Pjrt

I know Pet Network have belly bands under the "clean up, stain,odour" tab. But sorry I can't post a link

Sheridan I had a thought .....if it's your boy that isn't clicking with free house time and toileting, I would probably employ a belly band. It will be a bit of a trick with a youngster not to think it's a toy or an annoyance to be ripped off, and your girl might want to try to get it off him....... But I reckon it would stand a very good chance of helping you complete his toilet training. Once he is out of his crate or pen, some outside time, and even if he pees outside before you bring him in, put the belly band on for all free running indoor time. If he pees it will just get soaked into the pad in the belly band and you won't have to clean up, and a lot of boys just click once they have the band, as trying to pee with it on just isn't as much fun! Even in the small possibility that he takes a long time to get inside toilet training, at least you won't have ongoing mess. For some boys the belly bands just seem to work like magic. They can be ordered from some doggy pet places but I can't add a link from this device. can someone else do that for us??

Ugh, none of this bullshit can or will be policed properly. None of it will make more than a token change to animal welfare. All it will do is put more pressure and expense on the great breeders doing everything well already. plus take away their rights to decide what they know is best for their dogs. And stop new hobby breeders coming into the world of pedigree dogs. The only measureable outcome will be less hobby breeders with pedigree dogs and more factory farming of dogs in general, because the one running it as big business will be the only ones financially equipped to tick all the boxes.

Too be honest, as I'm sure you're aware, the health of the remaining eye would be my priority.

It's not something I would personally consider for my own dog (the prosthesis that is) unless it was very strongly advised as necessary by the vet. I'm not aware of any of the Pirates I've known injuring their socket or face post removal. I'm really interested to see if someone here has experience with the prosthetic now !

I have known dozens of dogs through eye injury/disease who have eventually had the eye removed. In every single case the dogs has been so much better off and recovered perfectly. None I've ever known have had a prosthetic eye though. It all looks a bit awful at the time of surgery but once healed and the shaved area has grown in, they just look like their winking at you :)

I was employed for 3.5 years as a kennel hand in a very large breeding and show kennel back in the 80's, and at another short term in the 90's. Both kennels were well known esteemed show and breeding kennels. Both had multiple staff. They both had a few breeds, and both bred at least more than 10 litters a year. Their dogs were impeccably well cared for and bred amazing examples of their breeds. Dogs that are still remembered and held in high regard today, and are still present on contemporary pedigrees. I was so lucky to get such an opportunity to see these things done properly from a fly on the wall perspective.

This this and more of this ^ the whole 'kennel' concept is pretty modern in the big scheme of things. But The version we mostly think of today of concrete, steel and wire kennels and runs belongs in a bygone era. It just makes me shake my head that people who know little think that such a sterile environment is good for dogs/puppies health, both mental and physical.

I deal daily with the pointy end of pet shop and BYB dogs. The vast majority of our grooming client base are just that. Its a rare week to see even a couple of pure breed dogs, and even rarer that those pure breed dogs are from ANKC registered breeders, as in, a Schnauzer can obviously be only a schnauzer, but not be from a ANKC breeder. I've been dealing with this situation for 29 yrs. In the early days back in the late 80's into the early 90's the sale of pups in pet shops was no where near as prolific as it is now, and they were still just byb pure breeds and mutts for the most part. the designer dog with the designer name started moving in during the mid 90's and has taken off at light speed. They now make up the vast majority of my client base. I have to say, back in the 80's and 90's I dealt with a lot of mutts with terrible temperaments. I separate temperament from behaviour. Behaviour is something that can be shaped and changed somewhat. Temperament is more inherent and is almost impossible to change. These days I deal with, for the most part, cross breed dogs with delightful temperaments. Some of them have behaviour issues, but nothing I cannot deal with, even though putting them under fairly intense duress with extreme and up close handling. They are just 'naughty' dogs as a result of owner action/in-action, not inherently bad dogs with poor nerve etc. I find the swing to cotton wool dogs quite disturbing. In days past, i suppose in a time when most dogs were bred for purpose and were tested for purpose, wishy washy temperaments were weeded out pretty fast. less than desirable physical attributes were also frowned upon and culled. Now we see breeders spending thousands to keep the runt alive and sell it at a reduced price to some poor bugger that will love it do death despite it bringing little else than expense and heartbreak. It makes me so angry that society seems to accept, even embrace, less than best. ETA...... I guess I got a bit OT here, but in the end I guess what I am trying to say is as far as breeding goes, focus on breeding dogs of inherently sound body and mind will always trump whether the result leaves the breeder at 6, 7, 8, 12 weeks.

The other thing that sticks out from this story for me is that for $2300 the family could have purchased an incredibly well bred dog from an ANKC registered breeder. So sad and maddening that the general public are not informed enough and can be misled like this.

I mentioned this very issue just today in the thread about cat and dog laws in SA. The PIAA member stores can quite legitimately tell puppy buyers that their puppies are sourced from 'registered breeders'. They actually encourage their member stores to source their pups from legal, registered, accredited, large scale breeding operations. Accredited by whom? Oh, that's right, The PIAA. It seems there needs to be a bit more policing. Just on a personal level, I refuse to attend or compete at grooming competitions that are sponsored by the PIAA (which is most of them). I have told my fellow groomers time and time again that supporting the PIAA in any approximation is supporting puppy farming.....the one thing groomers universally decry....... but obviously the egos and ribbons are worth more than taking a little stand against commercial scale dog breeding.

I am talking from experience! I ran a rescue shelter for a couple of years and have personally nursed quite a few dogs through some major & minor dental procedures. Often done on the same day as desexing, even adding removal of benign lumps and other stuff to the days proceedings. Some of the dogs I have nursed through dental extraction have had massive infection load and needed most teeth removed, sutures to the gums you name it. Every single one that I remember cruised through all of it with no after effects or ongoing pain issues. If you went to the emergency vet for a check up, what possible problem could that cause? you have the absolute right to consent to what does or doesn't happen. It is a worry that you have had a poor experience with a vet practice. I think yes, you need to look around for some out of hours options that you are comfortable with. In a perfect world we will always see the vet we want, but doggies have a habit of pulling a stunt on us at crazy hours on public holidays etc! Even at your regular vet, if the one you like is on holidays, you need to know you have somewhere else to turn. Keep an eye on little Manix. I hope everything goes ok tonight and you can get some answers tomorrow.

It seems to me that the pet shop environment is the bigger problem. Puppies who go from a breeder directly into a home between 6 -8 weeks would stand a much better chance of exposure to novelties than one put in a glass box at 6-8 weeks. I still believe that 6-8 weeks thing has lesser bearing on the outcome for the adult dog than the actions and in-actions of the owner.

Oh dog yes! Out here in the rural environment the poor old ranger has to issue and police everything from parking notices to controlled burn notices and camping licenses. I was actually thinking about quitting salon life and applying for the local ranger position out here until I found out that it has very little to do with animal management. If it were a dedicated animal management position i'd be all over it as a second career.

I don't think it is for anyone here to tell you yes or no to the vet now, for certain. We can only advise based on what we read here, what we think, and how we think we would act in the same/similar situation. Personally I would want to know that his vitals and temp are normal, and that his mouth has been thoroughly examined. Better to be too safe now than for him to crash with a real emergency in the middle of the night. At least atm he may only need a reassuring (for you) check up until you can see your regular vet tomorrow. If he crashed during the night then you will have to rely on the emergency vet for critical care. Only you can make this decision though.

Its such a big huge topic with so many things to factor in and think about. The miore one thinks about it, the more your head feels like exploding! As far as looking at new dog and cat laws, i really think the primary focus needs to be on the actions and in-actions of the actual pet owner. To me it is the actions and in-actions of the actual pet owner that have the biggest bearing on the outcomes of health and welfare for the animals in their care. That is not to say that other parts of the supply & demand chain don't need attention too.

Correct except that regs and by laws push breeders to keep them in such conditions. Give breeders the choice and there isn't anyone who I know that would choose to have kennels more suited to pound dogs in their back yard. We have had members who own half a dozen small breed dogs which have always lived inside with puppies whelped in the spare bedroom who have been forced to build kennels and go into debt in order to breed dogs from their properties to comply with codes. Spend more on infrastructure to comply and you need to breed more puppies to get back your money. make small breeders have to be inspected and licenced so they cant breed their dogs in their home without all the crap more suited to a massive commercial breeder and all we will do is run out those who we want to encourage. yes, that is exactly it, what I was trying to say!

Steve I agree with you on that first paragraph, with the exception that it has become quite legal to breed, dogs especially, wholesale volume style. Everything is fine and legal with it, but we still have the dogs living in a wharehoused environment and i dont think that can ever be justified. And your right. We seem to live in an age of breeder bashing. I also think health and welfare outcomes for the adult dog are rarely wholly or partially stemming from breeder practices. For me the paramount area of concern is not as much the supply, but the responsibility of pet ownership, by the actual owners.

How long since he had the teeth out? 5 or 6 days? Anecdotally from stories my clients tell me, and first hand from many rescue dogs needing dentals and extractions, I would have expected your little guy to sail through and be back to normal or better. If you feel he has pain, i am assuming you mean mouth pain? , that doesn't sound right to me starting so many days out from the surgery. I'd be worried there is infection or something? I'd perhaps get off to the vet to at least check temperature, heart rate, and a thorough examination of his mouth. etc.

Further to my above post..... I am even willing to concede that stopping private surrenders to pounds and shelters may have a pretty shitty outcome for the current generation of pets, possibly even the next. I don't want to see pets needlessly abandoned, surrendered or PTS. No one does. But we need a radical change to the shelter mindset. A generational change. A change that will one day see people looking back with alarm at 'how it used to be'. We won't get major generational change of mindset while we tiptoe around big issues and pitterpatter about changing and adding existing laws that are proving generations over that they are next to useless in obtaining better animal welfare outcomes..... and all the while, regulating 'the good guys' (the old fashioned back yard registered breeder with quality animals and the incentive to keep creating quality animals).... out of existence.

Yes one point I strongly agree on is looking at ways to reduce profit incentives for wholesale dog breeding. But then while we have places like the PIAA encouraging their member stores to only supply puppies from big shiny registered properly regulated wholesale dog breeding facilities....... ETA..... and it's all the nice new regulations that have infact allowed such big shiny registered properly regulated wholesale dog breeding facilities to flourish

I'm saying people shouldn't be able to surrender their pet to a shelter because I believe firstly that less people would need to if their was far better pro active education and support pre and post purchase, and that a privately owned pet should be re homed privately if it is a normal well adjusted animal that can be rehomed, or yes, PTS privately if it isnt a rehoming prospect for health or temperament reasons. The animals that should end up at shelters should be unclaimed strays, and genuine cases of welfare issues such as deceased estate animals that have no options, and cases such as where the owner has had a medical situation leaving them unanble to properly care for the pet, and genuine neglect, abandonment and cruelty cases. Pounds and shelters have become a convenience in our throw away society. It needs to stop. I'm not saying that halting surrenders to shelters will solve everything, but it will make people realise that there is not an easy bin to dump their pet in when it becomes a mild inconvenience for whatever reason. I know it sounds radical but I really think it's worth consideration as part of a radical shake up of animal welfare outcomes. Another thing that I find incredible is that we probably know more statistically about a sheep from paddock to plate, or a native Hopping Mouse from sale to death, than we know about the dogs and cats in our own home.

This is what resonates the most with me.

Or too many systems and no community. Yes I guess that is a better way of saying it. Several systems of registering and tracking domestic animals but they are parallel to each other. No cohesion.

Perhaps one of the hugest problems for domestic animal welfare is that there isn't actually a system.