Rosetta

The chemists are always trying to subsitute my medications for generic brands...so I am interested in this claim too, that generics are dangerous

Yes I would have thought it was a reasonable question too Sheena. On this forum it seems to depend on who asks it though :) Seen other - milder - claims on other threads receive very aggressive demands for all sorts of documented "proof". I am genuinely interested in further information regarding this - as most would be. Though apparently if you have not discovered it for yourself you are not allowed to ask about it :D

Advantix is waterproof and has registered claims for that effect also, and there is no need to apply more often if your dog swims everyday.

That's interesting. I got this off the Bayer site.

"

Can a reduction in efficacy be observed in dogs treated with advantix which swim frequently?

To evaluate this, studies were carried out which provided for complete immersion of the dog in water for 60 seconds at weekly intervals.

advantix is distributed over the body surface and remains in the lipid stratum which has hydrophobic properties; like all products of this type it is subject to the impact that the duration of baths has on the animal's skin.

Lengthy and frequent baths involve increased cutaneous exchange with greater dilution of the lipid stratum and a consequent reduction in the concentration of product present in this stratum.

The product remains efficacious even if the animal takes a bath. However, in the case of prolonged and frequent exposure to water, it may be necessary to repeat the treatment more than once a month, up to a maximum of once a week."

from here : http://www.animalhealth.bayer.com/4869.0.html

Look, I like Advantix and I use it and sell it. Im pretty sure you, Nowstarin are the rep for my area (correct me if im wrong). When you visit us next, maybe you can go over this again with us and tell us why it says on the Bayer site that you may need to reapply if your dog swims a lot (this is Coffs, dogs DO swim a lot here)

If that is in fact the case I wish people would disclose that before posting in threads like this. I also would like some evidence that generics are dangerous and produced in dodgy locations as my family - like many others - take generic medications.

You're unable to research yourself? And you don't research before taking something yourself? That's a bit daft.

On second thoughts - this is too childish to respond to.

Advantix is waterproof and has registered claims for that effect also, and there is no need to apply more often if your dog swims everyday.

That's interesting. I got this off the Bayer site.

"

Can a reduction in efficacy be observed in dogs treated with advantix which swim frequently?

To evaluate this, studies were carried out which provided for complete immersion of the dog in water for 60 seconds at weekly intervals.

advantix is distributed over the body surface and remains in the lipid stratum which has hydrophobic properties; like all products of this type it is subject to the impact that the duration of baths has on the animal's skin.

Lengthy and frequent baths involve increased cutaneous exchange with greater dilution of the lipid stratum and a consequent reduction in the concentration of product present in this stratum.

The product remains efficacious even if the animal takes a bath. However, in the case of prolonged and frequent exposure to water, it may be necessary to repeat the treatment more than once a month, up to a maximum of once a week."

from here : http://www.animalhealth.bayer.com/4869.0.html

Look, I like Advantix and I use it and sell it. Im pretty sure you, Nowstarin are the rep for my area (correct me if im wrong). When you visit us next, maybe you can go over this again with us and tell us why it says on the Bayer site that you may need to reapply if your dog swims a lot (this is Coffs, dogs DO swim a lot here)

If that is in fact the case I wish people would disclose that before posting in threads like this. I also would like some evidence that generics are dangerous and produced in dodgy locations as my family - like many others - take generic medications.

This is what was written, I don't know if I am allowed to post the pictures though

Thank you Boronia - how very sad for those poor little dogs. I hope there is some happiness for them now - there are some good people around anyway.

I love these dogs. My neighbour had one and he was a fabulous dog - very calm, good with the kids and you never heard him :)

I haven't got Facebook - was the dog rehomed?

Im sure reactions happen but I have used Advantix on my small dogs, plenty of my grooming clients use it and when vet nursing I didnt ever see, or hear about, a reaction. I think it's a bit OTT to suggest she shouldn't be using it when it is the only truly effective product (IMO) against ticks

Its my opinion - its up to the OP of course but a simple Google search will reveal many such reactions to this product on small breeds. Nothing wrong with providing the information - up to people to make their own decisions. As to it being the only effective product I guess that is a matter of opinion also.

Pre-teen girls will probably respond best to emotive arguments :) Perhaps just say something like "yes, they are lovely and it is tempting to let them have pups BUT you can never be 100% sure that those pups have good homes for life and don't end up in the pound like so many other cute dogs" which at the end of the day is the major concern.

That site for the generic Advantix is a little misleading with the waterproof claim. Even Advantix is only "water proof" if your dog swims less than once a week, and then it recommends treating more often (from the Bayer site).

Would be so good to have a cheaper version to have though. The online stores sell their Advantix for the same price as my work buys it in for! A cheaper version would be awesome.

My dogs swim twice a day, every day & have no trouble with the Advantix. I keep them out of the water for 48 hours after I apply it though. They do get the odd grass tick & they have to be done no later than every 14 days. Cant wait for a generic version to become available in Australia. I am sure what the manufacturers charge for Advantix or Frontline Plus is not reflective of production cost. I know they have high research & development costs but these sort of things have been around for decades for cattle etc.

Advantix is waterproof and has registered claims for that effect also, and there is no need to apply more often if your dog swims everyday.

Re generics:

Advantix is not due off patent for another 3 years in Australia. There is no TRUE generic for it ANYWHERE in the world. The add you linked to has differing quantities than advantix the real one.

Frontline generics are available in australia already. It is sold in supermarkets under a different name now, Also as stated, other brand names have already been registered and are stocked in some pet outlets and online.

Advantix is by far proven more effective than frontline too ie efficacy Advantage family products for fleas is 100% Ticks 98% Frontline Fleas 57% and ticks 52%.

The problem with generics both human and animal, is research and development of products is entirely funded by the major pharma co's. When generic co's jump in and take on active ingredients, package and distribute products they sometimes reduce the amount of ingredients to cost cut under a guise. They also operate under poor conditions in some very dodgy locations.

Also no $ are returned to the originating Pharma Co to fund new research, development, science or projects. How long can the major Co's sustain this? Generics are damaging to health. Cheap is not always best.

Hope this helps

Oh and patents for Pharmacueticals can be up to 16 years.

Do you have any links you can provide around this? I understood that generics carry the exact same active ingredients though other ingredients in generics may vary from the brand names. I am very interested to know more about the dodgy locations in particular.

I would never use Advantix on a small breed dog. There have been widespread reports of adverse reactions in small breeds to this product. If you do a search on here there are a few threads about it.

I feel my dog's ears. If they are cold, I assume he is cold everywhere else. Curling in a ball is another clear sign, as has been mentioned.

Bring on Spring, I say :) Too cold here in Canberra already. My boy got a new fleece coat yesterday in preparation for frosty nights to come (he sleeps on our bed, mind you).

Do some dogs just like to do that though? Mine does it all the time and he definitely is not cold.

I am really interested as to what started all this off - was there any incident that got her offside regarding the dog?

I agree with others about an immediate measure of constructing a run away from that side of the fence - screen the run on that side with mesh as well. You can get fake cameras to attach to the house - if she thinks she is being recorded that may have an effect as she knows you have reported to the police. I don't believe efforts to be friendly work with these types of people - they are not rational.

As to it not being illegal to throw glass in your yard how would the police react if it was a child care centre for instance??

We went away for a week when my puppy was 5.5 months old, and we boarded them. He was fine, didn't affect his training at all. I was mostly worried about his houstraining, with peeing on the floor in the kennel, but it was a non-issue.

Mind you, we found a really good kennel with very competent and caring people. The dogs had access to a play area with a pool every day, and were let out in a grassy run twice a day, and I suspect that because he was a puppy he did get a lot of attention.

I would be interested to know what kennel that is?

Me too - is it in Brisbane?

Must be the season for it - another 12 year old maltese being given away. Great with the kids but the wife has anxiety and thinks the dog may have something to do with it

Poor old thing.

Oh people are doing it all the time - there is another on that site at the moment. A 13 year old maltese because they now have 2 kids. Seriously do they expect to find a good home for such an old dog and how would the dog cope anyway

Sending Gracie positive vibes - such a lot to go through in such a short life poor baby.

I'm one of those people who always leave a collar on my dog when I go out - not chain. Reason being that I worry more about him getting out than the collar getting caught and without the collar I don't know if I would get him back. He is well contained but the unforeseen can happen. High fences and locked gates - except one day one of the gates was left unlocked, "someone" came in that gate and let the dog out. Luckily he didn't stray from the front yard but it did give me a scare.

Please can't we just have some compassion for this poor little dog who suffered so much and its owner who will be affected by this forever I should imagine.

It seems sympathy for old poodles who meet traumatic ends is limited

Questions about what role the owner's actions might have played in the attack does not have a thing to do with sympathy for the poodle.

Comments like the ones above are counter-productive to any conversation that isn't "how sad, terrible bull breed and poor poodle" and to be blunt, trollish.

What a ludicrous statement - are you for real? I don't recall anyone mentioning breed - only you. I don't think you have any sympathy for the little dog killed at all.

I will not read any more of this thread - I can see the way it is going. Some attitudes are just plain disgusting.

Please can't we just have some compassion for this poor little dog who suffered so much and its owner who will be affected by this forever I should imagine.

Here's the SMH version of the story...

http://www.theage.com.au/victoria/poodles-face-ripped-off-in-attack-20130415-2hv8e.html

T.

This report says the little poodle did not put his nose through the fence but that there was a hole.

Here's the SMH version of the story...

http://www.theage.com.au/victoria/poodles-face-ripped-off-in-attack-20130415-2hv8e.html

T.

OMG - that poor baby 18 years old - just wanted to smell the grass. And WHY did the poor thing have to wait for 3 HOURS to be put out of his misery??? Disgusting

Poor little dog - what a way to end its days Chances are the owner was elderly also and not able to react quickly if the little dog veered towards the fence - so sad.

My dog is rarely in the front yard and never without me there - I am surprised at the number of people who bring their dog - and kids - up to the fence to say "hello". I don't allow it.

I think it can be a sign of stress as well - was the dog in unfamiliar surroundings? Perhaps it is not used to being around lots of dogs and people.

Definitely not - I would want to know what I was dealing with first.

Does anyone know what size the Artemis OSoPure kibble is? I am currently feeding TOTW but the kibble is a little too large for a small dog IMO. I would love to find a grain free kibble that is smaller.

Rosetta I don't know about the Artemis, but I've just noticed that in the VIP grain free from Woolies, the chicken variety is rounder and smaller than the game variety. And the westies and my foster (who is smaller) managed both without any problems. Apparently dry food that is a bit bigger is better from a dental point of view because they have to crunch them more and the bigger pieces clean their teeth better. Don't know how true that is but it certainly makes sense to me. And bones are even better!!

Thanks WM - I do have a bag of the VIP and you are right it is a bit smaller but I think it may make him a bit "loose". I did not notice any improvement in Jack's teeth with the larger kibble. He gets a brisket bone occasionally which helps I think but I am a bit paranoid about bones :)