BlackJaq

DiscoDobe, I agree. There seem to be a strong sentiment that only puppies are worth money, anything else should be dirt cheap or free. This despite the fact that most people can't mange to teach their dog to walk on a leash and shit outside, you'd think they would be happy to pay for a dog that has already been taught stuff... I don't get that at all. With horses, the better trained the horse the more money you can generally ask..... With dogs, unless you are flogging it as a "rescue", you have trouble getting any kind of money for a dog, even just an older puppy. Genuine working dogs (like sheep dogs or working pig dogs) seem to be a bit different I guess, so maybe it is mostly the "pet market"? That guy certainly didn't expect to have me ask for a large mount of money for the dog, not sure what he thought would be a fair price?

We have five dogs here now and the only one who is allowed to bark is the Maremma, because that's his job. The size of the paddock he guards depends on which one the poultry are in obviously and he barks more in the bigger paddocks. When he is in a small or very small paddock he is almost completely quiet because it is easy to keep things out of it, being a small paddock and right next to the house. Everyone else gets told to zip it or even squirted with the hose, unless we have a visitor, everybody goes bananas at visitors (being out of town it is rare for anybody to turn up here). Even when the Maremma barks the other dogs stay quiet now. They are not dumb, they learn what is on and what is not. The last two years before we moved out of town we lived next door to two chained dogs whom I repeatedly had the urge to cave their heads in with a brick. You'd literally fart at night and they would go off for hours. Speaking to the guy was pointless because even though he was home all day, he was off his ass on drugs and mostly wouldn't even hear me knocking on the door. Right after we moved, he moved, too. Go figure. I think that was the only time I ever seriously considered killing somebody's dogs in a violent and bloody fashion. (Council was useless, had no interest at all and OH knew the guy so I wasn't allowed to go blow up his mail box to send a message :p :p)

Funnily enough, this happened to me few times with my Weimaraner, too. Guy goes: "You wana sell your dog?" I goes "You got fifteen hundred bucks?" (This is what I paid at 8 weeks) Guy goes "WTF" the look on his face was priceless lol :p Not that I would actually sell her, but if I would, he certainly did not look like he could afford her, I have spent a lot of time, money and effort training this dog, she isn't going cheap!

Aw no Weimaraners

Wow who does that....

I have an unidentifyable bully mix, too, and she is always smiling and happy to do anything at all. I do not think I have seen any Eastern European Shepherds around but to be honest, I would probably assume they are a cross bred if I did see one. Husky x seem to happen regularly around here. We have two more Weimaraners in town that I know of, but most purebreds I see around here are doing agility at my club, I don't see them much out and about walking. We have lot of fat labs and some Borders and Kelpies, which are the main ones I have noticed being walked. Everything else seems to be bully x, SWF, sheepdog crosses and pigging types, bull arab and wolfy x There may be more but I live out of town now and I mostly see the dogs that are being walked, which are very small in number comparea to the amount of dogs that actually live in town. I also see the ones that are just loose I guess, mostly neglected looking SWFs, JR x and bully or sheep dog types. In my agility club there are Weimarners (including mine), a Vizsla, BC, Dalmatian, several Cavvies and some SWF and bully types (including mine), some labs (one is very reactive) and a Blue Heeler is looking to join, but he is so reactive he wears a muzzle now and Foxy has already received a beating off him (and the lab, too). Not sure what is in the beginner groups now as I am not currently in those, I think there is a Blue pedigree AmStaff but he is pretty poor looking example of the breed, though happy and friendly at least. Not too many purebred GSDs that get to leave their yard around here, one was doing agility for a bit, but owner quit.

And so she should.

I think it would be hard to say since they look almost exactly the same as an oversized GSD and the trend for many breeds to become bigger and bigger might make it impossible to tell just by looking at them. You would need the owner to tell you, so most people would just call it a GSD or GSD x even if they did see one. Are they a recognized breed here?

Great photo! I am a little curious how they keep their dogs after reading last night that wolves will kill and eat dogs in Alaska, especially if they are kept chained or kennelled somewhere secluded where a wolf may easily enter. Sorry, it is a morbid topic, I was just wondering if they took special precautions or anything in their yard

No mention of potential environmental factors for HD.. Nice. And I agree, the dog does look a little overweight. I would also like to point out that the clip said Dancing Gate agreed to pay $500, not was forced to. I do not agree with names being named publically and making people targets for animal rights nutters when that person has not actually been convicted of any wrong doing. This does not mean I am a fan of that particular kennel, but I can see how a disgruntled puppy buyer or even several can quickly bring a breeder down, even if the breeder has been doing everything in their power to produce healthy, happy dogs. Getting a large breed puppy, feeding it fat and exercising it excessively can quickly damage your puppy. This my get expensive. Your breeder will probably not want to pay for the thousands of dollars a hip replacement can cost. Now puppy buyer is not only sad but angry and proceeds to tell the world about their misfortunes.... Not saying this is what happened here, but it could easily happen to any breeder. Would you want to have your name plastered all over the media and internet, denouncing you as a puppy farm, when you have actually done everything in your power to produce good puppies? Would you want people hanging around your property, ambushing you for "interviews" for public scrutiny when you go out to get groceries? Would you want people filming your property and possibly entering to get more footage, when they know you are out? How can you defend yourself against that kind of onslaught?

Well it is a deliberate cross that is willfully being produced and sold. Ignoring it won't make it go away.

Great news! I agree that separating dogs for feeding might be a good idea to avoid any future problems )

A little part of me died when I realized there was an actual thing called "Weimadoodle"

I have to wonder if some people are simply not able to walk and control their dog on leash and are hence refusing and quoting "their bond" and all that other rubbish... I wonder if the owners of various dogs that entered our property but never left were spouting the same rubbish and whether they even noticed that Fifi failed to return from his daily morning stroll round the surrounding farms?

I don't know, if they failed to install an off switch then in my opinion they kind of skipped a very important part of the whole training process. Do you think they did this intentionally with that particular dog? And if so, how would they expect to control that dog themselves? Personally I have a gundog breed that is sometimes trained in bite work in the country of origin, Germany. I am not knowledgeable enough (yet?) to be able to tell if my particular dog would be suitable or not for bite work but I do hunt with her and she has a very clear on and off setting. Without the working off setting she would be pretty useless to me as taking her anywhere would be painful, if not impossible. I very much appreciate the effort that goes into teaching a dog any behaviour reliably but really, if you fail to give the dog the option to live a normal life when not on the job, I find that to be a remarkable fail.

Well, I think this pretty much sums it up ETA: Quote is from the article I posted earlier ;) http://www.atlbanana.com/local-dog-owner-struggling-with-off-leash-addiction/

Because in conjunction with the ideas of the GSDC and ANKC, all bitework is dangerous and encourages aggression towards people and we don't want that we just prefer big working breeds that we try to cram in the wrong pigeon hole of basic training and when they fail, we blame the dog. Worst fate is euthanising it because it can't conform. Thats as far as the logic went. We just have more easily swayed people down here to create the laws hence they came through. Prong collars used on a dog come under animal cruelty and can get you charged or I think the fine is now up to $10,000. E collars, technically too you need to be under supervision of a veterinarian or recognised dog trainer (and by recognised the Vic Government only recognises certain groups - Delta, Gentle Modern School of Dog Training etc as ACTUAL dog trainers) So you need supervision from someone who has no idea how to actually use the collar properly in order to train the dog BRILLIANT! Euthanising a dog because it hasn't been channeled or controlled with the right equipment is not cruelty. Burning horns off baby ruminants with no anaesthetic and letting them pass out from pain is not cruelty. Farming dogs on mass with little attention, no proper interaction and no decent life is not cruelty. No Joe Hillbilly can buy whatever he wants to train the dog. Constriction means we're losing the ability to understand and rationalise these animals properly. The public NEEDS to see bitework demonstrations as far as I'm concerned to FULLY understand how difficult it is to train some dogs properly and what dedication is required to do it. Potential owners should be playing with trained dogs a bit and see what intensity they can have and how reality is sooooo different from YouTube. Smart arses who think bitework is funny or don't take it seriously need to be put in a suit and let a couple of good hard dogs bite through. The bruises will remind them of the potential consequences of their actions. Aye to that, banning it does not delete the knowledge of its existence from everybody's mind. It hadn't really occurred to me what a disaster a poorly chosen dog of bad temperament "trained" by somebody who is not actually knowledgeable could be... And that somebody would not have anything real to compare to either. scary!

Seems you might be one of those.. lol http://www.atlbanana.com/local-dog-owner-struggling-with-off-leash-addiction/

Don't be logical :laugh: We have a massive problem and the laws have been a great causative. Of course a lot of breeders and decent trainers left the state to go follow their passions, working dogs have less and less ability to outlet their natural drives. We have one dogsport club left pretty much in the state (although that will be changing soon ;) ) My main client base is working breeds for the school as we offer so many structured outlets - tracking, trailing, SAR, scent detection, competitive AUS/IPO obedience, agility etc and we stay small so dogs can actually get proper time with a trainer. I have dogs coming down from throughout the state, dogs written off as aggressive, untrainable etc because this sportdog type training is disappearing and of course it's what they need. Boredom breeds destruction, that goes for mentally as well. You can't argue with over 100 years of training tailored towards these dogs. My oldest client just turned 60 and I'm helping her now with her second dobermann. She can easily handle the dog, not get pulled over or have the dog out of control and I'm trying to convince her to go enter a few competitions with her as she's done such a good job with the dog, it's not even 12 months yet. The dogs I see here where I live with the potential to bite are frustrated, under trained (I wont say untrained as most of the owners do try and do they best they can with what information they can get) and/or of average genetics. How sad, and of course it is only the law abiding people being punished because old Joe Hillbilly is not going to tell anybody that he works his dogs with a welding glove down the back.... I have to say though, I don't think I have heard of many actual attacks in Australia where the dog was directed to attack by the owner. You'd think that shit would be all over the news. The only one that comes to mind is the guy who was murdered after siccing his dogs on several people, I forget where. So what is their reason for banning it? I guess they would have similarly harebrained justifications as for bsl....

WTF

Technically it's written the dog 'biting' anything attached to a human. Steve Austin from NSW was at a pet expo and was playing tug with his dog and got told off for doing it. So by word of the law if you use a tug toy or bite pillow you hold in your hands that counts as bitework. Wonderful isn't it. Like I said there is provisions in the law for licensed security businesses who get a permit to do the work, but the dogs then have to be muzzled. It's why the security dog industry has pretty much died compared to other states. Such constrictions, you wonder why we have massive dog problems down here. We technically cannot use a thing or have proper dogsports for dogs that need it. I can't see how bite work is going to have any influence whatsoever on dog attacks, even if the ban is strictly adhered to. Most attacks (pretty much all of them) seem to involve dogs who are not under effective control, i.e. off leash, not secured on property due to crappy fences or lack thereof and I think that lack of training and proper socialization would have to be right up there for causes... And yet they are now looking at tightening laws again and having the onus of proof of dog breed on the owner aren't they They were even talking about adding more breeds to the restricted list... Wonder how long it will take them to realize that their approach is part of the problem

Wow..... What about tug? Tug with a sleeve? Haha anyway... Once again I am left shaking my head over the dog laws down there

What is the point of having a trained security dog and then keeping it muzzled? :p Wow, pretty glad I don't live in Vic, or even more so than before... Is it actually illegal to do bite work with your dog or just no competitions, official training clubs and such?

I walk on the main street a few times a week now that we live out of town because I don't want my dogs to degenerate into feral hermits :laugh: Anyway, only met on lead dogs and only very few of those so far. Once we venture into the residential areas they appear out of nowhere again but none on the main drag for some reason. So far so good.

Wow, must be part of their super enlightened DD laws?