Mystiqview

This was my exact comment last night when I was discussing our options with my BF. I am dead against buying from a BYB or pet shop BUT I might be left with no other choice due to a few things that don't concern us because we are not idiots and are responsible but probably would concern breeders who want the 'perfect' every single part of a persons life and home! At the end of the day we are all human, we all make mistakes, but that doesn't mean everyone is irresponsible and should not be given a chance. There is a happy medium between the arrogant 100 question breeder and someone who is only interested in the sale of the pup and does not care where it goes or to whom. I am busy like many breeders. However I will also give each enquiry the courtesy and attention it needs. I would rather give them the information they need to sus out a good breeder and recommend good breeders, than to just say, "got nothing" see you later. In my breed, there are plenty of breeders who would happily sell them a puppy with limited questions asked. There are plenty out there breeding for colour and money and will happily charge anything up to $3500 (yes I did type that right) for a pedigree border collie from pet lines on the main register to an unsuspecting puppy buyer not knowing any better. (I have the email forwarded to me from the puppy buyer). Once you start talking to people, you can soon work out whether they are being 100% truthful or not. Edit: typo

Be careful with some of the online courses. I looked at the Open Colleges one. I rang my local vet hospitals and asked them what they thought about the course and whether there was a preferred course. All had hesitations about the open colleges one. They all said, the students come out generally knowing the theory but the surgery then needs to spend much more time on the practical skills. These are time consuming and also put the surgery at risk for errors by the graduate. Also I have found with the online one, you are locked into the whole $5000 course fee. If for instance you had to stop or could not continue, you still had to pay for the whole course without refund. Whereas if you say went to TAFE and paid per semester, if you pulled out, you only lose what you have already paid. You don't have to keep paying for a course you're not studying.

Register him to what colour he is. Look at as a layman, if some person picks him up, what would they call it? Some council registrations will also have a spot for listing any distinguishing features. Mention the greying on there

Reading through some of these responses, I can really see why more and more people are going to BYB. Go back and read some of your comments!! I understand in some breeds, you have to be careful about where your pups go. I am damn careful here mine go too. However my puppy buyers aren't subjected to the level of interrogation that some of you feel is a breeders right. These are still people. Some of them may be ignorant, they may not list or answer your questionnaires correctly or know what to put into an email. I know I have received emails from some enquiring about pups that some other breeders would have instantly denied. Some I would not sell a pet rock to, but a good number were just ignorant and worded their email badly. If I had not taken the time and talked to them or found out some more information, they may well have gone to a back yard breeder. A couple have my pups and I could not be happier about the home they are in. There are tyre kickers out there. I am not so naive to know this. But it's better to try to educate and hopefully direct them to a ethical breeder than send them straight to a puppy farm. The pedigree dog world is being destroyed from the inside out by its own members. The back yard people are sitting out there rubbing their hands together while we turn away pertly good puppy homes by a few peoples bad attitudes. What is wrong with talking to your puppy buyers? Are we so elitist that our dogs now poo gold and are extremely rare? Most ethical breeders do give a damn about their pups. Good breeders will screen their puppy buyers, but there are limits and invading a person's privacy by wanting to talk to their vet, is akin of wanting to also talk to their doctor. It's a gross invasion of privacy. What if they are a new puppy buyer or like most of my dogs, only see a vet once a year or two for vaccinations? The vet would not necessarily know how I look after my dogs and whether I am kind or look after them properly. To the OP, I really hope you find a lovely breeder and a lovely new pet.

There is getting to know the puppy buyers and going over the top. Aside from showing you have suitable fencing and keep a clean house. Photos of you and the house are not going to prove you are necessarily a better/responsible pet lover/owner than the next person. I know people who have a dingy looking house and are a little rough around the edges being excellent responsible pet owners, and I know people who keep immaculate house and yard and I would not even sell them a flea off my dog. The only real way to know of your puppy is going to a good home, is to get to know them over time. Even then it is no guarantee they will do the right thing by your dogs.

Avoid anything made from ivermectin. Unless your dog or both the parents have been tested for ivermectin sensitivity or MDR1 gene and they are "normal" I would stay clear. Heart guard and some supermarket/cheap brands are ivermectin based. Also I would not recommend the 6 or 12 month pro heart heart worm injection. I know quite a few collies who have lost their life after having this. I use interceptor. My dogs are all MDR1 normal, but found this product to be both quite economical. If you are giving daily heart worm tablets, then partak plus, drontal or endoguard all wormers are all fine.

I would go back to the council (if a complaint has gone there) and advise them to come and record a noise level at your property. It will be possibly be on council record now that someone has put a noise complaint on your dogs. You need to clear that record in with council and direct them to the correct house.

Have a look on gumtree or other places locally that sell second hand. You can still pick up a good steel crate for a fraction of the price new. However, I am against using collapsible crates within vehicles. They are not secured and in an accident the dog and the crate can soon become a missile and cause more damage to the dog and any other passengers. There was a photo going around on Facebook of a woman who thought she was doing the right thing by securing her dogs in the collapsible steel crates in the boot section of a wagon (Rav 4 or simlar). She was involved in an accident and the weight of the dogs being thrown against the sides of the steel crate caused them to collapse and fold in and then the whole lot was thrown about the car. In some states, it is law to secure all loads within the vehicle. This includes dogs (and their crates). Purpose built crates that anchor properly to the vehicle's factory mounting are much safer (although can be limiting for other luggage) as they cannot move around in an event of an accident. We are avid 4wders and part of a club. My dogs come regularly on club trips where dogs are allowed. I use a harness and strap my dog in this way rather than using a crate for securing the dog. In the hilux, I do have a drawer system in the back and a door at the rear of the dogs where I can lock the dogs in. However, once I go off road, the dogs are strapped in via a harness so they are not thrown around. Set up in the back of the lux:

Second jane harper

This kind of barking is transitional yes and it can become a problem if not checked. If you don't like this kind of barking, I would check all forms of it, not just the morning barking. You can put his steel crate outside, if necessary, throw a sheet over it to create a den. Some steel crates have steel trays in them rather than the plastic ones. This may help if he is feeling the heat. You could also put a damp towel in the bottom of the crate for him to lie on. This can also help if he is feeling the heat. I would refrain from using those gel cooling mats at present unsupervised on a puppy in case they get in their mind to chew and destroy. I personally don't like letting puppies run loose in a yard at night and prefer to retrain them in a crate or kennel run. Saves them chasing things that go bump in the night and cane toads. Teaching a puppy crate training is great for when you are travelling, needing to take him to the vet etc. The crate then becomes their home. As my guys are now all crate trained, I have toe soft crates in the house where they freely let them selves in.

Personally, I would get get a behaviourist out to watch the interaction. All we can do is guess here on a forum. We cannot see what is happening and read the body language of everyone involved.

The times where my guys have reacted to Advantix was when I distributed it on their rumps. I also distribute it in a number of spots down the back. They were not "hot spots" - the Bayer rep on the phone tried to say it was not their product causing the sores but rather my dog had unrelated hot spots. hmm.... under the same spot where I applied their product???

Sarsparilla, I have had dogs that will want to bully others. They just need to be supervised. That does not matter if it is a pup, a child or even another older dog. On the other side of the coin - how are they to learn too appropriate manners if they are firstly not taught and secondly have them refreshed occassionally? I would definitely supervise them. If the pup is only newly away from its breeder, it has a lot to take in and adjust too. Thankfully most pups this age are fairly tolerant and easily adaptable. Especially if the breeder has done their bit by correctly socialising the pup and getting it used to various surroundings etc As for leaving the pup alone/outside etc for extended period of times. Unless you are prepared and able to watch it 100% of the time - no matter where you leave it (inside/outside) it can get into mischief. Go around your place and look for things that can cause harm. Anyone bringing in a puppy will have to do this too. There are just as many hazards inside as their are out. Power cords love to be chewed - not exactly a healthy pastime if the other end is connected to 240v. Detergents, cleaners and other chemicals, cochroach baits etc (both inside and out) can be just as nasty. Poisonous plants inside and out. I am 100% supportive of crate training, however the pup also cannot be crated for extended period of times. An 8 week old pup will run around for a bit, then sleep. You can wrap the pup in cotton wool. Does not help the pup adjust and learn. Or you can teach the pup to be a good canine citizen. Two homes and two rules will not be confusing for the pup. Work with your daughter to establish what sort of rules and behavious you both find acceptable and stick to them. These could be nice simple ones of sit before pat, wait before doors, toilet command and wait before food. Even within one family environment - there can exist two sets of rules. The pup will soon learn what it can get away with mum and what dad will allow. My personal belief - every dog should be taught basic house manners. These are the same as the "please" and "thank you's" you teach children. What you teach after this is individual.

Raising one litter at a time does not take all day unless we're talking about multiple litters which, in my opinion, is wrong. If a breeder can't be arsed keeping her website up to date, don't have one and more importantly don't lead people up the mulberry bush. Wow! Talk about rude! I'm not a breeder but I'm pretty darned sure that raising even one healthy litter can take all day -- especially if things like premature, singleton or caesarians occur. I'd personally prefer a breeder who takes the time out to look after her pups rather than have an awesome website; after all, not everyone can be amazing web designers. :/ Also, I'd be willing to bet that some of these breeders have quite possibly forgotten they've even got a website. River Star Aura Um, if you are not a breeder, then how can you say this?? You have no knowledge/experience to call on with breeding and raising a litter. I have had a number of bitches requiring C-sections, one with fading puppy syndrome where three pups died within 12 hours of each other around day three, other slow or sick puppies requiring feeds every 2 hours, one where I had to bottle feed the pups because of milk fever, not to mention other complications after a litter was born. I normally work full time and will take time off when a litter is born to attend to anything that arises. I have a busy normal life like many other breeders, so am not special there. I also have a fully functional and maintained website -again like a number of other breeders out there. My website designed and maintained by myself through a hosting company. I have no background in graphic design or web design. I just sat down one year and learnt how to fly first Microsoft Frontpage and later Dreamweaver which is my current program of choice. Having the 20 plus years breeding experience, I am qualified to say it does not take all day to raise a litter. The first few weeks can be rather hectic, especially if there are problems. It comes down to how organised the person is. Some people are not organised while others are very organised. Some people cannot even organise having pets let alone breeding. It's a personal choice. Having a fully functional up to date website in the first place, DOES make it easier to update. Not a lot of work is required to update the "litter page" - even with one photo of the group of puppies, the DOB and how many of each sex. Most of it like the sire/dam/pedigree etc can be done before the litter is born - even when it is confirmed. Probably about 15 minutes to half an hour tops - even using those free web design pages. However it is not the point here raised by the OP - the gripe and they are fair in saying this - if you don't have a functioal website, remove the link and just go back to phone/email. Simple.

I understand your frustration. If you advertise somewhere photos can be seen XXXXX, then make the effort to ensure they are actually there. If a breeder has an old website or does not/can not post photos up for what ever reason, remove the reference to it. Like it or not - registered breeding is a "business" - even if you don't breed often etc. I use the term "business" as we are selling a product AND we are competing with other breeders for home for our pups and also the BYB, pet store etc. More so now with social media and the internet.

Sheena. Haha - yeah I know. The only way to stop the bligters from attaching is putting the dog in a bubble. I don't use either Frontline or Advantix. Frontline is a waste of money and you mose well just flush it down the toilet. My guys have had a reaction to Advantix. They will get a sore under where you apply it. Even though you separate the hair and apply it to the skin, border collies having the double coat, the undercoat still asorbes a certain amount of it. Being an oily product, it then sits just above the skin and creates a barrier for moisture to get under. As this doesn't dry - it causes a sore. Best way to decribe what has happened... I rang Bayer and they told me my dog had hot spots. I know what a hot spot is, and how to treat it. These were definitely not hot spots. I don't mind the preventic collar - I can live with the peppermint smell. Thought I would give the scalibor collars a go. Pretty happy with them so far. While I have found a tick or two, I cannot say that the collar is the only thing preventing my dogs from getting sick. I know people who have found ticks on the neck under a (new) Preventic collar on their dogs. The only thing with the Scalibor collar I don't like is because you cannot smell anything, you don't know if the collar is dead earlier than it should be. At least with the smelly ones - when you cannot smell them, you definitely know they are dead. Mine also get bathed every 2 weeks in Fidos flea/tick shampoo. Which I find does well for keeping fleas at bay.

Sarsaparilla The pup needs to learn appropriate behaviour around older dogs, just like while you are minding the pup, your dog/s need to learn appropriate behaviour around the puppy. What you have described is bullying and I would not accecpt this as appropriate behaviour. In saying this, your dog may not know how to play/interact with a pup as it has not done this maybe since it was a pup. Dogs if not constantly socialised with other dogs/puppies will lose to a point their socialisation skills. Pups in the wild are still with the pack at this age and will be corrected from the pack behaviours that are not suitable. It really is important that pups learn correct behaviours from the older dogs. My pups here are socialised with my older dogs. They are supervised, and if things get out of hand, I step in. To date after 20 years of breeding, I have not had one aggressive pup, or aggression between pups and my older dogs. Socialisation also is important while the pup is at the breeder. If the pup has not been well socialised while at the breeder - the pup may not know how to interact with the older dog, because it never has with the exception of it's mother. It may not be as confident as it should be as a result of poor socialisation. If this is the case, then it is REALLY important that it is socialised correctly before the next fear period sets in. The pup will not be a pup and will not be this small for long, however you don't want it to get a fear of larger or a certain type of dog. This will create a new problem (if it does) for your daughter and possibly you later on when it gets bigger and better able to take care of itself. Forget for the moment about "your dog getting jealous" - that really is you putting a human emotion on your dog. Correcting your dog for inappropriate behaviour is still acknowledging and paying attention to your dog. Go back to basics when you were training him/her - dog was doing something wrong, you correct it, then reward it for doing a correct behaviour. The same goes for the pup - correct bad behaviour and reward the good behaviour. Watch the two play and interact. If there is growling - it may be play growling or it may be growling because someone is not happpy. Look at all the cues each dog is displaying. A lot of noise may be play or it may be "leave me alone". Older dogs generally will allow a puppy to get away with a fair bit more than normal. Even if puppy is ontop of your dog now, look at the body language. Just because the older dog is lying down and the puppy is on top of them - it could be this is the safest place for the older dog to be. If the older dog is on its back - generally this is also a submissive position and quite suitable to play with a puppy - with the puppy jumping on the older dog. Whereas if the puppy was juvenile or older - the play will be me standing/upright with a lot more position changes (Eg.one dog lies down while the other is playing with the neck, then they will reverse). There may be times throughout the day, you need to give both dogs time out and separate them. This is perfectly fine. The pup will spend quite a bit of time sleeping, so this is a good time to spend one on one time with your dog. I would supervise all activity between pup and older dog.

I have used all the tick treatments. I live in extreme paralysis area. I have had two dogs at the vets in October within a week of each other for tick paralysis. I must say here - first time in 7 years. Many years ago - we used Proban.. Someone thought it a good idea to take it off the market. ( have heard a few stories on that one. One that the company making the active ingredient was no longer making it and also a potential class action as long term use side effects). Best product ever for tick prevention. Frontline = useless Advantix = useless Kiltix = stinks. "Green label" product, so you cannot use another green label product (such as Malaban/Maldacin (wash). Have still found ticks on the dogs Preventic = does not stink (strong peppermint smell) as much as Kiltix, have found ticks on the dogs while the collar has been within specs. Scalibor = No smell, effective - as above. My dogs don't swim every day. They do have clams where they can paddle and splash. The vet at Vets Products Direct did say that Scalibor was "the only tick collar that was splash/shower resistant". Mine are currently wearing scalibor. I have found a tick or two on the dogs. Generally between the back legs or on the front legs. Not healthy looking ones, but still found them. Best thing is really check your dogs daily for ticks. None of the products will repel the tick from attaching. The best you can hope for is it makes the tick sick before the tick makes your dog sick.

Showdog, I don't know where you get "most breeders don't chip until 7-8 weeks. I and many border collie breeder friends chip puppies at 6 weeks during vaccination time. Legally in Qld (may differ in other states), the puppy (or kitten) only needs to be over one kilogram in weight to be chipped. I can understand toy dogs being chipped later than 6 weeks. As for papers and even with DNA, I would expect them in normal situations by the time the pup is 12 weeks old. Queensland allows breeders to register pups directly into the new owner's name whereas other states register in the breeders name and then the dog needs to be transferred to the new owner. Average turn around time for Dogs Queensland is about 10 business days. The papers are sent back to the breeder for checking, then the breeder is expected to mail out the new certificates to the new owners. Breeders in Queensland HAVE been fined and/or suspended for NOT supplying papers. I know of a few, and have even had to write/witness stat declarations for one breeder who is still suspended (indefiniely). If for limited register - there is no reason why the papers need to be held for contract reasons (Eg. desexing). I can understand an older main registered animal that the breeder is rehoming and will withhold papers until the dog is desexed. I would be definitely contacted the state body where the pup comes from. From what you have said - you have every right to be concerned. Something does not sound right.

As far as cancer goes. Everything has the potential to cause cancer. Cancer can run in lines, like it can in humans. You can just have bad luck and your dog despite every precaution still gets cancer. It is proven, even in humans, that the reproductive organs have a bigger role with the body than just allow the body to reproduce. The hormones fulfil a greater role, and I think now people are starting to think about the greater effects desexing and in particular early desexing may have on animals later in life. If you read all the reports, and not just those I quickly posted - there is not yet concrete proof for either side. There are some very strong arguments for both sides, and it is more now a choice of which side of the fence you wish to sit. It is interesting though the preliminary data about not desexing males does not necessarily stop male dominance/agresssion etc, and in some males, increased it.

There are a few chip registeries where you can enter/register your pet. I think there are others who, if you enter the chip number, will tell you who it was registered with (microchip company). Each company have different rules and regs on how they require updated details. Collars can come off. Doors can be accidently not closed properly or opened. The pounds are instructed to also scan down the legs as it is a known fact that some of the earlier chips in particular were prone to migrating.

Yes. That is all that they can do. When a dog comes into the pound, you can ring one (or all) of the various registries. (with the exception of the NSW companion registry). Pounds and authorised places have passwords etc to look up or give to the operator. They only provide name and contact number. If the contact is wrong or out of date, there is nothing more we can really do, other than hope you will eventually get to ringing the pound to see if your dog is there.

There are quite a fair bit of discussion about this on a number of forums. There are strong camps for both sides. Even to the point of not desexing at all. At the end of the day, my best recommendation is go with what you are comfortable with. If you are not comfortable with a breeder who early desexes, try to find a breeder who doesn't. There have been studies published which show an increase in other cancers, growth issues and also increase of hip displasia in some breeds from early desexing. Unfortunatly, for every story your read for one side, there is another counter acting it. There have also been links that (early) desexing actually can increase aggression in some breeds. Personally, I don't believe in it and do not recommend my boys in particular to be desexed until after 12 months. They need their bits to grow properly. Although I do understand why some breeders do desex their dogs before going. I was even considering it if the Dogs Qld, was going to make it manditory that every puppy be placed on the main registration - especially in my breed the rise in unscupulous colour breeders - only breeding borders collies for money and the colour fad. Do a google search on issues of early desexing of dogs and there will be some articles that come up. I have recently reformatted my computer, so my old bookmarks have been deleted. here are some I quickly found now. http://healthypets.mercola.com/sites/healthypets/archive/2013/09/30/neutering-health-risks.aspx http://www.dogsnaturallymagazine.com/new-study-neuter-risk-hip-dysplasia-dogs/ http://www.google.com.au/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=15&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=0CDYQFjAEOAo&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.caninesports.com%2Fuploads%2F1%2F5%2F3%2F1%2F15319800%2Fspay_neuter_considerations_2013.pdf&ei=3hxjVJWuLqe7mAWVsIDYDQ&usg=AFQjCNFNpV95MOJ9lbpMKspiHyu5augQ5Q&bvm=bv.79189006,d.dGY

I have just bought homebrand super pads. They work fine.

When I worked at the pound/Council as an Animal Management Officer. There were just as many owners who never bothered to change the microchip details from the breeder to their name. So if a dog DID end up in the pound, we were not able to contact the owners. What is frustrating here, it has been law since 2008 that all dogs/cats must be chipped before sale (even an adult dog born before 2008 being rehomed) is the number of people still refusing to do it. Mainly BYB advertising on Gumtree etc. However I have seen ads from supposed registered breeders claiming they have a letter from RSPCA or similar to say the dog cannot be chipped before 12 weeks. By law, the animal only needs to be one kilogram to be chipped.