shelby-001

It's terrible that owners are so lax about the care of their own dogs, let alone the impact that lack of care has on other dogs and their owners. I would have done very similarly though, I don't hold back. If the owner was present and trying to take control I would be more understanding and help them gain control, but when they're not in cooey, the dogs would be put in their place well and truly AND I'd be visitng the houses of the dogs, without my dogs ensuring they understand the situation and the seriousness of a FORMAL complaint about DANGEROUS dog behaviour. We got rushed at by a dog off lead yesterday on our midday walk.... went past a building site and the guys dog was wandering, he recalled him as soon as he noticed him running, he had got to us and had a little sniff, but he turned back then he tried to come again by this stage the owner was over to grab him. Boof Lilly & I happily stood firmly still until he gained control, as he was making an effort and the dog was young so training was clearly a WIP. Once he had him, we let them have a little sniff and introduction in a much more controlled way. Then off we went.

Yep that's what I thought as well....... our two LOVE their raw egg day each week! We have 'MY DOG' on hand for emergencies (which I don't forsee happening considering how full my freezer is) but it's the only one I could find that didn't have a million preservatives or pasta or wheat flour etc in it and there was only two varieties that were like this, the others were like all the other brands. It's basically just meat and juicy stuff.

We adopted an 11 month old male (boof) and 4 month old female (lilly) amstaff, they hadn't really been 'taught' to walk on a lead at all, however they weren't unexposed to them as they were quite happy to be put on a lead. Lilly will walk beside me loose lead no pull already (just got lucky with that one I think) Boof on the other hand always wants to be in front. If I let him walk in front of me he doesn't pull, but he does try to set the pace. I was advised to 'tire' him a little before starting our 'walk' so the urge to be so fast and in front isn't so high. This helped immensely so I would recommend a bit of a play before going out as well. We went with doing this as we noticed half way through his walk he would settle and happily walk loose beside me and that's when he gets praise and obviously no correction. We are due to start obedience in a few weeks with them so that should also help us!

Our dogs get a huge variety...... Breakfast: Roo mince or occasionally chicken mince, vegies, cottage cheese or natural pot set yoghurt, once a week I throw a raw egg in each of their bowls. One day a week they get assorted chicken pieces instead of the mince- I get them from our IGA for $2.99/kg and they have legs, wings, thighs etc, (thinking of trying vets all natural muesli but for now I have started using up left over vegies - I wasn't adding any until this week - we've only had them 3 weeks though - adopted them, Boof is 12 months and Lilly is 5 months) Midday occupier: A roo tail, or a chicken carcass, or a piece of roo jerky etc Dinner: A couple of chicken necks, or offal (lamb's heart, lamb's kidney, chicken liver, lamb's fry), or sardines in spring water, or a chicken leg/wing each Bedtime: They get a small bowl of EP Holistic Select Anchovy put out at bed time, they often wake up in the middle of the night after a solid few hours sleep, have a little run, a pee a nibble and back to bed. Between the two they'd share maybe 1 cup! Now as for portions, I work it out depending on what I have out of the freezer for their midday occupiers and dinner as to how much they are fed at breakfast, over the day my big boy gets about 2.5% of his body weight in wet/raw food (which is within the guidelines of 2-3% of bodyweight) and our puppy girl probably gets about 6% of her body weight (which is a bit lower than the advised 10% but she is stacking the weight on so we figure she is getting more than enough). I don't push the big fella to eat any more as he picks at the kibble over night (when she doesn't hog it all, LOL, which is another reason we don't give her more than about the 6%). We have found very quickly that they are much better behaved when full and tired, so now we go for our morning walk, home for breakky.... then they sleep. We have a midday walk, home for occupier and then we sleep. Evening play in the back yard, dinner snack. Then to bed with a bowl of nibbles. Also you'll note there is no beef in there. Boof has some skin issues so a holistic vet has told us to avoid beef and beef offal. This is also why we went on to EP Holistic Select, but after reading the ingredients properly, I can't believe I ever bought the other crap. Edit: They are on annual heartworm injections!

As with any insurance, there are going to be horror stories and dream stories about EVERY company that offers insurance. Sometimes it comes down to whether or not the person that gets the claim is in a good mood or not when they get the claim info. Unfortunately it doesn't matter what company they are working for, anyone can have a bad day, a bad mood, an I dont care moment or what ever. If you look far enough you will find that most pet insurances are underwritten by petsure or hollard, the issues generally (not always) lie in the administration of the insurance policy, not the fundamentals of the policy provided ie: processing the claims etc, which unfortunately is determined by the person processing it. This is exactly why one person will tell you company A is fantastic and someone else will tell you company A is horrible to deal with. It's not the company, it's the person working there and we as consumers have no control over that at all. We know people that have both claimed with the same pet insurance company, for the same issue, one got paid out within a fortnight of submitting their claim, the other took nearly 3 months of toing and frowing with info from vets and eventually got paid out. They were both claiming for hot spots, something you would have thought was common enough and therefore straight forward.

Thank you... I have read a lot in regards to this topic however nothing has been as succinct and clear as this post.

We don't exactly live in a 'city' our town has about 5000 people and one 'real' set of traffic lights - the rest are pedestrian operated only LOL. Our two get around in the back of the ute when ever we need to take them somewhere, ie: down to the beach (not quite 10 minutes away) or to the vet (2 minutes across town). They don't come with us if we have 'other stuff' to do, ie: shopping or doctors or anything, if the trip isn't about them, they stay home. They are always tethered short enough that they can't get to the side of the ute, they can peak through the gap in the head board for wind but that's it. They are both on harnesses not their collars. Most of the time they just sit together or lay down (they are lazy). I do not agree at all with having dogs in the back of a parked, unattended vehicle. If the stop is for 2 minutes then fine but anything more the dog's shouldn't be left there, particularly when unshaded or exposed to rain etc. I get really frustrated by people who do not tether their dogs in at all as well. BUT I get more cranky with people who allow their dogs 'into the car' with them and you see them sitting on the drivers lap with their head out the window, or on the front seat not harnessed in, really anywhere in the car not harnessed in, but particularly on the drivers lap. This poses a whole load of other issues. If you dog is restrained and not left to sit in the elements and it is merely a mode of transport (ie: not left to sit there in parked vehicle) I see no issue.

Our two are up between 6 and 6.30am depending on how late they played until the night before and what the whether is like. The sun starts peaking about 5.15am so I figure they are doing reasonably well, especially given they are on the patio which is on the side of the house that the sun actually rises. They tend to amuse themselves for 15-20 mins then they come and sit at our bedroom door (we have a slider that opens on to the patio), if we pay no attention they snuggle up and wait for us to stir, if they can see we are awake, they whinge, no flies on them pair. They usually have to wait 20 - 30 minutes before we actually go out to them and get ready for our walk.

We pay $84/month for 2 amstaff's one male and one female, that's $15000 per year Accident and Sickness with a $100 excess per condition. Also I get routine cover to the value of $165 per year per dog.

I have just bought Holistic Select (Anchovy, Sardine and Salmon... adult) for my Amstaffs, so I am hoping they like it, do well on it and if so there are no supply issues. It wasn't cheap but they eat a lot of raw roo mince, roo tail, chicken mince, chicken carcasses, chicken offal, sardines and they get raw eggs once a week as well so it's not the bulk of their diet, it just helps to provide some balance. I went with this once as it has no wheat corn or sorghum in it. I got it from a local vet that stocks it but have also found a few online suppliers that are in stock atm.

We're with medibank pvt. We took gold paw option as the extra $9.50 per month per dog got you $165 of routine care, which you are guaranteed to claim as you get those things done regardless and gave us an extra $3000 per year per dog. So we were actually in front $51 each year however we havent made a claim yet so we'll see how that goes. It looks great on paper.

I so know how you feel RosieFT. I have a takeaway shop on the main st of our little town and we see stray dogs EVERY DAY. The ones that actually turn up at the back door (obviously they like the smell of the food) or the ones that are clearly pups with no sense at all and come our side of the road, I grab and lead (I know have a 'lost dog lead' at the back door of the shop) and check for tags, failing tags we walk the four doors up to the vet to check for a microchip, failing a chip it's a call to the council (I hate it when that has to be done). I would dearly love to help every one of them (well close, not the ones we see everyday, I mean the same one everyday) but I can't always just pop out of the shop to rescue a dog and all too often I am greeter with the same, 'oh he's out again'.... well yes lady so do something about it. I keep reminding myself though, if it were my dog I would want someone to stop him/her and take care of them til I could be located. So I do unto them as I would want done unto mine. But yes it's sad not everyone takes the care they should to keep their animals safe.

Wow guys, I too missed any earlier thread than this about this story but it's an AWESOME story. Really hope they have a wonderful life together, sure as hell Andrew deserves it that's for sure! OT but I would never have thought to rename a 9 month old pup.... how's that work! We stuck with the names of the ones we adopted at 4 months and 11 months!

Stumbled across this thread and it reminded me of the pup my brother recently purchased, a Border Collie (sp) cross Maltese x shitzu (sp).... DD or accident or Puppy Mill? Who knows but either way shouldn't have happened in my opinion. Bought from a pet shop.... yep! Any info on care given..... nope! They have done enough research themselves to know what a good diet is at least and didn't fall sucker to feeding something like Hills science diet. The pup actually gets chicken mince & carcasses and beef mince etc. Unfortunately though they are blind to where the pup probably came from and just fell sucker to the puppy dog eyes in the window. It's these 'uninformed' consumers with ample disposable income that drive this sick cycle of puppy breeding/sales in pet stores. They decide on the spur of the moment the 'family needs a pup' and go to the closest location they can fulfill this 'need'. It's instantaneous gratification at it's worst. The desire driven by possibility, credit cards instead of laybuy, ge creditline loans instead of saving, the list goes on, society are so hung up on instant gratification, the decision making process for any consumer purchase has gone out the window and when a living being's life is affected by it, it really is even sadder. I would also like to see a ban FULL STOP on the sale of pups and kittens from pet shops!

I have just sat and read this thread from start to finish.... lets just say some posts gave me a good belly laugh. Yep everyone's got an opinion, some are backed up by fact, others are contradicted by their own presentation of fact and others just don't make sense, but hey everyone is entitled to one right? Well yes, as long as those that don't have sufficient experience and exposure to the animals they are talking about don't have an impact on those that have the power to enforce/change BSL and it's operation in Australia. Why do I say this? Because BSL affects too many people for it to be influenced by inadequately educated and experienced people in the field. Do I agree with BSL? Simply.... NO! Do I have sufficient education and exposure to influence those that manage BSL? NO Why do I disagree with BSL? Because it is incredulously caveman like to believe that animals as intelligent as dogs, that can be trained so precisely will all behave in the same way because they are the same breed. I once read 'nature gives us the parameters of a dog's behaviour and we nurture it to the point at which we want it'. Therefore ALL dogs have the ability to be raised as loving socialized animals or aggressive protection assets. So I definitely believe in JUDGE THE DEED NOT THE BREED and the owners of dogs which have been raised badly should be held accountable for their dogs actions. Nothing is black and white though and I believe each 'DEED' will have it's own set of mitigating circumstances which need to be taken into consideration when dealing with both the owners and the animals. But this is the point in note: every deed should be dealt with individually and breeds not blanketed by BSL! My humble opinion on the table folks.... I'm sure someone will pull it to shreds!

Hey Smiley, I will let you know when I ring them monday to put in a claim, they should be able to clear that up, I read the PDS to see but it wasn't clear cut (to me anyway). Also will let you all know how I go with making a claim. My little man has a mystery skin issue, it doesn't look traditionally like fungal/infected/worm related so the vets are a bit stumped, we've done steroids/antihistamines, now we're moving on to antibiotics and if that doesn't work, when he's neutered in a fortnight they'll do a puncture biopsy and send it off. The spots/lumps/sores (they are very strange) don't bother him in anyway, not sore, not itchy nothing. Just look really ugly poor fella. Also I have purchased flea treatments and had heartworming done so will see how I go on the claim for routine care as well. Cheers Aleesha

That's awesome info, I can't believe I didn't think about it, I swear by it for myself, works wonders on sore throats and wounds so why not for dogs, and can't hurt them. My boof has some spots atm and is on steroids/antihistamines for them, might pop some on to help him out. Thanks again.

I was informed that Petsure underwrote a number of insurance policies with the companies mentioned in the thread, however I have since found out that hollard actually do underwrite Medibank, but petsure do the administration of the policies. I'm sure they are all in bed with each other anyway. Bow Wow informed me that petsure underwrites them, but perhaps it's the same scenario as with medibank, petsure may be the administration arm of hollard. Something worth looking into. Of the 8 I looked at they were all tied up with hollard or petsure.

We went with Medibank Private (as our pvt health is with them) and took the Gold Paws option which gives me a $100 excess and a $15000 limit per year for each dog. On top of that I get a total of $165 per dog per year to go towards routine care, ie: heartworm, flea control, teeth cleans etc. The reason we went with the $100n excess is because given the amount of the premium I didn't want to elliminate a large number of vet visits from claiming. ie: If the bill was only $300 I wouldn't claim if I had chosen the $500 excess. Also when working out the cost, the silver paws option dropped back to $12000 per year and no routine care, the difference was $9.50 per month which was only $114 per year, so by claiming the routine care stuff which I have to pay for anyway, I'm in front $51 and I get an extra $3000 per dog per year. It was interesting to note in all my research that Bow Wow Meow, PIA, 1300Insurance, RSPCA, Pet Plan and even our Medibank Pvt our all underwritten by the same company Petsure. Their products differ slightly to suit the differences people want. The only thing that was notably different was the cost of each (medibank was the cheapest for what you got) but either pet plan or bow wow (I can't remember) had a public liability component. None of the others had that.

My little cherrubs are all over the place, mostly around 6-6.30 am but yesterday I had to get them out of bed at 7.10 to go for their walk, I also thought I was running late when I looked at my phone, lucky for a real clock I wasn't. Phone correctly back on the right time not day light savings times. They are mostly good, if I want to lay there for a while they amuse themselves nicely.

In this context I have often wondered when I've seen puppies advertised as 'bred for temperament'.... I had a chance to see again one of my puppy's brothers at puppy pre-school. My puppy was one of the confident ones there, happy to play and not shy. The brother though was so nervous that he was growling and even had a go at his owner's hands (the lady taking the puppy school knew how to handle this, and by the end of the class the little guy was running around playing with the rest having the time of his life). I really wondered how much of that was due to nurture or whether it was an inherited thing. Well I guess breeders would want to say nurture, because if it is inherited, I guess that blows 'breeding for temperament' out the window. I would though think that it's nurture myself, but I'm no expert.

yeah the kids ones at bigw are about $180 and they hold 36kg, if you google them there are heaps around and not that kind of price tag, the most expensive I saw was $509 for a top of the range gizmo

I can't wait til my 4 month old is old enough to keep up with the bike and take them for a run on that. I sincerely hope it's not illegal in QLD, now I'll have to do some research, it's a wonderful way to exercise them I thought. I also think it will help with my big boy realising he is to be beside, he wants to walk so much faster than what I can do, it's a work in progress training him that he HAS TO STAY BESIDE ME, he's fine when he's stuffed, LOL. We do lots of stopping and turning when we walk so he has to follow me. It's not so much that he is pulling in all directions just wants to go faster. Hence I thought the bike might be just the thing, I used to do it for my aunties dane when I babysat, he loved it. I have even seen bike lead attachment gizmos for sale..... how can they legally be sold if it's illegal to lead a dog on a bike???? Oh and I vote for the trailer on the back, they are my all time favourite for lil kids and dogs

thanks, that's two really great links.... such loving animals and cute

Sorry I completely disagree with this. The fact that your dog may have had APBT in him and the fact that he became "aggressive" towards your daughter are in no way related. And believe me, if he had truely wanted to do damage he most certainly would have. Most dogs need more than "affection, love, regular walks, played with every day, given all the love in the world". They need rules, structure, disapline and (for some) a LOT of training and mental stimulation. The fact that your dog lashed out may have had very little to do with bad breeding or true aggression and more to do with a combination of the dogs personality, poor pack structure and/or lack of respect for you/your child as the dogs "pack leader". Without seeking the advice of a professional you would not know this. And taking an "aggressive" dog to the pound is extremely irresponsible IMO. What were they to do with him? Two options there, rehome or PTS - and no-one rehomes an aggressive dog. He should have either been seen be an experienced behaviourist to determine the problem, or humanely euthanased by a vet. SecretKei I completely agree with your sentiments here, too many misinformed people are prepared to make unfounded generalisations that have no merrit what so ever. This council employee is a prime example. It happens so often in the media too which is why the poor dogs have a bad reputation in society, uneducated people make unfounded statements. If it happened to a 'race' of the human bread it would be discrimination or slander or something of the like. Ie my shop gets held up and I say it was a man of afghanistan decent because of his skin colour. That's harldy fair now is it, since I have no experience in identifying people's national backgrounds based on appearance. There is any number of nationalities or biracial mixes the person could have been. Point in note: it's a massive assumption that is unfounded, like saying the dog must have APBT in it because it turned aggressive. I know a number of pure APBT & crosses that are wonderfully natured and live with little kids no problem at all. Ears and tails tugged on, knocked over you name it, they don't care in the slightest. My two amstaffs are wonderful with my 4 year old nephew, the 4 month old pup nips on occasion but what 4 month old pup doesn't? It's a behaviour we are training her on that isn't acceptable and she listens to my 4 year old nephew when he says no and points his finger at her (at the same time). My brothers cross (border collie x maltese shitzu - spelling?) is terrible she launches at your face to nip, chews everything and has no concept of no. Clearly the nurture factor is at play here. She believes she is the leader of all three in their family. She gets exercise, play time, love, affection, but has NO boundaries, and is laughed at when she does these 'naughty' things, pushed away and then played with again. Not ignored so she realises she's done wrong. The pack is all out of whack in that house. Now I have nothing against border collie's either, my ex in laws owned the most wonderful bc and my aunty owns 2 amazing shitzu (spelling?) crosses, it's just how they are allowed to behave that varies. I appreciate you were upset Mackenzie by the experience it wouldn't be pleasant, but I can't tollerate people like the council man that have no idea and give you such false statements with no backing. With the right training from a professional your dog could have been wonderful. No two dogs will react to the same environment and situations in the same manner as another dog and we as their 'leaders' need to learn how to teach each individual so they can be a wonderful part of our pack. I previously owned a 'bitza' that had no history of parents known, and vets were unable to tell me conclusively what she was, as a pup she looked like a SBT but she grew up nothing like them, or anything else really, she had white fur, black dots on her skin, a similar shape (not size) to a whippet and the few different vets she saw couldn't conclude what she was by appearance, there were thoughts of APBT/SBT/ACD/English Staffordshire Terrier but there was no way to know for sure. That's coming from trained professionals. Personally IMHO I believe nurture plays a much larger role than nature ever can in the true temperament of a dog. Activity levels, intelligence, natural obedience etc may be more likely to be influenced by nature (breed). Just like some humans are naturally lazy or fitness freaks, naturally intelligent or otherwise. (please don't misinterpret that as me likening dogs to humans, it was merely to make my point clear). Others may see it differently and I'm sure they will express their opinion as well.