ness

Looks really good huski. Daisy doesn't look to hesitant with the metal at all. Ness took much longer then that before she was really happy to pick it up. Good work.

I have an off-cut of fake grass I have been considering using for article training rather than the girls door mat .

Go Izzi - maybe you should sack your handler .

Mats are optional Daisy. Some dogs find it easier to pick up the articles off the mat. Interesting neither of mine are great at metals inside. Ness I gave up playing inside for a long time until I had made the decision to trial her at the Adelaide royal which is indoors and on carpet) so then went on to sort out the picking it up off the carpet issue with her. It was effecting her confidence big time and she was struggling so much I just decided to avoid it until she was better at the game. Kenz is similar - she can't get her metals up off the floor inside yet so I am not worrying and will stick to outside sessions with her on metals until I feel a need to resolve it. Considering we trial outside anyway its no real big deal. I also know with Kenz at the moment she needs a certain length grass before she will persist to pick it up so I am trying to make it as easy as possible. That means we can't train on the back lawn at present because its a dust bowl. A friends sheltie has real issues getting the articles up off the grass but is better with the mat so she always uses a mat.

Good point caffy. Maybe I might do some more work on her leather pick ups. Will spend a day or so sorting that out and then come back to scent work. Not like I don't have plenty of time - she still has such a way to go before I can get her into a novice ring. Trying to fill in the waiting game with other exercises. Her Novice would be so very very close if it wasn't for that one major hole . Ah well no rush she will get there when she is well and truely ready.

Games to play when its wet - pouring with rain outside so I thought I'd have a go at find the seekback article inside the house with Kenz. She is loving the game. Thinks its the best game on the planet. You hide the article and she goes racing off to find it and comes racing back with it. Question - those of you with multiple dogs do you find it better to have different seekback articles for the dogs or do you just use the same one. Would that change if you had a dog who exhibited some signs of possessiveness over items. And this isn't meant to be a power question about ownership all my training toys are kept away when we aren't training.

Yep Ptolomy just started out with doing leathers only. No metals or woods in the equation. She just thinks leather article = must retrieve anything. Although I am just about to order some more leathers as I have a funny feeling she might kill a few of my leathers with wanting to chew the bloody things before we get to far in the training. As I said its kicking her into retrieve over drive .

Not how more like when Ptolomy. My first attempt at the leather was a serious no go. When I tried just before she seemed to want to go into retrieve over drive rather than scenting. Compared to her nice methodical approach she has shown with the metal and woods yesterday it was like there was no brain. We did some straight fetching but definitely getting more snatch and grab attempts rather than sniffing. Maybe the fact that the weather is shitty and she hasn't had a walk today might explain part of it. I had to play indoors. We had one attempt where she sniffed an incorrect one and then went and got the correct one but other than that it was grab the first leather she came across. Is it worth continuing to play with metals and woods for a few more days. I am not sure if I have just rushed the whole process and if she really doesn't understand what I am after yet. The video yesterday shows she is understanding the sniffing element but not sure.

Any thoughts on when to introduce leather into the scent discrimination equation?

Any time Rivsky. Probably one of my better videoing efforts .

Yep Rivsky did get her round on video and it actually filmed this time :D .

Well done Jess and DSO .

:D geez you must have just beat me home Rivsky - way to go Riv .

Tiggy - yes not a particularly good tail for an agility dog - gotta blame Winpara for that - just stirring her tail looks great for obedience and HTM when its flying. Hmmm me thinks I might be doing a trim job before her first agility trial .

Er that came out rather wrong sounding . Ok I have 3 special sets which I rotate for trialling and now also ring work at club. Ness gets these sets as I know she isn't about to decide to chew up my woods or leathers . Not sure I can trust Kenzie totally yet so she gets articles out of my training sets. I had another 2 full sets of articles plus assorted extras which were in separate boxes but were amalgamated the other day when I started training Kenz. So now I have a stack of metals all in the one box but still have my woods and leathers separate. So the box I was using with Kenz is my box of assorted metals - so has 2 sets of metals in it plus a set of woods and a set of leathers. We have only been playing with metal really so far. I had my scented article placed back in the box - I was using a number 1 article to scent and had 2,3,4 and 5 from both boxes out in the pile. I placed my number 1 article back in the box when I left them out airing and I wasn't particularly careful to make sure I was using the number 1 article that I used last time. For all I know it could have been the other number 1 article since they both look identical. Hmmm does that clarify things any.......

Wow that was quick here is a link to the video from our session - http://www.youtube.com/profile?user=ness#p/u/0/7f4LEbMCtOQ

Just in the process of uploading a Kenzie scent session from about 10 minutes ago. I think she well and truely has the game. Pretty chuffed with her - not bad for a dog who use to decide that picking up metal was all too difficult and would resort to barking at me in frustration. Still got work to do on her picks up before I will be happy but she is a long way out of the ring at any level never mind trialling in UD. What I was also impressed about was when I bought her back after having a session with Ness she didn't then go stupid on me but continued the game. She remained focused even with a car driving past. Little things which a seasoned dog wouldn't get distracted by but its pretty easy for a baby dog to be distracted by even the smallest things when they are learning. I have been using the same metal article but it has been stored with all the others in the box. I made no deliberate attempt to food scent the articles either. I am still setting it up so that the first attempt is still more or less a retrieve. Mostly as she is still reluctant with her metal pick ups. She had no issue when I selected a new wood out of my box to scent and send her for it the first time though. If anybody else has started and its taking a while don't get frustrated I remember nearly tearing my hair out when I first taught Ness with countless emails to Ptolomy saying she doesn't get it, not sure she ever will. But guess what the penny did eventually drop . I do chuckle at the difference though. Ness use to always try and work her article piles at a million miles an hour - still does (hmm might get around to uploading her couple of attempts from today later). Kenz is much more methodical and careful.

I have 6 sets of knurled and 1 set of plain - never used my plain ones. Neither kid likes them so will just stick with the knurled ones .

Sorry Vickie - misunderstanding yep agree you are improving what you didn't like in dog number 1 and the thing I didn't like about dog 1 is the lack of an on-switch or an on-switch on her turns so I did everything to encourage an on-switch - yep I encouraged it when the dog asked but I also asked for it when the dog didn't ask. I don't think its totally about letting the dog call the shots. If it was something that annoyed or frustrated me then I guess that would be different but its not interfering so I think its fine in the present situation and when it annoys me enough to change it then I would sort it out. I know I don't have all the answers and if I can have a half good dog the second time around I'll be happy. Its all about enjoying the dog for who they are and yep the fact that Kenz is always up for something and always wants to interact with me is what Ness isn't. And fortunately or unfortunately depending on which way you look at it (mostly unfortunately as I would dearly like to have more of a life but I don't) so I have the time to give into Kenz's demands . Hmmm think I am getting myself into hot water here - were is the phone a friend lifeline option when you need it. Maybe I can sum it up in a nutshell - picture of what you want in your mind, not sure if the dog will get there so you do everything within your power to encourage what behaviors you think might get the dog there - clear as mud but hey I am still learning. Maybe if I had a dog who was obviously showing signs of being high drive I might have put the limits in earlier but when they aren't a natural you encourage what you want. Ok think I am just confusing the situation and obviously I will leave this topic to those more experienced with dogs who have had some element of success.

Vickie - yep thats what I said its the fear of not which drove me to create a situation and any dog is quick to jump on training you to respond in a certain manner. That fear has lessened now so I only initiate the games when I want to but it took me a while to quit worrying so much about it. Easy when you have one dog who is already how you want it and have a handle on what you should be doing. Not so easy when you have a dog who you don't like how they are and wish to put in place modifications the subsequent time around.

Won't be able to make the 18th - Kenz's agility trial debut - but hope to catch up with some of you at the Steve Courtney Seminar in May.

Yep and I will be honest and say I did create what I have with Kenz. I was very worried I'd have a BC a bit like Ness who only had an on-switch when it suited them so deliberately spent all of Kenz's puppyhood setting about creating a dog who was always on . If she wanted action she got action. I was fortunate enough to spend the time at home with her so we would have multiple sessions a day of anything some of which were initiated by her and some of them initiated by me. I would also give in to her demands to do stuff so long as she was always willing to play when I wanted her to as well. I know there is a happy medium (maybe by dog 3) but give me a dog who is always on then one that needs motivating all the time any day of the week. I do think though that its possibly easier to establish an off-switch then an on-switch so would still probably encourage a Kenzie type dog through puppyhood and then work about establishing an off-switch when I have a dog who needs one . I think I did over compensate for the things I didn't have in Ness though.

Not sure Seita - I have played a combination of dog scout and find the article in the long grass. Kenz not being foodie doesn't seem to care about the food scent or not. But Kenz also isn't testing each article. Even though she has only been playing a couple of days - she is happy to sniff all the articles but only make an effort to grab the correct one. I am not sure if is because she has been reluctant to fetch metal so its slowed her down enough for her to be thinking rather than just grabbing. But when presented with a possible snatch option i.e.a wood in the pile she still was happy to sniff. Will see what happens when I reintroduce the woods. I guess when it comes down to it when I am training with Ness if I have been rewarding various exercises my articles will always have a slight food scent. Its not often that my hands will be totally food scent free. I know she can do them without though because I can prepare her tea and place that in a bowl and reward when we are done. I don't think I really made a huge deal about the food/no food. I know her articles were food scent baited for a while because she was having huge issues and not understanding but I don't actually remember making a conscious decision to remove the food scent. I know a few times she has been struggling I have gone back to using extra smelly treats to reward and while not deliberately baiting the articles with food obviously if I have rewarded a seekback with nice smelling treats then there will still be traces of food scent on my hands when we get to doing articles. Not sure that really answers your question though does it. Just on the picking up - I am not sure thats related to the food thing. I know I had a bit of snatching and grabbing because she wasn't sure and I don't believe that was due to the food. Kenz did it today once when I introduced woods to the pile as well. Went out grabbed the first article she came across but then proceeded to scent the rest of the articles with an article in her mouth until she got to the correct one.

I tend to go back and lure a few with kenz if she gets them wrong or sits to far around and make sure I am rewarding down along my leg and slightly behind.

Awww kiesha they aren't that bad - they just train you well .