Blackdogs

I'm wary of any dog displaying 'keep away' body language or dogs roaming unattended in packs. Other than that, I tend to discount breed. I have been bitten twice by two different breeds (Akita and Poodle) in the line of work. Both were euthanised due to the extreme severity of their issues. Both dogs' issues were man made.

Reread the title of your thread and you might be able to see why I focussed on whether or not the video showed "play". It seemed to be the point you were focussed on making. I agree that there is play. However there is not play between breeds of disparate size or between a wide range of dogs. Furthermore, Im not sure how this video contributes to any BSL issue. I've had my fair share of close encounters of the worst kind with dogs of fighting ancestry who've been interested in doing damage to my dogs. The presence of one of those breeds would stop me in my tracks if i didn't know the dog. That hasn't led me to conclude they should be wiped from the face of the earth and frankly when I don't have my dogs with me, they are usually dogs I'm pleased to see. As I said, this is an excellent example of controlled socialisation. I'd love to see it pinned in the puppy thread. Ok. If you can't see it after I have explained it, there's just nowhere to go from here. I'm going to let this conversation die a quick death now.

:thumbsup:

I'm pro dog parks. I'm just anti the kind of person who thinks that their dog should be able to do anything it likes in them and bugger everyone else because "the dogs will sort it out". I will also tell you that management and control will not make some dogs suitable for the kind of activity you see in that video. No amount of socialisation will override the behaviour hard wired into some dogs. And some breeds will be over represented in the "this is not for my dog" category. Great Danes are not one of the breeds I worry about by the way. Maybe we differ on what you mean by play. Wagging your tail ain't playing where I come from. Most canine play behaviour mimics hunting or fighting activity. It's practice for it. There's at least one dog in that video not enjoying the situation.. can you spot it? With regards to your initial remark, I'm not sure where I suggested that was the case. Whether they're playing or not wasn't really the point of the video. You seem to have collected one word and ran with it. Though, there's plenty of actual 'play' happening in that video. Particularly between the Amstaff and the Neo, which is nice to see. I also don't remember stating that all breeds have the same play-drives or thresholds, just that it 'can' (not always) be achieved. I.e, for BSL proponents, the message here would be 'not all mastiffs and amstaffs are killing machines'. If you're referring to the Rottweiler puppy not enjoying him/herself, well, it's natural for some puppies to be unsure, but certainly socialisation is a great way to remedy that. Whether or not you think that the owners of the Rottweiler should have stepped in is also not really relevant in the grand scheme of the message.

I've seen dogs derive great joy simply from standing, staring and wagging their tails furiously at the other dog without doing much (dogs that know each other well and have never scrapped, i.e, this is not mistaken prey drive). I would classify this as play. But I guess it doesn't matter too much about wording, as long as people enjoy the video and get the message! Thanks for the positive comment.

I'm not "tearing the post to pieces". I'm disagreeing what you say the video represents. It is not an "allbreeds play session". Dogs greeting, sniffing and moving away from one another are NOT 'playing'. What you're watching is controlled socialisation in which a few offlead dogs play. Given the situation, I'd be very surprised to see a brawl. What you have to ask yourself of course is why so many dogs are on lead. The answer would appear to be to control the number of offlead dogs and restrict any of those whose reactions may not be known. Very sensible socialisation under the supervision of a trainer. It should be shown to all baby puppy owners as an example of what 'controlled socialisation' looks like. As I said, you won't see it done that way down the dog park. I'm sensing some kind of anti-dog park agenda here. Ok, that's fine. Perhaps you can make a post about that if you want to discuss the drawbacks dog parks. We're on two different pages. The video's message is pretty simple: with the correct supervision, socialisation and knowledge, peaceful 'interaction', 'socialisation', 'play' or any other form of close-up or distant communication between dogs, regardless of of breed, can be achieved. No one is sugesting you throw your Toy Poodle into the mouth of the next random Great Dane that you see.

To reiterate, there's not a lot of 'playing in harmony' going on in that video. Not all interaction is 'play'. A few dogs of roughly equivalent size play but that's it. I'm not going to go back through the video to point out which breeds are interacting with which at which time and in which manner because I honestly can't be bothered. It seems that the majority of the dogs in that video are enjoying the company of other dogs, whether you want to classify it or playing or something else. Certainly, if you want to get down to semantics I'm happy to alter the phrase 'play' to 'interact', but I stand by the word 'harmony', as there are clearly no brawls going on and this was my initial point. I'm really not quite sure why you're so intent on tearing this post to pieces? I thought it was a nice positive post with a great message in light of the recent BSL hysteria.

Agree - to a point. Any interaction between a 3kg dog and a 65kg dog will have its issues. Some breeds also have temperaments that will make them more or less open to play invitations from others. Well, I think it's about being sensible and knowing your dog. I've known people to own both mastiffs and chihuahuas with few problems, so I will have to disagree with the sweeping statement that 'any' interaction between dogs of differing sizes has its issues. In relation to your second point, again, it's about correct socialisation and management of the breed. To reiterate, it obviously 'can' be done under the right circumstances, as illustrated by this video.

I'm not trying to prove that all dogs of any breed will always get along with all other dogs at any time in any context. I think, rather, it's a good example of what can be achieved with the correct supervision, control and socialisation. The point is, that breed does not have to be an issue.

In light of recent BSL related threads I thought you all might be interested in watching this fun video of different breeds playing in harmony. Breeds I've spotted in this video include, Neopolitan Mastiffs, Staffies, Amstaffs, white fluffies, Jack Russells, Rottweilers, Labradors, Golden Retrievers, British Bulldogs, German Shepherds, Staghounds, Malamutes, Border Collies and other dogs of mixed breed.

Ridiculous. I know of a lovely couple with two beautiful staffords that have been declared dangerous for killing a chicken. People don't seem to understand what dogs are anymore. Best of luck.

Go to the vet and ask for Vivitonin. This drug increases blood flow to the brain and decreases dementia symptoms often dramatically.

Oh, excellent.

Rough Collie.

Not very long, apparently. I just found the page.

Hah. Got a link?

Franklin? Still, I'm glad it's hard to own automatic and semi-automatic firearms in this country. ;) Hey, he may have been a gun nut, but at least he was eloquent about it.

I agree. Blackdogs needs to send that out to the newspapers. Well done, BD! Thanks. I've sent this in to the Herald Sun as per your suggestion. I'm dubious as to whether they will publish it on account of the inclusion of main stream media slamming, however.

I guess I meant to make people think, with that title, so they actually came in and read the text. The use of the term 'problem' here refers not to the nature of dog bites/attacks but their prevalence.

You're absolutely right. Targeting Pitbulls and their crosses is outrageous. But people need to be affected before they're in a position to take it to court, so we need to hear from those people.

Go for it!

Not at all. Spread the word.

Politicians seem to be under the impression that we can wipe out dog attacks. This is never going to happen. As long as we live with dogs there will be dog bites, just as living with cars will beget car accidents, living with people will ensure violence and living with stairs will mean scores of trip-related accidents. Statistically, dogs cause much fewer injuries than do cars. I imagine people and stairs probably fall into the same category. If you think about it, it's amazing that we can live with another powerful species who don't speak our language and come out of it so well. It doesn't matter whether or not we manage to reduce the number of dog bites, as long as there are any dog bites at all there will be media hype creating public panic. So when does the regulation stop? When there are no more breeds to eradicate? When dogs can no longer leave their yards without a leash and muzzle? There is no 'dog bite problem'. There is just 'life' and living will always entail a landmine of potential dangers, but limiting life to the point where it's not worth living is not the answer. This is where we are heading with over-regulation, not just of dogs and dog ownership but in many other areas. Once legislation is passed it is rarely abolished and we are living in a litigious society with a mainstream media that feeds off public fear. As a result, legislation is stacked upon legislation in an increasingly suffocating and repressive living environment. The perceived 'dog bite problem' is just another symptom of this media hype/moral panic/legislation carousel. Benjamin Frankin said, "Those who would give up essential liberty to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety". These words are as relevant today as they ever were, though I would add the word 'perceived' to the above quotation in this case, as the mindlesss destruction of harmless pets will do nothing to increase safety. Education, not legislation is the key. I encourage you all to write to your local MP expressing your grievances and paste the letter here so that other, perhaps less eloquent or more time-strapped members can recycle it. If these laws are expanded to include ANKC registered breeds then we need to come together as a group, pool our finances/resources and hire a good lawyer to fight the case in court. Extreme legislation needs to be met with landmark court rulings to halt the gradual erosion of rights. This is is a fight from which we cannot afford to back down, and thankfully I know that the people of this community have the passion and dedication to make history happen.

Aren't Staffords in the top three most popular Australian breeds? Good luck with those class action suits, council.

This doesn't seem legit to me.