Moselle

No I do have a career, lol. Okay so you've explained that dogs don't tear rabbits apart....don't know the story on that one but I'll take your word for it. What I do know is that dogs are in fact often used to tear other animals apart as part of a hunting expedition (namely pigs amongst other animals). I won't make apologies for the fact that I find that totally despicable, wild animals or not.....we humans should exercise a little respect in not wanting to put a prey animal through agonizing pain. I disagree in your thinking that ferreting will teach kids to "evaluate and analyze situations carefully." And it does serve to desensitise kids and cannot be compared to purchasing meat off the shelf at the local supermarket.....there is no killing involved in purchasing ready steak in comparison to going hunting! Dogs damaging rabbits is very undesireable as it can ruin them too much to be used for the table or even as dog/ferret food, in some cases. I also haven't heard of many pig dogs that 'tear' up the pig...their job is to grab an ear and hold on tight! To do anything else would be to hinder the hunt. Grabbing an ear may not be nice, but it is surely no worse than the procedures performed on livestock everyday without pain relief. Tail docking, castration, branding, mulesing...all of these are performed whilst the animal is fully aware. And unlike the pig they are not put out of their misery soon afterwards. Well, I can't speak for all children but it certainly had a positive impact upon me as a child, and did enhance the two aforementioned traits greatly, amongst others. Nor has it desensitised me... once I began to catch some of my own food I became hyper-aware of everything else I put in my mouth and the processes behind it. It made me a much more discerning individual than I may have been otherwise. Whether you like it or not, you are killing something everytime you purchase meat from the supermarket. Aliken it to purchasing puppies from petshops; you may not see it happen, but it surely does happen and you promote it with your dollars. I'm not saying that the livestock industry is bad, as I promote it with my dollars as well. But to condemn hunting whilst promoting death and certain degrees of inevitable suffering in the livestock industry at the same time? That doesn't compute, for me. I bet to differ in that wild pigs are only grabbed by the ears....I have seen video footage that would dictate the contrary, it was horrific. The poor animal would be set upon by a fair few dogs and they would each grab the pig wherever they could and it wasn't always by the ears, the end result was the pig screaching in agony and blood dripping everywhere. I realise that the livestock industry has its share of discomfort and/or cruelty and for as long as members of society turn a blind eye to it it will continue! I cannot see any changes taking place, tragically! Simply because this is the case does not justify other acts taking place especially in the backyard! I would be happy if people were not longer allowed to kill their own meat but having said that I realise that it would be impossible to police this. I find it difficult to convince myself that people who kill their own meat can do so humanely. As for the greyhound industry....well, that is another story but I would be celebrating the day that greyhound racing ceases to exist....

was the words u needed "politicaly correct" yes i had the same thought, poor moselle's ex friend couldnt have an opinion of her own. wonder what moselle would think if her friend had decided to drop her like a hot potato because she didnt have "pet" lunch ingredients? thats what worries me about the peta brigade, not content to have their own opinon and leave it at that. want to force their beliefs down others throats even to the extent of pushing it to become law? dont have to look far to the the rammifications of misplaced legislation, the greenies got it so that rural fire brigades couldnt do backburns for decades and hundreds of lives lost as a result. n thats without counting the tens of thousands of wildlife lives n homes gone to dust. cold burns dont do that. yes our animals and plants evolved to cope with fire, but cold fires not the holocausts they now face instead. If my friend decided to drop me like a "hot potato"......well, what can I say? that would be her prerogative. To each their own, don't you think?

I do have a large network of friends, lanabanana.....they don't all share my opinion on all things and I wouldn't expect that to be the case. I have two "pet" hates and one is animal cruelty.....I know we could discuss this till the "cows" come home but the fact remains that I cannot get my head around women who hunt, it simply does not agree with me. Yes, I did end a friendship based on the fact that she ended up chopping her pet duck's necks.....there was no indication that she was that way inclined and made out like she wouldn't hurt a fly, little did I know. That was just the straw that broke the camel's back, there were other issues pertaining to the way she kept her animals and lack of responsibility towards them, not desexing them.....allowing them to breed indiscriminately, not able to contain them, etc etc etc. I had a chuckle at your last comment, . I am certainly not advocating that a woman be seen and not heard, far from it as I can be very opinionated (as you may have already gathered, lol).....oh, and women have just as much right to swear as any man, lol.....when necessary, lol. My issue is.....how can one be certain that animals killed in their backyard are killed humanely? surely there are individuals out there that have no idea on how to conduct such an act as painlessly as is possible????

I couldn't agree more! The one thing I can count on is KARMA....may this bastard's life be one of sheer misery!!!!!!!!!!!!

I would assume that the butcher would have to be male? and I would hope that he makes it his priority to kill (if he kills ?) as humanely as is possible ??? I do have issues with trophy hunters who really do have an attitude and think they're all "that" when they are NOT and women hunting.....that is all.

He is cute, looks like a happy chappy, lol.

Ahh so a freshly dispatched quick kill is disgraceful but pigs that live their whole lives in appalling conditions without even room to move is perfectly acceptable as long as it comes to you in a shrink wrapped package? You have obviously never lived in a rural area. The majority of women i know will kill their own meat, butcher it and then cook it when they need too. But i bet if you met them one on one you would never know it. I guess you would be downright horrified if you found out you were talking to one of these women you portray to be rough around the edges because they are self sufficient. It must be nice to purchase your meat from the supermarket and rate yourself above those that shock horror hunt for their meat. Your right, on the one hand you have feedlot animals that spend their life in miserable, cramped conditions then are shipped off to slaughter houses in over crowded transport, many of whom suffer horrific injuries whilst they panic at the smell of death and fear in the air all so you can receive a lovely shrink wrapped product in the supermarket. Yup they have it way better to the animal that lives free in their natural environment and is dispatched quickly, efficiently and humanely. Nekhbet id love to come with you but i work through the week. There are plenty of farmers around here though that would LOVE for you to come ferreting though if you ever hanker for a trip to the Snowy Mountains. +1 intensively farmed animals suffer every day of their usually short lives. Wild animals might suffer a moment of pain, upon death, who knows really, most hunters are pretty skilled at quickly and humanely killing them. Rabbits, as cute as they are, are pests that need to be eradicated or else they get out of control. What, more humane method do you propose to get rid of them Moselle? And frankly your statements about women are outdated at best and offensive at worst. I certainly am not out to offend anyone and the ONLY comment I made about women is in relation to those that have a pencheant for hunting. Sorry but I cannot help feeling this way, it's just one of those things. I actually do live in a rural situation but I do commute to Melbourne a few times a week and my friends are based in melbourne. I don't really socialise with people locally and made a conscious decision to keep to myself, that has nothing to do with this discussion though. I haven't stumbled upon a woman that does do her own killing and it never actually dawned on me but I guess I will make a point of finding out. I did once have a "friend" for a short duration of time until I found out that she did kill her own meat namely her "pet" ducks and I wasn't impressed, needless to say the friendship was ended rather swiftly once she made the mistake of telling me.

Not by anyone who knows anything about pig hunting they aren't. The pigs are shot once caught and held. No hunter worth a damn wants the animal ripped to pieces or valuable hunting dogs risked for nothing. Fox hunting sees the fox dispatched by the dogs and live animal coursing is the same. Both incidentally are banned in Australia. Both IMO sure beat a slow death by strychnine or 1080. The idea of using poisons to kill fox is totally apalling to me! As so far as pig hunting is concerned.....well, I have seen videos and photos of a group of dogs latching onto any part of the pig that they could hold onto whilst the pig is in atrocious pain.....no need for that.....how I would so love it if it were possible for those people responsible for such to come back as a pig....I would be making sure that their crown jewel was being grabbed and masticated upon!

Megan....guess what? people don't need to be directly involved in the slaughtering of animals to realise that the meat they purchase from the supermarket was, once upon a time, walking and breathing. Now, where are those scones?

And when there isn't a man around, then what? What you think is your opinion and you're entitled to it. You don't have to hunt if you prefer not to but suggesting that other women shouldn't is rather outdated IMO. There is no longer any such thing as "men''s" and "women's" jobs. I'd argue that in reality there never were. Women have been providing game for the table since the dawn of time. God knows without all members of a family contributing to the table, we'd probably have died out long ago. I have no more problem with women hunting than I do with men embroidering. Polecatty: Absolutely! Annie Oakley didnt start out as an exhibition shooter. If that little girl hadn't picked up a gun, she and her family would have starved. A woman does what a woman's gotta do to get the job done. I was wondering when you would make your appearance PF? LOL.....If there was no man around I would quite happily resort to a vegan diet. I guess its a case of "birds of a feather stick together" and I choose not to keep company with women that are rough around the edges as that is the way that I potray women that are into hunting.

No I do have a career, lol. Okay so you've explained that dogs don't tear rabbits apart....don't know the story on that one but I'll take your word for it. What I do know is that dogs are in fact often used to tear other animals apart as part of a hunting expedition (namely pigs amongst other animals). I won't make apologies for the fact that I find that totally despicable, wild animals or not.....we humans should exercise a little respect in not wanting to put a prey animal through agonizing pain. I disagree in your thinking that ferreting will teach kids to "evaluate and analyze situations carefully." And it does serve to desensitise kids and cannot be compared to purchasing meat off the shelf at the local supermarket.....there is no killing involved in purchasing ready steak in comparison to going hunting!

Huh? you must have a money tree growing in your backyard.... I happen to think that they charge enough as it is.

Lots of good advice from other posters and hugs and good wishes for giving this boy a loving home, all the love you give him will be reciprocated tenfold, I bet! As Golden Rules said.....your digital camer's battery should be ready to go, lol....so how about it?

I have concerns. You have described her as "a tall pomeranian". I assume that the person who sold you the puppy gave you this description. I have just re-read the Breed Standard for Pomeranians and nowhere in it does it say that the dogs are tall. Please read the breed standard: http://www.ankc.org.au/Breed_Details.aspx?bid=40 It describes what the dogs and bitches should look like, and it is important that they do have these features if you are thinking of breeding. An adult female Pomeranian should weigh no more than 2.5 kilograms. A dog of that weight is UNLIKELY to ever be a tall dog. Please wait until your puppy is an adult before making any decisions about breeding. If she is more than 2.5 kgs in weight at the age of 12 months I do not believe you should be breeding from her. She will make a beautiful de-sexed pet who is just a little bit taller than some of the other Poms, and I am guessing that the breeder told you that she would be tall. Best wishes, Souff I agree, there are more than enough dogs being bred simply for the sake of breeding. I must say that I am surprised at the response of some posters here....who have encouraged the idea of breeding.....I was under the distinct impression that one should breed to "better the breed" and not for the fun of it.

Voted, she is a cutie....no doubt about that !!!

Sorry but I don't find the idea of allowing dogs (as an example) tear an animal to pieces when there is no need for this atrocity to happen just cause it is instinctual for some dogs to do so. Really? How odd.....does it also disturb you when wolves hunt for their dinner? Hunting is a perfectly natural behaviour. And I am really sorry but man I was PMSL when I read "its a mans job". I would love to have a go at ferreting, I think it owuld be a brilliant way (especially for kids) to see how nature actually works. When we were in NZ we (well we being me not the man) always thought aI bout taking up pig hunting to provide a nice bit of meat for the fams but unfortunately I didn't have the first idea about it so it always remained an "interest" LOL Is it really a "brilliant way to see how nature actually works" for kids??? Yes yes....the same excuse is being thrown around....let's breed our backyard dog because it is going to prove educational for our kids?! How necessary is it for kids to go ferreting? is it going to make them brainier or serve to simply desensitise them and make them less likely to feel compassion for animal life? I seem to think so in alot of cases. Oh by the way, you can go on pissing yourself stupid at my comment that hunting is a man's job cause guess what? I still seem to think so.....

I would most certainly approach the owners, in a nice manner, and alert them to the fact that their cavalier is able to untie itself and gets out. I would appreciate it if someone approached me for the same reason even though I personally don't believe in keeping a dog tied up for any length of time.

Sorry but I don't find the idea of allowing dogs (as an example) tear an animal to pieces when there is no need for this atrocity to happen just cause it is instinctual for some dogs to do so.

Presumably Moselle & her dogs are vegan? Since I've worked on several farms (sheep, beef, dairy) and visited hundreds more, and can tell you that most hunted meat is at least as humane as any animal product you'll buy at the supermarket. If only I lived closer! My girl would love to try rabbit. No, dogs and I not vegan. It's not a case of my disagreeing with rabbits being humanely put down but it's your choice of words that I didn't find too appealing. It's one thing to do what one feels has to be done (still see it as a man's job) but to derive pleasure out of it???

Oh well too bad for you that you are going to be missing out on seeing death take place before your eyes, darn!

People are just explaining the meat they can get.. There is no need to come in here and start trying to get a reaction.. Please keep it as an informative thread not a stickler thread. Thanks. No worries, SF.

That would be annoying! Wow Spotty, you have meat on demand!!! Oscar is extremely jealous because our meat is so bloody expensive (Close to home) and we don't have that much variety. You are lucky Pax... Well your dogs are anyways!! :D When I lived in a rural area for a couple of years my dogs literally got the same as what yours do because there was greyhounds galore that got treated like prince's and princess's.. Poor Osc, he got suburban living which equals less variety. He is quite the fussy eater and doesn't take to change well so it's not such a bad thing but I've just got back into fostering and know these guys will definitely want more variety and it's also going to be more expensive so want to get quality for my money. hmmm yes, I did happen to notice this particular mince doesn't look that crash hot! Thankfully we have no objections to eating it and last night he was jumping out of his skin for his dinner so it must taste pretty good. I work in Newcastle so I pass loads of Butchers on my way home so I can try and test them all! I just need a bigger freezer so I can stock up.. I wouldn't go so far as to say that greyhounds are treated as prince's and princess's; they're kept caged for a good part of their short existance except when they are trialled and raced and then if they don't meet the grade they are swiftly eradicated (put down) to make space for more promising stock. Horse mince? Oh dear!

Wow, $3.00 for chicken feet? that doesn't sound exactly cheap to me, lol. And what race or nationality would succumb to eating chicken feet? I bet I can hazard a guess, the one that eats practically anything that moves, lol. Jokes aside, I would never buy meat from a pet shop, it would be laden with sulphur dioxide, not good.

Doesn't say much about today's society, people are too wrapped up in themselves to give a damn! You did great in stopping and taking all steps to try and help this poor dog. Personally I could not have walked away and perhaps would have taken the dog to a vet to see if it was microchipped. I agree with Baxter in that there could always be a chance that the dog may have been stolen or simply lost...... What a major let down by the ranger, nothing short of a non-caring prick!

I don't actually want to see high sales of my breed or my partner's breed. They are not for your average pet owner and you need a certain degree of mentoring to successfully own one. I definitely don't want to see them sold in pet shops but DD's are irrelevant to that point of view. I am glad to hear that but it is unfortunate that not every breeder shares your sentiments in not wanting high sales of their breed. You've only got to look at the number of litters that some reg. breeders breed per year, that tells me that they're not breeding with the sole intent of "bettering the breed." that is a very broad and sweeping statement and i suggest that you best have the stats and experience to back this up. As I said, SOME reg. breeders do indeed breed litter after litter. Not a broad and sweeping statement at all. I was a reg. breeder until I decided that I no longer wanted to breed so therefore I am qualified to make such an observation. No need for "stats" besides which, there is good and bad in every avenue, not ALL reg. breeders are ethical. You should know that if you dare take an honest approach and admit such openly besides which I have read, on many occasions, other DOLers make such an observation.