morgan

Haven't looked into the 3 year protocols, as I never vaccinate after the puppy shots anyway, but this site has numerous links - you might find something in one of the aussie sites - Are Dog Vaccines Necessary?

Rappie - they have obviously learnt from their PR disaster in the 90's when they treated breeders in an extremely shabby fashion when all those pups were dying. Or maybe they have a different standard of response to vets. My vet's experience with the product was not anaphylactic reaction but auto-immune haemolytic anaemia, which does not respond to standard emergency care. Most dogs suffer no ill effects from this product, but that is no consolation to those owners whose dogs die. Studies done on adverse reaction reporting find that less than 10% are reported, so if there was such a huge volume of reports, the actual figures would be scary indeed.

Sounds like the usual scenario of the US withdrawing products from the home market due to safety issues, but still flogging them off abroad to unsuspecting consumers. Was aware they specialised in doing this to third world countries, hadn't realised our station in life wasn't much higher Fort Dodge application - this document shows that collies were monitored for 24 hours for ivermectin toxicity, 12 week old puppies monitored for up to 21 days for adverse reactions and studies on breeding dogs and bitches only appear to have been done on beagles. IMO this study seems very limited in it's scope. AVA response to US recall - this document shows that Proheart 12 was not recalled here after the Proheart recall in the US by the same manufacturer due to the lack of adverse reaction reports. Clicking on the links contained and checking on reaction reports for Proheart 12 here shows 90 reports in 2003 of which half were described as "probable". As adverse reaction reports are found by studies to be less than 10% of the actual number in all countries, the APVMA is being very circumspect in it's recommendations. How many owners take their dogs back to the vet for every single reaction? How many vets actually acknowledge these as reactions to the injection, and of these, how many actually report them? Fort Dodge has a very bad reputation in this country, in the 90's there were many litters and part litters lost after using their products - usually within a week. Many breeders were given very short shrift by Fort Dodge, despite running up massive vet bills trying to save their dying puppies. My vet has not touched any of their standard vaccines since. Unfortunately I think they now have the monopoly on C5 in this country (have heard they supply the bordetella component to other manufacturers, but have not checked this). They are not referred to as "Fort Dodgy" for nothing!

As this is for Proheart 6, it wouldn't have been sent to Australia. You need to find a friendly vet and ask to see the insert supplied with the Proheart 12 injection if you can't find it on the net.

Evelin - here is the link you requested - Wyeth warning letter

What are those dog loos called? Had them there at Expo today - complete with fake grass! Sure they come in several sizes, and are supposed to be easy to clean. It is especially designed for indoors dogs.

Just remembered, there was a stall at the Expo today to promote heartworm injections to the public. When I queried the chap there about the health warning issued by the Canadian Proheart manufacturer he quickly changed the subject, and stated that any deaths from the injection would be fewer than deaths from heartworm. Neatly sidestepped the fact that there were more alternatives to injections than death from heartworm! :D Wouldn't have been so annoyed if there had been a visible document on the established risks so that people could make up their own minds. It is impossible for people to give informed consent to something if they are not given all the information.

You are quite right Puggles - many dogs also die from Rimadyl and other routinely prescribed drugs. Probably more dogs die from this than the Proheart injections. This is why I don't use prescription or over the counter drugs on my dogs. It is also why I am now only going to be using parvo vaccine on my pups and not polyvalent vaccines like C3.

As far as I can see, almost all of the attraction of a peke is that fabulous coat and divine ear feathering - why on earth would anyone want a peke in it's "underwear"

Perhaps there are several who live in this bubble as I have discussed this very subject with at least 4 different vets and their reactions were either that it was internet hype or they were not aware of any need to withdraw the product because of adverse reactions *shrugs* My vet won't use it anymore after two dogs died from auto-immune haemolytic anaemia as a result of him giving them the injections. He was so shocked that he did some basic research and found that this was an established adverse reaction - he said the manufacturer states it is a 1 in 10,000 event, but he certainly didn't give 20,000 injections As a consequence, he decided that the risk wasn't worth it, especially as he was the one who had to tell the owners that their dog was going to die. You only have to look at the manufacturers warning letter that I have posted before to see that the injection's risks are not acceptable. Obviously your 4 vets have not read this warning.

Many years ago my vet gave me the procedure for homoeopathic heartworm treatment - have since lost it, but Diana Hayes does a heartworm treatment program. It involved using increasing strengths of Arsenicum, starting at the 6x one, over a number of weeks, followed by the Heartworm nosode. The dog had to be kept quiet, as is done with orthodox treatment, to prevent pieces of dead heartworm lodging where they shouldn't. She always used it on elderly or very unwell dogs that she felt wouldn't cope with the normal method.

I have not used regular heartworm medication for over a decade - my kennels are indoors, and mosquito proof. I carefully weighed up the risk to my breeding dogs from the medication compared to homoeopathic treatment if heartworm did rear it's ugly head, and preferred the treatment option. I am also religious about not having anywhere mosquitos can breed, and on acreage this does limit the population somewhat. Every heartworm test I have had done has come up perfectly clear, and only one of my dogs has any health problems. We don't even use horse wormers that contain Moxidectin, as dogs have died from eating their post-treatment manure - not about to inject the stuff into them!

So sorry to hear about your poor dog evelin. Good to hear that his death is being treated seriously. I still cannot understand why this drug is still so heavily promoted and used in this country after all the problems in the US and Canada. We must be slow learners here

Sorry, should have clarified - meant the rescuer groups that are lobbying the government to bring in compulsory desexing of all puppies except those going to people with breeders permits. Am in a rush, because I have to leave to rescue an unwanted heavily pregnant cat ;)

Understand that surgical sterilisation is not in most vet's area of expertise, especially with bitches. It will take time and experience. Many vets can and do vasectomise ferrets, cats etc. Ok - radical idea here - instead of compulsory desexing of all puppies, why not enforce vasectomisation of all male pups unless going to registered breeders or exhibitors (with recognition of non ANKC breeds). While we're at it, restrict puppy mills' access to entires by limiting the number of breeding dogs they are allowed to keep - and ENFORCE it. With the amount of red tape and inspections etc to police this, why not enforce vasectomisation of all entire adult pets under a certain age as part of their registration renewal while we're at it. As council rangers in many places already doorknock in search of unregistered dogs or "dangerous breeds", it should be possible. Owners that have registered dogs already have their dog's status details available for councils to track down entires. If almost every male dog is vasectomised it will be a lot harder for unwanted litters to arrive, owners can get their dogs desexed at a healthier age of their choosing, or not, depending on what suits their individual circumstances. We are talking major Big Brother here, but the lobby groups of rescuers and the pollies are already trying to bring this about. BTW - I would hate to see the demise of the good old fashioned "mutt" through this, but rescuers seem to want this...

:p Where have I said don't desex? If you remember from previous threads, I am a staunch advocate of surgical sterilisation for those breeds that suffer from adverse effects of juvenile desexing. I firmly believe that toy breed house pets are fine with being desexed around 6 mths - I personally wouldn't have an entire male toy for a house pet, and he would be done before he lifted his leg! :p Believing in informed choice, and recognising that different breeds and different owners have different needs is hardly being against desexing ;) There are so many posts on this forum about adverse effects from early desexing that various members have EXPERIENCED in their own dogs, I would hardly call them "theories" ;)

:p Why would shorthaired dogs change coat when desexed? It is the coated breeds that frequently change - hounds, gundogs and terriers in particular. Most coated working breeds don't seem to change either. Having had a lot to do with desexed working breeds, I haven't found it reduces shedding, unfortunately! Breeds like viszlas and boxers are pretty well fully grown by those ages, so of course their height wouldn't be affected by desexing.

Obviously there would be 'for' and 'against' for performing a second operation and so I guess this owuld mean weighing up the pros and cons and incidence of developing mammary cancer and pyometra. This is the solution I have been recommending the entire time, although I believe hysterectomy, leaving ovaries intact, to be a much better option as many people can't handle the mess and dog-magnet qualities of an in season bitch. This also removes the risk of pyometra. Because I have been recommending this option for larger breeds for over a year, I stand accused of running an anti-desexing campaign.

I WAS talking about my breed - apologise if I didn't make myself clear - my post started "In my breed" - you cut that part out in your quote. Where have I said I am anti-desexing? I repeatedly agree that many dogs should be desexed, just not early :D conspiracy theories? wtf? pseudo-scientific propaganda? Have you read the scientific references?

You "can't imagine"? Have you looked at ANY of the scientific studies posted here over the last year on desexing? Or posts from members who have had bitches with lifelong health problems and constant medication because of desexing? Or even those bitches that died as a result of being desexed?

I am not anti-desexing, I am against the mantra of "desex at all costs". I have frequently stated that desexing is essential for many dogs, just not before mental and physical maturity, ESPECIALLY in large breeds. Some large breeds are simply better off never being desexed due to musculature and skeletal requirements. Most toy breed males would make highly unsuitable house pets if left entire! Many other breeds can produce males so singleminded about finding females (and aggressive to males) that desexing is necessary to preserve everyone's sanity. Why it is not politically correct for responsible, informed owners to keep entire dogs in secure premises is totally beyond me. My entire dogs and bitches have never produced an accidental litter in over 30 years - it can be done, and I'm fed up with everyone assuming that ALL entires are responsible for the unwanted dog problem. Not all owners are the same, not all breeds are the same, and there is no "one desexing protocol fits all". BTW - desexing makes absolutely no difference to the coats of many breeds - it does make a very obvious difference in mine, I don't appreciate being accused of bullshit.

In my breed, males and females that are desexed prior to 12 months grow taller, narrower in the chest and much hairier. Males and females that are desexed at ANY age (even at ten yrs) are not only much hairier, but have incorrect coat growth patterns, resulting in long fuzzy hair where it should be smooth and silky. I can pick one that has been desexed from more than twenty feet away, purely by the awful incorrect coat.

Having had stitches removed with a blade myself, I can honestly say to use sharp nail scissors - the action of the blade pulls on the stitches and it can HURT! The only stitches I have taken back to the vet for removal in years were a couple in the corner of an eyelid on a 4 mth old pup - no way was I going to risk poking him in the eye! He turned out to be as good as gold, but the extra pair of hands was essential.

The orthomolecular doctor that put me onto it has had excellent results with his patients. The vitamin E helps with the whole process. Ordinary doctors will not agree with it, due to potential toxicity, how they can prefer the incredibly toxic, carcinogenic chemo is beyond me

If it were my pup, I would be putting it onto selenium (1mg per 10kg bodyweight daily) plus 500 IU Vit E. Yesterday! The vets will say that this dose is far too high and toxic, but toxicity doesn't occur until 2-4 mg per 1kg bodyweight. An orthomolecular doctor put me onto this, as a Canadian vet is using this protocol with his patients, and has very promising results so far. They need to buy a selenium sheep drench called Selenium Drench Concentrate, and dilute according to instructions - it will cost about $20. Vit E from the supermarket will do. Many people have cured their own cancers with this same product, including terminal, inoperable bowel cancer, in just a few months.