usually shaping. So I think you are trying to train the way you have before, but adding a clicker. What you need to do is change the way you think about your training. You are showing them/helping them in what you want them to do at the moment. What the clicker is great for is teaching them how to figure out what you want them to do without you showing them. At the beginning, when you haven't done it before, it is difficult and frustrating, as they may not want to offer many behaviours, just safe ones (like drop for you) which they know gets paid. I would start with something simple like targeting, which gives them something external to focus on and is pretty obvious, unlike lifting a leg. If they drop, ignore it or move a bit so they stand up, reset them. When I started teaching my dogs to walk backwards, Zoe and Diesel only wanted to offer drop at first (Diesel still tends to a little bit, he is slower to catch on with shaping than the others). I just moved so they got up, and rewarded any leg movement. Reward increments of improvement. Eg targeting - reward looking at the target (can be your hand, lid of a container, etc), then reward moving towards the target, then reward touching the target (within a time frame, not all in the same session).

I'm so sorry Ruth

I think running contacts are more popular overseas than here because you have to actually place for it to count towards your title (Greg Derrett said something to that effect) so speed really counts. In Australia as long as you come in under SCT you qualify and it counts towards title. I would love my own equipment to improve my contacts but at the moment just not feasible! So expensive and takes up so much space. I do have a seesaw.

I have definitely seen more GSPs at agility than Pointers They are lovely dogs!

I've met some pretty rude Beagles.

I've also noticed Kelpies and BCs seem to get along together in general. Certainly Kaos prefers other Kelpies to other breeds. They don't tend to body slam in play, prefer a bit more space (though Kaos will body slam and play rough with Diesel, but that is more Diesel's style of play. He won't with any other dog).

Cool, that makes sense.

Just read the ANKC rules on contacts and to me it reads as missing a contact is a fault, not disqualification.

The second one is definitely a fault. Not sure about the first one.

I put the ones I am not working away. Either behind a gate (I have a few different sections in my yard) or in their crates inside if it is raining.

2o2o is 2on2off - where the dog has two feet on the ground (front) and two feet on the equipment (back) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AswoQlwp8jk

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On another forum I am on they were discussing NDTF and it appears there are some politics. Not surrounding training methods as far as I know, but other stuff.

From what I've researched it looks very difficult to get accurate running contacts. Not just for the dog to be accurate, but you also have to be very good at watching and when they are going that fast it is hard to see Also from what I have seen with friends the difference in ANKC and ADAA sized equipment makes it difficult. Even the 'professionals' miss their running contacts sometimes in competition! It is Sylvia Trkman http://www.silvia.trkman.net/

Zoe came to me to teach me how important genetics is in dog behaviour, what to do (and what not to do) with a difficult dog and give me empathy for other owners with difficult dogs Diesel came to me to teach me to appreciate dogs with good health!, about allergies in dogs, how it feels to own a dog that enjoys playing with other dogs, and that I actually did enjoy the Kelpie spunk after all. Kaos came to me to show me what good breeding produces, to put into practice what I have learned along the way, to help me achieve my goal of competing with my dogs and to learn to trust again.

I used to go with Diesel, before I gave up my hopes of competing with him due to allergies. Western Suburbs has two sections as far as I know - pet dog training on Saturdays and competition obedience/trialling class on Tuesday evenings. The pet class is run by Delta trained instructors, the Tuesday evening class by people who currently compete with their dogs in obedience, so the classes are very different in terms of structure, content, style and equipment used. I went to the Tuesday class and really enjoyed it. They are a lovely bunch of people who are experienced competitors so happy to help with trialling issues but also flexible enough if you want to try something different (I was being a bit experimental when I went there as Diesel is the first dog I attempted to train for competition obedience. They were tolerant of me trying different stuff and doing things differently.) It is also quite social and there were cakes when dogs got their titles etc.

I did the NDTF course in 2000 Was a great way to start learning about dog training methodology and terminology. I did it before distance learning was offered (I went to Melbourne for all the seminars/lectures and was able to do prac in Sydney). I have worked with dogs since, but not much as a trainer. Mostly as animal attendant/dog daycare attendent/groomer/vet nurse etc with some training on the side within the business I worked for at the time. I have also done volunteer instructing. Training is difficult to get into and if you work for someone else you will have to use their methods (difficult if it conflicts a lot with the method you would like to use). I have been tossing up starting my own business for a while now but I don't know much about running a business so a bit hesitant. Do you have a dog at the moment? Taking your dog to classes and getting to a high level in a club is a good way to get experience training and also a good way to lead into instructing at your club. I have instructed at 3 clubs on a volunteer basis, very good to help you learn how to help people train their dogs. Competing with your dog will show that you can accomplish polished work in a distracting environment. There are a lot of dog sports to choose from. Another thing that helps with experience is to volunteer at a shelter/rescue organisation. This gives you experience with a wide range of dogs that probably have had little training and may have behavioural problems.

Actually, some people who are knowledgeable in working breeds have offered to come and assess the dog, as far as I know without payment. Stuff has been going on behind the scenes to try and help this dog. Not sure now that it has been placed on gumtree though.

In Australia the cleats are only at the top. In the USA they go all the way down

send her a PM I am sure she will be happy to answer any questions

I would look into herding guy or Vickie (if she wants to help) They have experience with working dogs (herding guy has Kelpies, Vickie has Border Collies and experience with Kelpies) and will be able to help determine whether the dog can be rehabilitated.

Ah, cool. I bet the cadetship doesn't come up very often though!

I think that is to be an Orientation and Mobility Instructor (which I hear pays more than Guide Dog Trainers). Guide Dog Trainers can be recruited internally or on occasion, through cadetships. But the competition is fierce. Yeah that is the name of the course! Unless it has changed since I last checked, you needed to be an Orientation and Mobility Instructor to be a Guide Dog Trainer as you have to teach the new owners and transition them to using a Guide Dog as well. And be well versed in other mobility aids such as canes etc. Just being a dog trainer was not enough. You have to be able to deal with the people too.

I agree that a behaviourist would be a good idea. An idea to help get them to come to you - only feed from your hand for now. Really yummy good stuff (cooked chicken often works well). No meals from bowls for a while.

To work as a trainer for Guide Dogs you need a degree in helping people with vision problems (not sure of the name of degree). I checked that idea out too Plus I seem to be on the wrong end of Sydney - training positions seem to come up on the other end