Her Majesty Dogmad

I'm in Sydney but have been asked to help a 6 yr old male Beagle in WA who is needing a new home as his owners are going overseas in mid October. I emailed the Beagle Club on Friday but have had no response. Any help would be appreciated - they went to the RSPCA who said they'd only keep him for 6 months.

I catch quite a few, usually have a spare slip collar/lead with me and I always have crates although when I picked up a Golden Retriever last year he did have to go on the back seat. Some willingly get into my car at the first opportunity. i did follow another one on a hot day and long before i caught up with him he'd collapsed under a car, he bared his teeth at me so I got a towel and threw it over him and took him to the vet. When I found a pair on Pennant Hills Rd I'd thrown open my door, one got straight in and the other ran across the road, luckily he wasn't hit by cars. They had very stupid owners, living nr this very busy road who left their front door open, not at all phased by my report of how/when I foudn their dogs. Why are people so careless and/or stupid, I'll never get it. That said, some are genuine accidents and it can happen to any of us especially when you have new foster dogs etc. on a regular basis. Extreme care is needed at those times.

How can you seriously come onto a public forum and advocate for people to break the law and believe thats O.K.? Surely you know in the dog world that people will accuse you of all manner of things and its not O.K. to just run riot and have no regard for the law in the name of some cause. Excuse me Steve? I'm replying to your complaint about rescuers being just as bad as puppy farmers - why is it OK for you to accuse other parties but noone else. It is because you run the MDBA? It doesn't put you above everyone else. The RSPCA and Councils need to amend the laws, they are far too lax but I believe it is an offence not to seek vet treatment when an animals requires it. I'm sure there are some rescuers that aren't that great. If you read what I've said above, I state again - noone should have dogs unless they are going to look after them properly and I'd lump owners into that as well. By the way, you frequently use the laughter emoticons - I see no humour in this topic whatsoever.

Noone should have dogs if they can't look after them properly (ie food, water, suitable housing and vet care) - to me it doesn't matter if it is a puppy farm, a registered breeder or a rescuer. I don't think that anyone should be exempt.

I'm all for Petrescue advertising everywhere and anywhere. As a rescuer who spreads the word about rescue dogs and breeders (and why I oppose petshops and online sales), I often get the response that people had no idea where to look so thought they had to go to a petshop to get a puppy. Whilst I find this hard to believe, lookign at it from a person's point of view, they see puppies every time they go to the shopping centre and it's easy and right there - somethign many people want these days, instant gratification. Someone at work told me their dog had passed away (old and from cancer) yesterday. She knows what I do. She then said that if she ever gets another dog she had already chosen her breed so I asked what? She'd just lost a labrador. To my horror she said she wanted a Labradoodle. I then discussed one of two whys and wherefors with her in a gentle way. Lay people really just don't know. I frequently encourage people to go to shows and meet breeders. One lady at work did just this and researched for a few months and ended up with an Airedale, the match couldnt' have been more perfect but she's in it for life thank goodness whereas those that buy from petshops do on impulse quite frequently or without the knowledge of the breed/crossbreeds they are buying and that's where the problems begin.

Have you got a doggie door?

Ah yes, K9 Angel, very distressing. However, some of the posters here will only focus on the fact that someone got in and filmed it. If they had their way, vile situations like these puppy farms would stay secret and unexposed. I wonder if anyone thinks that Josef Fritzl's daughter and children should have stayed in the basement?

My friend has always had two although now she has 1 and a mutt she adopted from a rescue group thinking it was a Bearded Collie cross but DNA testing showed other breeds. Her dogs are were extremely active, big barkers and lots of grooming. As nice as they were with other dogs, they did cause a lot of nuisance in the dog park (she goes for an hour every night) with barking and herding behaviours. She never attempted to control it and it did cause a lot of anger amongst other dog owners! Now she has one it isn't so bad. As for the grooming - it's huge, she spent hours trying to keep her dogs looking good but they did get matted sometimes. Professional grooming can be expensive too. I personally would never cope with them, hers are house dogs so perhaps the neighbours haven't complained as they are not outside barking that often but these days, it would be something to consider as people complain so much. They were taken to stay with a friend who had a cat and they barked continuously at the poor thing apparently.

Perfectly reasonable and good on you. Best not to release undesexed puppies these days unless going for a show dog. The only problem I see is if you had sold a puppy to someone that wasn't desexed then it's available to breed. These days, people are buying dogs from petshops (crossbreeds often) and breeding them as well. You can't blame the average low intelligence/principled/income person for seeing crossbreed puppies for sale in petshops at $1000 each and thinking they'll make themselves a bit of money by breeding, it's easy right? Until they have to pay for a caeser (or not), other vet treatment and then cope with the resulting litter .... As a rescuer, I hear and see the results of this type of person's behaviour ALL THE TIME. In my breed rescue I have an ex show dog, had 2 show homes then given or sold to another home undesexed they mistreated him most likely as he wasn't housetrained and is a nervous breed. Dumped at the RSPCA. Going to be euth'd due to timidity. Finally they agreed to release him - breeder (registered) did not want him back unless undesexed (he was 4 yrs of age by then). Sold to a very young couple with breed exp. (this did save his life). 6 weeks later, they were "moving house" and sold him to me. He's a particulary traumatised dog but is responding to love and tlc in a breed experienced foster home. He's been there for 6 months so far and is still progressing. I could give you many examples of what I'm talking about above but won't as it will make my post far too lengthy but yesterday I did see "Labradoodles" for sale at my local shopping centre (sign on the notice board) - $1200 each. Someone got an undesexed Lab and a Poodle and of course, has started on a money making path.

Well I got busy on the internet yesterday, looking up information about over breeding etc as Steve has stated that with the recent purchases of overbred bitches from puppy farms whose insides were wrecked that it could not possibly be from back to back breeding. What was it then? A major coincidence? A strange virus? Hmmmm, I'd like a vet to post on here. I couldn't get some of the information downloaded from one vet's website but it did concur with the operating vet's opinion that their insides were wrecked by back to back breeding for many years. For general readers who seek education - go and do Google searches yourselves. I read a Breeders advice website that said it is looked upon a "UNETHICAL" - you should want to give your bitch a break. They say that "quality" breeders don't practice back to back breeding. I shouldn't have to point this out but to me it's obvious, why should a dog spend it's whole life being pregnant, feeding puppies and waiting for it's next season to be useful? And then agree that it's OK to get rid of them once their breeding is over, and I don't mean rehome. Yes, it's a breeder's prerogative to euthanase a dog that is past it's useful life (if that is the only value you place on a dog), ie breeding again and again but I'm sure that many people would just see that as totally callous behaviour. As for health issues caused by breeding back to back, check out this website: JustAnswer http://www.justanswer.com/pet-dog/2d0sl-health-issues-related-breeding-dog.html#ixzz1YSayTkJu I say again Steve, that you need to give other people some credit for having enough intelligence to work it out for themselves - especially frontline rescuers like myself.

Steve - there is an anomaly in what you say, surely you can see that? There are many reasons - some of which you yourself have espoused - as to why pet shops shouldn't sell live animals. Yes, I do want more regulation of petshops. Now you are saying if they are regulated and breeders put their own dogs in there it will be OK? No live animals being sold by 16 yr olds is the only way to go and I don't think you'll ever stop kids getting a Saturday job, they are also easily manipulated into talking ---- by their bosses - one recently told me that the puppies they sell are not from puppy farms, no they are from RSPCA approved breeders - there wasn't a purebred amongst them and the RSPCA don't approve back yard breeders so that they can sell in petshops. The ideal would be for pet shops to advertise breeders and rescue dogs but NOT have any animals in there. I'm not going to type line after line of text - I'm sure some of the general readers of this thread - not your breeder colleagues who you've obviously rallied to place post after post in each thread on a puppy farm topic - have stopped reading long ago because it is just tedious repetition. You are all obnviously most concerned about your own selves - that is not the motivation of the people who want to see puppy farms shut down. It's all about cruelty to animals. I say again, dogs are companion animals, mass breeding facilities cannot provide them with a fulfilling life of being loved and cared for properly. It's not only puppy farms but some breeders, even registered (oh my God, strike me down) who don't always care for their animals properly and I suspect that's what would worry some in the breeding community, that they may be checked out and found to be wanting. I can give you some recent examples but you will just claim I'm telling "fibs". Breeders do get prosecuted for cruelty, they are not God, they have failings like other people - lack of funds for vet care, lack of time, lack of attachment and so on.

Lollipop, whoever told you that must have a vested interest of some kind. Pet shops are dreadful places, all about selling the goods before they get too old. It is all about profit and caters for impulse buying which isn't a good thing when the products are live animals whose happiness and wellbeing depends on finding good owners. I'm not with an animal rights group but I do work (voluntarily) in rescuing and rehoming dogs in need. All you actually need is some common sense with regards to working out what goes on in petshops and why they are bad. Just take many of the phone calls that I get from people who've kids have persuaded them to go and get that cute puppy without a thought for how their life will be affected next week, let alone the next 12 years.

Some progress at last hopefully.

I'd recommend contacting "Rescued with Love", Kae and her foster carers do a great job and take Malt types all the time. You can Google "Rescued with Love" and you'll find their website.

I recommend you contact Janet and Peter, they have their dogs with them or in foster care and they are thoroughly tested over a period of time. They do a wonderful job - they don't make a big noise but work quietly and constantly and actually manage to rehome a good number of greyhounds. I'm sure (like my own rescue) that foster carers would have the first option to adopt!

At the Sydney Rally today, there were plenty of truths being shared, including a very interesting and knowledgeable speech by Anne, who has set up a legal firm that does pro bono work for Animal Welfare: www.lawyersforcompanionanimals.com.au Animal Welfare Issues Specific issues that we may be able to provide general information and/or advice include: Bullying and harassment (including termination of employment) from employers to those employees who have raised concerns about the welfare of companion animals (in pounds, shelters or pet shops) Letters threatening defamation (including “whistleblowers“) Poor regulation of the welfare of companion animals Lack of proper transparent record keeping relating to companion animals, including births, sales, deaths and includes traceable transfer of ownership Lack of transparency regarding sale of pets in pet shops including the sale of sick puppies and puppies who have not been properly socialised Failure of pet shops to provide details of the breeder of the puppies and kittens as well as the parents of the puppies/kittens Failure of the pet industry to acknowledge that there are different markets for puppies/kittens as opposed to full grown dogs/cats Lack of regulation of back yard breeders and puppy farms Issues surrounding cruelty to greyhounds Alerting authorities to illegal dog fighting operations How to making submissions to government agencies on issues relating to companion animal welfare Possible reasons for the high numbers of healthy cats and dogs killed in Australia every year (estimated to be in the range of 250,000) A good many issues to look at. Instead of complaining about "Oscars Law", suggesting it is all lies, smoke and mirrors, how about you go on the internet and read all about it? How about having a look at some videos of puppy farms on UTube - it's all there for anyone to see, unless they'd like to stick their head up their .... and pretend it's all being made up. If you think those things can be staged simply to annoy you, those dogs and puppies are bloody good method actors. Some people will no doubt choose to think that there's no harm in any of it because that's what suits them.

I agree its not OK to break the law Steve by the way, there are laws against animal cruelty and they are not being used to stop these people. I say more power to Deborah Tranter - she's a woman with tremendous guts. Far too many people are just happy to stick their head in the sand and keep spouting crap when asked. It's time that decent human beings stood up and spoke up for those who cannot.

Steve, who is making up fibs? I say again, I have seen the evidence with my own eyes. You say there is no problem with back yard breeding and breeding back to back litters? You say that "if the insides were really a mess it wasn't due to the breeding?". Are you a fully qualified vet? It was a fully qualified vet that determined that years of "back to back" breeding had wrecked these animals uteruses. The rally today was against all cruelty to animals being used in breeding. What do you do with your dogs when they are no longer able to breed? Do you get them euthanased or do you rehome them? Are all the dogs in your care free from health issues? What do you think puppy farmers and bybs do when a dog needs a caesarean? Do they even know when it is giving birth? Is there anything wrong with not really giving a crap about whether the bitch dies with a puppy in utero? Is it OK to courier puppies of 5 weeks of age to new owners, before they are even weaned? Then to tell new owners, when they enquired, to feed the puppy on "whatever you eat"?? I wonder how many of these tiny puppies actually survive? Bought on the Trading Post and other similar sites - sent off to God knows who ... perhaps for more breeding?

You are joking Steve, right? I for one am sick of reading all these very long posts, denouncing those that are trying to help animals in need. Smoke and mirrors? It's a shame you don't give credit where it's due - do you think that all the people that rally against puppy farms have no brains? How insulting. I'd like you to have been present today when a lawyer spoke very eloquently about what she is doing to fight against the laws that don't protect animals from unscrupulous people who use them to profit from misery. And councils DO approve puppy farms, they just don't call them that. And is there anything wrong with back to back breeding? Of course there is, it is not in the animal's health interests, perhaps you'd like to talk to my vet regarding dogs that were recently rescued from a puppy farmer and treated (all had ear infections, some had skin issues, one had a serious medical issue that required $1000s to treat and they all needed dentals and desexing of course). Their insides were a mess. Some pregnant ones were picked up at the same time (sold by the puppy farmer to members of the public, not by "animal liberationalists"}. The dogs were all sold to people and they were encouraged to breed from them again to sell to petshops, a "nice little earner". The pregnants dogs had their front legs painted so the puppy farmer knew which ones were pregnant. It can be hard to keep track when you have so many. No idea who the father(s) were either as they were all left to run around together when on heat .... You are right that Deb shouldn't have had to BUY Oscar back, very right. He should never have been returned to the puppy farmer - did you read about the condition he was in? What he was suffering? Completely inadequate and inept laws saw him returned to the cruel situation he'd have to survive for another 18 months. Dogs don't live that long and they certainly don't deserve to spend their lives reproducing and suffering medical issues that aren't treated. Is it OK for a dog to have a Grade 4 dental? •Grade 4—Severe tartar, periodontal disease, and oral pain are present. With grade 4 patients, tooth loss is imminent. OSSVH recommends dental X-rays to fully evaluate bone loss and tooth health. What about ear infections? Being matted with their own faeces and urine in their coats. ANYONE who breeds from dogs left in these conditions really needs to be stopped. I simply don't care if it is puppy farmers, back yard breeders or registered breeders - they are all guilty of cruelty and neglect. A dog is a companion animal - it isn't for farming. Full stop.

I've only just caught up with this thread. Hang in there Alison, you are doing an amazing job for this little man, he's so lucky to have you behind him. I'm sure he's going to make it, it's a big hurdle but he's got the best chance with all the help you and your vets are giving him. Once he gets past this, he will have a long and happy life ahead of him I'm sure. Plesae keep us posted!

Good luck Laika - after the rude response I got from Keeshond breeders in NSW last year, you are wasting your time. Keeshond Rescue in VIC were equally outraged that I bothered them, I mean, as if you would rescue a dog in another state? What a ridiculous suggestion. I rescue a breed myself, am not a breeder but am a rescuer and I take dogs from interstate all the time. It's not as if we are talking about a breed like Labradors or Jack Russells, commonly found in the pound. I'm sure as rescuers we can do something to help you and I will pm you now. Edited to add: noone can send you a pm, you need to speak to Troy, there is something wrong with it.

for those detractors, have you seen any of the videos? There is so much more to this than meets the eye. We are NOT talking about breeders who operate ethically. Would you like to buy a puppy from anyone - registered breeder or puppy farmer - whose parents existed in a cage without vet care for years on end? I sincerely hope not. I've had dogs from puppy farms, some of my close friends have been into them - not on raids but to look at dogs to buy. They really do exist. Sandgrubber - you live overseas. You can read the news in Victoria where local councils STILL approve puppy farming operations - for God's sake. What will it take before people find it in their hearts to want to stop these places? If it is not the suffering of the animals involved - then what?

ahhh, a time waster. Hope you've enjoyed it. What i said above goes - you're obviously worse than the average as you make things up as well, LOL.

reality check - this is what bored puppies do. I'm afraid that you should have thought VERY carefully before you bought a puppy. it's a 12-15 yr commitment. I rehome puppies and consider very few homes are suitable. Many people work full time, don't really plan on exercising a dog but oh yes, they wanted a Border Collie and by God it is their right, their dream so that's what they'll get. And then, a few months later, when puppy is not so cute and is proving a huge diversion from their hedonistic existence, off it has to go. It's made a mess and a noise. What a bloody nuisance. And it didn't even know not to go to the toilet inside. Hmmmm. It's why the pound's inmates are generally under 2 yrs of age. Like way too many people, you may have had more money than sense - harsh, yes.

I believe they should go through the same process as anyone else and absolutely pay for the vet treatment. I've had this happen before - been contacted by the owner and asked to give the dog back. The owner in question left his dog in the pound for 2 weeks (undesexed, unvaccinated etc) and I had bid for the dog. As a purebred and a young female, I had to bid high to beat the bybs. The owner didn't want to reimburse my costs and in the end, agreed that they sadly had no money to pay for any vet bills (the dog will eventually need very expensive surgery on its knees) and was happy for me to rehome. I had also explained that I would have to check the fencing if this person wanted the dog back as I would not want the dog to ever get out again. Basically, I was just planning to proceed as I normally would and if everything had been fine, the owner could have had the dog back.