RossP

Not advertising and the link you read is not the same one I read, my later post has link. I never said chickens don't eat meat, ours eat left over chicken. The only reason I posted it is that I just didn't think about the chemical content of the chickens we feed our dogs, whether it be good or bad.

Not my own summary, got it from here.....Chicken Mince

Never thought about the way chickens were raised & how it may affect their flesh. Chicken meat and by products are the most common source of meat used in canned and dry pet foods. This is primarily driven by price. Chickens are the most cheaply and intensively farmed (mass produced) of all the domesticated animal species. The commercial chicken industry is massive, and the housing and farming of these chickens bares no resemblance to the traditional image of chooks running around the farmyard. Commercial "battery" chickens are raised and housed in sheds (in cages) their entire life, and are fed a man made diet from birth. The birds today have been selected and engineered to be fast growing, producing maximum sized breast and leg/thigh cuts, and to a lesser extent, wings. Most chicken meat in canned and processed dry foods is used as chicken meal (powdered meat meal), which utilises the carcass, some offal, and the beaks, feet and feathers. Fresh chicken mince, available in most pet outlets (more often frozen) is generally just the carcass portion put through a mincer, so it contains meat, fat, cartilage and bone. Chicken mince is very cheap, retailing from $1.50 per kg upwards, and as such, is commonly used by both pet food processors and pet owners alike. Nutritionally, chicken mince is questionable. It is high in fat (18%+), and can be higher again in pet minces, where skin and fat often makes up a proportion of the mix. Of greatest concern is the diets the chickens are fed. The man made pellets and crumbles the birds are raised on are geared to maximise growth rate, and meat yield, from breast and thigh cuts. There is little emphasis placed on nutritional value, as taste, texture and yield are all that the producers are interested in for the end, human consumption product The diets are so basic in many minerals, that calcium density in the bones of the birds can drop from an expected 20% down to as little as 4%. These birds see little (if any) in the way of natural sunlight, and most likely suffer from vitamin D deficiency. There is no green grass or shoots to feed on, and no natural anti oxidants. On top of this, the diets have a constant level of antibiotic included, to try and minimise the death toll, and a range of "growth promotants" included (not true "hormones", as they have been outlawed in most countries). Also, there is every chance that a significant proportion of the protein in these pelleted rations is actually derived from meat meal - and I haven't met too many carnivorous chickens in my time?? In short, battery raised chicken meat is only as good as the rations they are fed on, and given that these birds are slaughtered at 12 weeks of age, there is little chance the rations are designed for good long term health. We should not be fooled by the term "free range", these birds are still raised in sheds, and still fed the same rations, they are simply allowed to eat the pellets from the ground, and live in an open plan shed. Chickens are a natural reservoir for salmonella, the bacteria being commonly found in the gut and faecal material. When the birds are stressed, the bacteria can multiply in large numbers, which creates a food hygiene issue. During the slaughter of birds, the viscera (organs and intestines) are removed from the abdominal cavity, and it is quite common for fluid from the intestinal tract (containing bacteria, and often, salmonella) to spill out onto the abdominal cavity wall, thus contaminating the carcass. SUMMARY - CHICKEN The modern farming practices of the intensive poultry industry leaves a lot to be desired, both on a nutritional level, and on an ethical level. The stress levels in housed birds are extreme, and there is the issue of bacterial contamination at processing. This is the primary reason why chicken mince spoils very quickly, and is most commonly sold frozen. Luckily for our pets, cats will simply not eat "off" meat, and dogs have a cast iron constitution, which is nowhere near as sensitive to the presence of bacteria, even salmonella, as humans. A large quantity of chicken mince is produced and fed on a daily basis throughout Australia and on the whole, the overall health of dogs and cats does not suffer. Chicken mince has its place, as a cheap ADDITION to the diet and as long as it is handled correctly, frozen, and thawed out to feed, it is relatively safe to use. However, it should definitely not form a major part of any pet's diet and I would definitely rate chicken as the least suitable of all fresh meats. 1. Kangaroo - very, very good - the perfect 10/10. 2. Tripe - also very, very good. Its difficulty in sourcing sees it score 9/10. 3. Offal - if obtained correctly, an important part of the diet - 8/10 4. Sheep - very good, the best of the farmed meats - 7/10 5. Beef - next best of the farmed meats - 6/10 6. Fish - only if purchased fresh, then it is good, owing to inconvenience and price - 5/10 7. Rabbit - excellent if from wild rabbits, owing to extreme difficulty in procuring - 5/10 8. Chicken - still better than canned and processed, as long as it is fed as part of the diet only and is purchased and stored frozen. It's related health and ethics issues see it rate poorly against all the other good meats on offer. It is cheap though - 3/10 9. Pork - the least suitable and not recommended at all - 0/10

I am in South Australia & I always get pet meat from the same shop. Mincing & dicing all done in shop. Salisbury Pet Meats 175 Salisbury Highway Salisbury SA 5108 (08) 8258 4249 Freshly minced chicken is $1.20 per kg Freshly diced Beef is $3.60 per kg Has Roo etc but I don't know how much that is. Frozen also available.

That is a great photo, a working dog doing what they do best. When I was farming I had one Heeler that would round up the following. Geese, Horses, Cattle, Sheep, Goats & Chickens. She would cast close to 1klm in thick fog, find the flock of sheep in the scrub and bring them to me. She would never give up at what ever she did. The only animals that tried her patience were ducks, just couldn't get the hang of them.

I am also looking for a better flea treatment. Comfortis may be the one but how many have had issues like this posted on the Comfortis website.?

I have had her checked out by 3 vets now, none of then have come up with a heart rate, very frustrating. They don't know what it should be, just listen to hear if it is fast or slow. She appears to be doing well, already house trained, sits & speaks on command. Leads very well and barks at the back door to either come in or go out. Has no interest in chooks either. Phone camera appears to make her head out of proportion to her body, but it's not. My Wife has a Papillon which weighs about 3.5 kg, but they play well together

Hi Inevitablue Thanks for your reply and I have done as you suggested. And yes, I have owned several ACD's in the past, I was a farmer. Great companions no matter what you do, a thoroughly enjoyable breed.

Hi All. I am it a bit of distress over my 9 week old pup. I have had her 1 week now and she is great. Already house trained, has the "Sit" command nailed & leads okay for her age. Runs a lot and plays with our other dog all the time. I am concerned about her heart rate. This is the first pup I have ever had that the heartbeat is so hard and fast to feel when carried. It seems to race, even sleeping her heartbeat is around 160 BPM. Took her to a Vet but she wasn't very help full. She said it may or may not be an issue. All 4 chambers in the heart are strong. I have searched for any info about heart rates in pups, but all I can find is that pups have a fast heartbeat that slows as they get older. I can't find exactly what is a normal heartbeat speed. Even the Vet didn't give me a figure. If anyone can give me a figure for BPM that would be great. After a little running her BPM can be 220BPM or higher. I am very distressed over this. Thanks for reading

Hi All. I am it a bit of distress over my 9 week old pup. I have had her 1 week now and she is great. Already house trained, has the "Sit" command nailed & leads okay for her age. Runs a lot and plays with our other dog all the time. I am concerned about her heart rate. This is the first pup I have ever had that the heartbeat is so hard and fast to feel when carried. It seems to race, even sleeping her heartbeat is around 160 BPM. Took her to a Vet but she wasn't very help full. She said it may or may not be an issue. All 4 chambers in the heart are strong. I have searched for any info about heart rates in pups, but all I can find is that pups have a fast heartbeat that slows as they get older. I can't find exactly what is a normal heartbeat speed. Even the Vet didn't give me a figure. If anyone can give me a figure for BPM that would be great. After a little running her BPM can be 220BPM or higher. I am very distressed over this. Thanks for reading