Weasels

Oh man you're really testing my memory now! :p Sorry I can't remember, but I think I saw it relayed second-hand in an article so it could well have been PR :)

Perhaps if you could find a good Veterinary behaviourist? Someone who has the medical knowledge to understand Jake's physical issues but also has a behaviour specialisation to help with his socialisation & anxiety. And they would also be able to prescribe medication if needs be. More hugs :)

If you can find a way to make yourself nervous, then try training, you could get an insight into how it will affect you both. I'm sure I read somewhere one of the top agility trainers deliberately uses stiff body language and stilted commands in training so the dog is accustomed to how she gets in the ring. I haven't done obedience, but when I trial in herding I remind myself it's just me, Weez and the sheep out there. We're in our own little bubble. And the worse thing that can happen in herding is a sheep breaking it's neck from being run into a fence, I would prefer the worst scenario in an obedience trial any day! :D

I'm inclined to agree. Although I balance it out by reminding myself they think a pile of sheep poo is a gourmet lunch. From my understanding corn is not ideal because it can affect serotonin balance, so if a dog is unsettled or hyperactive corn should be looked at as a possible contributor. But plenty of dogs aren't affected by it. Just like some people can't handle dairy,or gluten, or red food colouring, the individual differences are just too great to say what will be best until it's tried out for a good amount of time. And there might not be one best diet, there could be plenty of options that work. Puking once is no big deal. Watch her coat condition, her body shape and her behaviour and tweak if you think something should change. I spent about 6-8 months figuring out the type and amounts of food that provide a good balance between nutrition, availability and efficiency. Be patient :)

Why would they be so hostile against clickers? I don’t understand how it would be a bad way of training? Does anyone know the argument against clickers? We used clicker training for our Frenchie and she picked up all her training so quickly! From my personal experience, it has been an excellent way to train my puppy by targeting the right behaviours. I know, weird right? And not just "our trainers don't use clickers" but actually chasing down people just for having one of "those things" in their possesion, like they're trying to bring drugs into a schoolyard or something. And I've heard this from more than one person separately.

Or you could buy whole raw chickens, take off the good bits for yourself (freeze them if needs be) and give the frame to the dogs? That's pretty cost efficient :)

From all accounts our local club is similar. They are actually overtly hostile towards clickers and will chase someone across the oval to tell them off for having one I would join up in a heartbeat if they weren't like that because they train on the only day I'm not working or herding

I really don't have a hidden agenda here. I mention prongs with e-collars because they are both tools many people have an opinion on whether they will or won't use. My only point is to support that people are free to chose what methods they use with their own dogs. If using a certain method takes 3 times as long but the handler is dedicated and happier using it, then I'd hate to see someone ridiculed for that. Whether the trainer recommending each method is a cackling dog-hating warlock, the warmest fuzziest +R trainer on earth, or a competent professional balanced trainer is not related to my point.

By reference to WA I meant that we have a reputation for being heavily biased towards purely reward-based training, and that is what I encounter most places I go. Most of the alternatives I have found are yank & crank clubs that I wouldn't let train my goldfish, there isn't much in between. I know plenty of people on the extreme end of the 'purely positive' scale that would not go to any trainer who uses e-collars purely on principle, so by comparison I thought the comments in this thread were perfectly reasonable - she had a consult about it, it wasn't the right fit for her, she moved on. K9 I can't say I have a view of what you do at all really, clouded or otherwise Although I will be sure to rectify that by having a read of your book. PM's comments were quite non-specific about who she was referring to as a few names were thrown around in the thread, and it could only be deduced from an unrefuted comment by someone else. I purely felt the need to jump in because I believe it is important for people to follow the training method that suits them, and was taken aback by the response she got. But the original matter seems to be settled among the parties now :)

I'm glad to hear that, and perhaps 'pushed' was too strong a word from PM's description reading it back, so I apologise. Perhaps it's a cultural thing. In WA it seems pretty common for clients to pick and choose their trainers based on the use of equipment like shock collars and prongs. These aren't value-neutral tools in a lot of people's minds. PM made a choice about what methods were right for her and her dog and it made me uncomfortable to see her get lol'ed for it.

Regardless, the trainer Poppy's Mum consulted was obviously pushing a method she wasn't comfortable with and wasn't going to follow through with, so the consult wasn't successful. Which is at least half the art of professional dog training - dealing with the people.

I know someone who really uses putting their dog on-lead as a punishment (associated with a bit of yelling and angry looming), the result is a dog that goes zooming off every time she pulls out the leash and is difficult to catch when it's time to go home I prefer making being on-lead just a different (hopefully better) kind of fun :D Makes 'em heaps easier to recall when we're leaving!

:) Ooooh maybe I'll see her Terv about on our travels then I'm almost certain I saw a pair of Tervs outside a pet supply store in Port Kennedy a couple of months ago (although I couldn't get a good look), it was all I could do not to run over like a 10-year-old and ask to pat them!

Mine do - although I had the advantage of working from home for the first 6 months of having them, so I was able to redirect them every time they started to sniff, and they never got the chance to get a reward out of the bin! That helped a lot. Edit - I've also used purely reward training to teach them not to counter-surf, not to chew things except their own toys, and toilet training. They have the run of my house's living areas and the kitchen all day during the week and i've never come home to find anything out of place. I'm happy with that level of reliability. I've even accidently left a plate covered in crumbs on a dog-height coffee table all day and came home to find it untouched :) Dogs are awesome. They will do their best to figure out what we're trying to communicate to them. Mine learn best with a clicker and a reward, whether it's food, a toy, or a pat. Cutting out one of their two favourite rewards (food) would just make things go slower. Not all dogs are overly motivated by food of course, but it's a nice quick, clear reward for those that are.

Pork is very fatty, it doesn't agree with all dogs. Probably better as a treat than a regular food :)

If the dog is working to avoid it, it's aversive. I use an aversive whenever I say "HEY!" - it doesn't have to be physical. Unless it's an urgent situation, if my dogs do something I don't want them to, I'll tell them to do something incompatible instead. Like if they start sniffing at the bin, they get sent to their mat and rewarded for that instead. So now the mat is more rewarding than the bin.

I certainly wasn't trying to pick on anyone, and I thought gsdog2's post was very respectful in tone. I suppose in the same way there are many people who can't understand why the "purely positive"/reward-based trainers won't consider any aversive training methods, us hippies have trouble understanding it in reverse (not that I would say I'm purely positive, but it's certainly my first port-of-call).

Sorry, can't resist :p Here's my treat-trained dog 2 days ago. Not obese I don't think? Edit - honestly I'll use any extra food I can get into her, she runs around so much she starts looking a little skeletal if I'm not careful :/

Hi, I am still interested in the question I asked above, if you wouldn't mind answering :) Does your dog gets its meals for free? There are other people who I respect who I've seen say this too, and I just don't get why you wouldn't leverage such a deeply ingrained primary reinforcer (literally a life-or-death desire to eat) to get a behaviour.

Oooo get a Belgian! Are you SoR or NoR? Very SoR! I've already got Midniara to agree to help us find one when the time is right :p And if she happens to have a litter on the ground when we're ready, well..... I might be bugging the hell out of her for a Groen! :D

Ohmigosh they are just the best looking pair of dogs :love: I'm pretty sure our next dog will be a Belgian, although quite a few years down the track yet :D Until then I'm just gonna admire these handsome devils, 'kay? :p

I don't think it will stop as long as dogs exist. You can't take the risk out of life. We have taken predators into our homes and communities because we (as a species) have decided the benefits outweigh the risks. But those risks still exist, like Rebanne said any dog can bite, just like any human could turn around and stab you. There are a million different reasons for an attack, macho idiots owners is only one. And although we may have opinions on who shouldn't own a dog, or drive a car, or have kids, realistically these people are always going to be out there doing all those things and not the slightest bit interested in changing.

I've tried training him with a clicker and some beer, but he just ends up getting really offended See that's where is getting confused Wease....just beer..hhmm beer :laugh: Yeah, it's tough when he can go out and get his own beer. I'd better start him on NILIF until he realises that he must work for every beer

I've tried training him with a clicker and some beer, but he just ends up getting really offended

Honestly.... more often than not, it's my husband.