Perfumed Lillium

I had a cup of coffee a couple of hours ago and am unable to go to sleep so I took my laptop to bed and started perusing some ads. I stumbled on a particular ad that stipulates it has "Tiny toy size Japanese Spitz Puppies" for sale. This is a first for me as I never heard of the Jap. Spitz referred to as a "toy" breed. Looking at the photos of the parents, they look like normal sized Jap. Spitz. It really irks me that people would advertise under false pretences for a quick buck without considering the welfare of the puppies. Selling them off as a "toy" sized dog is unethical and totally inconsiderate as there's a good chance that once the pups grow bigger than originally anticipated, the new owners are likely to discard the dog, there's always the exception to the rule of course but on the whole....we all know that animals are a disposable commodity for many. I think I'm best off not looking at ads as the hypocrisy of people makes me

I couldn't agree more, it shows a direct lack of empathy to animals to cull them because the colour isn't acceptable in the show ring, what's more is that the puppies are culled and then the breeder goes on and breeds more litters and in turn culls more pups, it's a never ending vicious cycle, surely anybody with a heart would not put themselves in that position?

With Poodles, the breed standard describes a "Joy of life". A poodle in the show ring must go around with all flags flying, head up, tail up and act like they own the ring. A Poodle with tail down on the move should not be awarded. I hate seeing any poodle being dragged around the ring and then backing off from a judge. The best show poodles are the hardest to live with and if you get that temperament (which we love) in a pet you need a really strong willed owner who is prepared to put in time and effort training. We would never breed from a bad temperament poodle, especially a bitch, (so far haven't had one) even if it was the best conformation. I was curious as to why the best show poodles are the hardest to live with? By saying that they require a strong-willed owner, is that to say that show poodles are head strong and perhaps a tad too 'cocky'? :D Reason I ask is that my friend owns a standard male poodle (desexed at 14 mths) and he has a magnificent temperament, clean, has never been destructive unlike most pups, he prances around alot and loves to jump.... and he is considered 'show quality'...the only problem is that at feeding times he gets overly excited and at times jumps on her, she has tried to teach him not to do this but it seems to be falling on deaf ears, lol

We ended up having an argument over this when I said that she could have had the merle pups desexed and placed in a pet home, she responded that it was costing her $1000 to raise each pup and that she wasn't willing to invest in that amount of money for a merle puppy; I explained that she could have sold the pup for the money that it cost her to raise it (desexing included) and she said that there's no way that pet homes are willing to pay $1000 for a pet dog. I have a problem believing that it cost $1000 to raise one pup from birth until 8 weeks of age even in today's times...and even less when talking about 6 or so years ago.

I know a woman who told me she used to breed champion great danes, she had a preference for harlequins and said that she used to get a large number of merle pups in a litter and had them culled. Is there a reason for this and is this common procedure? she told me it is :confused:

I am also very interested in this, as we recently adopted a merle cattle dog pup. Had no idea her colour could present a health risk? Often in cattle dogs people use the term merle for one without face markings. Its not the same 'merle' that other breeds have. What do you mean by "one without face markings?".....what sort of markings are you referring to?

People need to learn registered breeder does not equal ethical breeder. Some registered are no better than a BYB. You've hit the nail on the head, minimax, I've learnt that lesson the hard way, that not all registered breeders are ethical. What I meant was that I would have thought that not all breeders of blue staffies were unethical Anyone breeding purely for colour, and not for the betterment of the breed (is betterment a word?) really can't be ethical, because they aren't breeding for the right reasons. But is it not possible to breed for colour and consider other issues that affect the breed, i.e. congenital health issues, conformation, etc ?? Let's face it, most breeders, breed for colours that appeal in the show ring.....for example, through my researching of the pom breed, I learnt that darker colours do much better in the show ring than light coloured poms; white german shepherds are sneered at although they are perfectly healthy, etc etc.

If only! But with a track record like that, no one wanted him. Plenty of other nice dogs who are not escape artists also get put down every week all round the country. It's a damn sad world, the thought that so many perfectly good natured dogs are destroyed every week really depresses me, animals....especially dogs are treated as a disposable commodity and that is sooo unfortunate, some people have no conscience

People need to learn registered breeder does not equal ethical breeder. Some registered are no better than a BYB. You've hit the nail on the head, minimax, I've learnt that lesson the hard way, that not all registered breeders are ethical. What I meant was that I would have thought that not all breeders of blue staffies were unethical

Thank you for bringing this story to us; I had tears welling up in my eyes and I was covered in goose bumps, what a beautiful and amazing story. That German shepherd has the soul and intelligence of a human being, what an angel. May his life be a full and rewarding one.

Thanks Rebanne, I suppose that breeding SOLELY for colour is not a great idea if the dogs aren't health checked, I would have thought that registered breeders of blue staffies were just as diligent as other breeders, it is a shame that this isn't the case, typical of individuals being greedy at the expense of the animal's health and well-being.

One thing I have learnt over the years, not only through personal experience but also via other people's experience, is that dogs can experience jealousy and if a dog senses that the other dog is getting preferential treatment, it will feel resentment. If both dogs are the same size, they can sort out their differences but two big dogs against a smaller dog can present problems. Ideally, it would be great if this weren't the case....and perhaps it mightn't be in your case but it is risky nevertheless; perhaps increasing the attention the other dogs are getting might help but there is no guarantee, is it possible for you to separate them during the day when you are unable to supervise them? Congratulations on your new puppy, he's one lucky pooch and I am sure he will be spoilt :D

I so agree, I have experienced that feeding an animal does not guarantee preference towards the person that feeds it although in my case this applies to cats, I have 3 cats, had them since they were 8 weeks old and am the only one that feeds them yet they definitely gravitate towards my OH to the point that they can be, at times, overbearing....wanting his attention and cuddles all the time, I wish they showed me that much attention, lol. I suppose the same would apply to dogs and like people, animals have their favourite people

Definitely 6 weeks old is far too young to leave home, any caring breeder would hold onto the pup until at least 8-9 weeks but why is there a problem with breeding for colour as long as other things are taken into consideration and the breeding stock is health checked? Perhaps I am missing something but my understanding is that breeders are all trying to breed to the standard and that often includes the colour of the dog as well ???

You would expect that anyone undertaking breeding of any animal would be better informed instead of taking a stab in the dark. As everyone has said, 6 weeks is ridiculously young to sell a pup and speaks volumes of the breeder, just my honest opinion. Good luck and I hope all works out great for you. Looking forwards to seeing photos in the near future.

That's tragic, surely he could have been homed with someone willing to accept him as a house dog or have a run with a roof so that he would not have been able to escape ???? What a waste of a good dog

Thank you for your kind words, Persephone....fingers crossed that they will stay healthy. As I've said before, I've had bad luck from both sides of the fence and there is no doubting that there are some great reg. breeders as well as some doubtful ones so time is the essence.

,

The pom breeder is registered, my main concern was that she had 6 puppies from the one litter and I was advised that this was an impossibility in toy poms so therefore I had doubts that she may not have been truthful in saying that they were all litter mates, after lengthy phone conversations and speaking to her vet, my mind was put at ease in relation to these doubts. The vet was able to confirm that the dam did indeed deliver all 6 puppies. I have grown to like this lady and she is definitely a very caring lady in so many ways that I feel a tad guilty in having doubts but I guess being bitten more than twice I couldn't help it. I have decided to go ahead with the pup and she will be arriving tomorrow. I have copies of the rego papers. She also suggested that I transfer only half of the payment before she arrives and the balance after I've picked her up, there aren't many that would be prepared to take that risk, I don't think I would. Another surprise, I have purchased the japanese spitz as well, I have him with me right this minute, he is gorgeous, please don't come down hard on me for being honest and admitting that he is from a byb, she lives 5 mins down the road from me, I went to her place on 3 separate occasions and got to see the pups and the mum & dad. They are raised superbly and although she may not breed for the show ring, she only breeds one litter a year for the pure enjoyment of it, she is by no means a puppy farmer and in fact is very picky about letting the pups go, she has asked me a myriad of questions to ensure that I know enough about dogs to provide them with adequate care. What the heck?

That is one amazing dog, the stamina and jumping ability has to be seen to be believed, that was amazing viewing. Part dog....part goat, maybe? lol. Wish I had a quarter of his stamina ;)

,

I understand your point of view but as I've said before, I haven't had much luck with registered breeders either and some of them are byb with papers, I suppose it's a bit like playing russian roulette...it's the luck of the drawer. I applaud those that health check their breeding dogs, kudos to them.

,

As some of you may know, I was a little sceptical about purchasing a pom from a breeder due to reasons outlined in another thread. The breeder has sent me another photo of the pup as well as a video and we have spoken at length this arvo and I feel far more confident now. Before ever speaking to this breeder, I was debating between a Japanese Spitz or a pom. As it happens, I am very keen on this pom puppy but there is a japanese spitz breeder only 10 mins away that has 3 pups to sell, they are gorgeous. I am torn and don't know which way to go. I have had a japanese spitz before, he passed away 4 years ago, he was 16 yo. I have also owned a pom and had him till he passed away at 14 years of age. I need to make a decision and as I love both breeds I just don't know which way to go. PLEASE HELP, I have never been so indecisive in my life.

I have spoken to the breeder that has the 2 cream pom puppies, she was very elusive when I was speaking to her over the phone, I asked her to email me photos of the parents and the pups, she told me she was having problems with her computer and would text me the photos, this was last week, I still haven't received anything; may I add that I rang her yesterday morning and she had little to say, no explanation as to why she hasn't texted me the photos and said she would send me a few within the hour, nothing yet. Very disappointing.