Weasels

Sardines & Yoghurt :)

It isn't so much this, as each gene only encodes for one protein or RNA, but that the genes are grouped together as chromosomes and inherited as a block. Plus genes that are close together on a chromosome are less likely to get separated if a 'reshuffling' event occurs (what we call 'tightly linked') - therefore offspring are very unlikely to inherit one without the other. For example if a gene for 'black' and a gene/genes that regulates dopamine or serotonin production are right next to each other on a chromosome it would be almost impossible to inherit one without the other and colour may well be linked to temperament. Since the dog genome has been mapped we could find this out fairly easily, but I'm just not sure how well the brain biochemistry genes that we understand actually correlate to a complicated thing like temperament. It could be studied though, by creating a panel of all the candidate genes and seeing which ones are more or less active in dogs with a certain temperament. I suspect though since it's likely to be a combination of genes, and then environment plays such a big part, it would be a tough one to nut out the statistics on.

Eating sheep poo is often a sign of stress or uncertainty, it doesn't mean the instinct is not there just that the dog is currently a bit overwhelmed. I've seen this in plenty of the new dogs who turn up to training, Weez did it too at the start and he definitely has instinct. I had to herd him on to the sheep for the first few lessons! I think it's a problem of confidence rather than instinct.

Tunagirll I had pretty negative experiences with 2 of the 'foster-out'-style rescues in WA too. The first group I called I had to call 4 different people before I found anyone who even knew where the dog was Turned out it had already been adopted by a fosterer anyway. The second group just didn't get back to me for ages, by the time they did I'd already adopted Fox since I assumed it was a 'no' (which it was). I ended up getting my dogs from Shenton Park & K9, who were both great

I thought it was specifically the Melbourne LDH that people were concerned about the kill rate? Never heard anything either way about Brisbane (but of course I'm not local, so could be way off)

Staffyluv - this just popped up in my FB feed and I thought of you :) - Become more exciting than a squirrel

With my limited sample size of 2, this has been my experience too (and by accident rather than design, since they are 'lucky dip' shelter dogs). Everything that makes Fox a beautiful agility dog causes her trouble in herding, and vice versa for Weez. The main things with Fox are that she has so much people-focus she will sometimes stop in the middle of an outrun to look at her handler, or even trot over to him if she's not sure what to do. She is also so kinetic and loves to move which means doing an agility course is quite self-rewarding but it's a bit too much for working sheep through a chute. She's still got her PT and will be trialling this year, it just takes a bit more thought and time to teach her some aspects of herding. Weez on the other hand is more inclined to listen to his instincts than Fox is, which makes him able to herd nicely with less direction. But in agility makes it harder to keep him focussed and I have to work more to ensure he is actually listening to me. He is also more 'efficient' (lazy) which keeps the sheep calmer but means he needs to be rewarded more often in agility. So I would say there are different traits I would look for if I wanted a dog specifically for one sport or the other in future. And if I had to pick only one of my current dogs for each sport it would be a no-brainer. Although as it stands they're both going to have be happy with herding since our agility club has folded

Yep, recall is the best way to stop problems before they start :) Dogs Ziggy's age are well known for going a bit dumb, it's just a matter of working through it. From the other side, my girl is definitely one who would react negatively to the approach you describe. But it is my job as her owner to teach her an alternative behaviour to getting growly. Every time she starts getting tense about another overexuberant dog I call her back in. I know the other dog is just trying to be friendly but I also know my girl will never reciprocate so the best thing is to just call both dogs off and leave it at that. If the other owner is at least attempting to call their dog off I really appreciate it, so I think it's great you are mindful it is a potential issue and want to curb it :) Edit: re. my above comment, it wasn't the fact the dog was lying down that I was concerned about but putting it in a 'stay'. If the dog does hold the stay but is uncomfortable with the other dog it would be causing him stress, and if he broke the stay to get away from the dog it is damaging the command. But then I have more aloof dogs than most so if your dog loves all other dogs it might not be an issue

Ahhh teenagers :rolleyes: :laugh: All I have to add is to learn to read his body language early. He'll let you know when he's about to play up, you just have to look close and act quick! :p Just IMHO, but I wouldn't be comfortable with this at all It would put my dog in a very vulnerable position, plus if he decided he had to break the stay to get away from the new dog quickly it would weaken his down-stay. I don't have the same problems as the OP but that's just my $0.02.

I suspect this is the biggest part of it (except in reverse). Depending on the depth of the gene pool at the founding of the breed the best working dogs may have come from a common line which happened to carry a certain colour or pattern. So when selecting the best workers the colour just got carried along for the ride. Of course we can't discount human bias, if they get the idea that browns are better and have a choice of a black and a brown sire for their good working bitch they go with the brown, and get a good working litter that fulfils their preconceived expectations. I've also read on this forum of people hearing it said sheep won't respect cream kelpies I can't for the life of me figure out why they don't place 2-tone kelpies, I think they are gorgeous I have a sneaking suspicion it's because some want to distance the working lines from the show lines FWIW though my 2-tone kelpie has much more natural herding instinct than my solid colour girl

If you aren't comfortable doing that straight-up you could practice a "please" behaviour (so if the dog wants something his default behaviour is to sit, for example) with something of lower value first then work up to the ball. Just everytime the dog wants anything, he has to sit first (if that's the behaviour you decide you want), and like Kavik & Pers said, never give in even if you have to wait or walk off & ignore him until he settles. My girl is really strongly ball obsessed. She will bring us balls to throw all day if we let her, and she throws a small fit if she loses one under the couch :rolleyes: Nothing else exists when I have a ball in my hand. It took about 8 months of on & off training from when I adopted her to the point where I can put her in a down-stay and throw the ball over her head and she will remain with her eyes locked on me until she's released. Purely with the reward of throwing the ball she has an excellent recall, excellent "stop", will down-stay from across an oval and I never have to worry about her running off. That ball obsession is pure gold to our training, it just takes some patience to build structure to the obsession. I have trained my boy in the same way but mostly with food and Premack rewards and he is nowhere near as reliable.

There are heaps of self-control games you can do as well which might help :) Maintaining eye contact while you hold a treat out to the side is a good one, or even training a 'wait' at the door all help build a dog that thinks before it acts. If you can wait him out with the ball without losing too much skin and only throw it when he is waiting quietly this will be a huge step in his learning how to get what the wants in an acceptable way. (As an aside, I loooove it when dogs are this excited about an object. I call it "obesession training" - basically +R training on steroids because you are both providing the dog with a huge reward, and teaching them to work when their brain is in high gear. I would adopt another ball-obsessed dog in a heartbeat.) A verbal marker is fine for most of what I have described. I too am ridiculously uncoordinated with the clicker :laugh:, especially when I have 2 leashes. I use 95% verbal markers ("yes!") and only pull out the clicker for precision work (e.g. teaching the difference between 'play dead' and 'roll over'). But practice always helps, you can start at home without the leash and with treats in your pocket or ready in your other hand :)

I'm a fan! I often harness 'dog power' to get disposal-related jobs done :p

You've just biased your study right there. Agree with Aidan, check the literature to see if the experiment has been done under controlled conditions by professional scientists.

That's a good point too - since more dogs are motion reactive the 'looking' was probably developed with them in mind. The only important part is that you are setting the dog up to "tell" you when he sees something exciting. The cue part is just to get the dog to learn the game, then what you want is the dog to think "hey, there's that thing going on over there! Better tell mum and collect my reward". Instead of the dog just having no framework for dealing with overstimulation and flipping out.

You could develop a "fluffiness" test, or evaluate its size:cute ratio :laugh:

What kind of treats? I've noticed it's a word that gets used for Staffords a lot. I wonder if it's something about their expression :laugh:

You don't have to start with a stimulus. You can begin training LAT in your backyard with a neutral object. When he looks at the thing (it could be a towel) click & reward. Then once he's offering the look nicely, add your cue & point (my cue is "there!"), until you can cue the behaviour reliably. Then you can start generalising to other still objects, then moving objects, then work up to stimulating objects. I think the majority of dogs would react to kids running past shrieking! It is a perfect combination of noise, movement & excitement that is doggy overstimulation utopia Edit: If he is starting to get wound up, I would take him away from the class after the first instance and do some focus exercises (look-at-me, high-fives, heels, throwing-treat games) until he was back to a lower excitement state and then slowly move back towards the class. Then retreat again if needed rather than letting the excitement escalate. Personally I find focus exercises much easier to implement than calming exercises, but then I have workaholic dogs :laugh:

So I take it you're not a big fan of grooming then SM :laugh:

Ours are almost the same! Toy - Chihuahua Small - Schipperke Medium - Kelpie Large - GSD Giant - Wolfhound :laugh: :laugh: I like feisty dogs! :p

I'm not so sure about size categories either But anyway - Toy - Min Pin Small - Schipperke Medium - Kelpie Large - Groenendael, Terv or GSD Giant - Deerhound or Wolfhound :D

As Steph has no hesitation in telling me, it is entirely my fault that he is too close on sheep :laugh: He hasn't learnt the bad behaviour on ducks so he still keeps a really nice distance. He used to have good distance on sheep too, but because he has such good instincts and I am such a noob I have adjusted my handling to fit him rather than insisting he do it right, so we're back to some basics this year

I just checked and it closes on the 9th of April, so we've both still got some time! Now I just have to work out how to order a chequebook.... Thanks for the encouragement, I just spoke to Tom and he agreed so we'll enter both dogs under you and Steph and see what comes of it! Weez was starting to understand the command for backing off last time we trained on sheep so maybe another session or so and I'll be able to walk around without sheep attached to my butt

What Kavik said - you can't see it but the park is a wonderland of new and exciting smells! Some dogs have trouble hearing and smelling at the same time :D Investing in a long line should help. E: by analogy, it's a bit like asking someone to study for an exam in a shopping mall. It can be done, but you'll need to lower your expectations of how much you'll get done. And the more you've covered the material at home, the easier it gets under distraction :)

Thanks, might just do that! His outruns, stops and walk-ups are probably good enough to trial with, it's just his flanks that are way too close. Not sure how much training we'll end up getting in the next few weeks either with the Aussie pups on the way :D But like you said, worth a try Do you know if trial entries are still open? I keep meaning to check Canine News but it's been pretty hectic lately