koalathebear

Hoover's mostly red and tan but up on his neck, although the fur on top was red, underneath, it was white. The effect was a bit stripy like you can see in this photo here: If you actually smoothed the top fur back, you could see that it was all white underneath. He and Elbie have been moulting like crazy - thank goodness for the Dyson. Elbie's fur is black and white and his appearance is unchanged, but while shedding his coat, Hoover seems to have lost some of the red around his neck and kept the white. Below - that's not baldness you see. It's just a blurry photo - the fur is mostly white! Does anyone know if the red will grow back? I'm not fussed, but the poor puppy looks a bit funny right now with the white fur on his neck so exposed.

I took that to mean more than a nip, so this dog would go to heaven if it was me I'm afraid. Yes ... it sounded like it was definitely more than a nip. Also, I found the website I was thinking of. It's this one - warning it's the extremely gruesome one that shows all the photos of dog bites. It's usually posted on DOL by people warning people about children and dogs etc. I remember when reading it that I was a bit surprised that many of the dogs that were the subject of the emails being written were still around i.e. people were giving them second, third chances etc. I guess people might be more lenient if the dog bit them but would be less lenient if it bit a child/someone else ... Very sad all round. In any case, I figure it can't hurt to have a second opinion before the dog is put down.

I'm not a very experienced dog owner so I have to confess I'd also feel very unsure about the ongoing management of a human aggressive dog, but I do feel bad for the owner. So sad given that the dog's only 18 months old.

This story/footage has been making the rounds today. This woman in Brazil is being rescued and tries very hard to take her dog with her but the flood waters are too strong It's not graphic or anything, just sad ...

I was having lunch with a friend yesterday and she mentioned that a friend of hers had an 18 month old cattle dog that he had picked up as a young puppy from a rescue here in Canberra. The dog was taken to obedience class, had always been beautifully behaved, obedient and respectful of boundaries. Recently, he took the puppy to his mother's house and the dog attacked his mother quite badly. The dog's now apparently at the RSPCA undergoing assessment to see if it's possible to rehome it on a property somewhere or if it should be put down. The owner is apparently very upset because he adores his dog and the dog had never shown any signs of aggression prior to the attack on his mother. I'm not sure of how experienced the RSPCA staff are so I said that if her friend wanted a second opinion, he could perhaps try contacting K9Pro who DOLers have advised has an excellent record of working with dogs that have behavioural issues. I sent her a link to the story of DJ the Black Lab vs Granny. She said that she'd pass on the details because her friend was very upset. On re-reading the story of DJ the Black lab and also considering the case of the ACD's attack on the friend's mother, I started thinking that it must be difficult to 'recover' from something like that. I have seen from other fora that people will speak quite freely about being attacked/bitten by their dogs but we see less of it here on DOL. It's possible that the dogs here on DOL have less behavioural issues or perhaps it's the case that it's something people don't really like to talk about because they're afraid that people will judge/criticise/tell them to put the dog to sleep etc. I guess what I'm wondering is, if a dog is human aggressive and has actually bitten/attacked someone - can it ever be truly rehabilitated or does a line get crossed and thereafter it will require extra careful monitoring and management? At what point should the call made to 'put to sleep'? Can the 'trust' of the dog ever be regained? For people who have been bitten by their dog, were you able to 'forgive'? I guess for me what was a bit scary was how this dog had apparently never shown any such behaviour before and it seemed like such an unfortunate and random incident that could happen to anyone. I know all of the above will be "it depends" - depends on the dog, depends on the owner and all that sort of thing but I suppose I am curious about what other people have experienced. One website startled me because the person asking for advice had been bitten several times by her dog and to be honest if it was me, I'm sure I would have sought professional help after the first time I was bitten.

I hadn't heard it before either but it was something I learned during the search for our second puppy. There are a lot of nervy Kelpies out there but I suspect that their parentage might not be ascertainable. As mentioned, it's supposed to be the well-bred Kelpies that are pretty rock-solid. 4kelpies was the person who mentioned before about how she met the litter brothers and sisters of some of her puppies who had never been away from the farm but still had good temperaments that were similar to her well-socialised pups. Well-bred Kelpies are supposed to be very adaptable and take new things into their stride and you're right, in a lot of breeds, that lack of early socialisation would probably be a complete disaster. Another reason I love Kelpies is that people who love Kelpies have such a deep and unwavering affection for them and will frequently remember them with very strong emotion. I was chatting to Hoover's breeder the other day and it was so sweet to hear her talking about Hoover's litter-mates and you could just feel how much she loved the dogs and the breed. 4kelpies: Thanks for the kind words! Much of what I've learned about Kelpies I learned from you We also spend a lot of time with our two monsters observing all their funny foibles.

Niques - any word yet??? The rain here is having its usual effect on the monsters. Elbie's toileting normally but Hoover's not wanting to go to Poo Corner at night - wet and dark or something. It's kind of frustrating! In other news, we bought our first Giant Bag of Royal Canin today. It is truly huge. Blurry photos below with a Hoover thrown in to show you how large the bag is - he's pretty much Elbie-sized by now so the bag is HUGE! He proved a very cooperative Royal Canin Model - unlike Elbie who really didn't know what to make of the big noisy bag

Threads like these always end up like the 'do you take your dog on a structured walk every day' kind of thread ... Given that there are really only 3 categories: (1) dog outside; (2) dog inside; (2) dog inside and outside, there are going to be frequent examples of people being diametrically opposed in their views I think it's all very well to say what one chooses to do personally, but I don't think it's really fair to make a judgement about how other people choose to raise their dogs even though of course this is a public forum and people are entitled to air their views I just don't think that you're likely to change anyone's view on things. For instance, no one here is going to say: "I keep my dogs inside - now I have seen the light and see that it is the wrong thing to do so I'll keep them outside." As long as the dog is healthy, loved, cared for and given sufficient intellectual and physical stimulation it doesn't really matter if it's an inside or an outside dog. I know a lot of people who spend more time outdoors rather than inside. I say 'healthy' because that covers the dogs that aren't physically suited to being outside dogs. Keeping your dog inside or outside doesn't mean that you're a good owner, a better owner or a more attentive owner. It's all very much case by case - depends on the dog, depends on the owner, depends on the circumstances. You really can't draw sweeping conclusions about what is good and right for all Dog-dom based on your own personal views and declare that it's True. My dogs are mostly indoors on weekends - they sleep in doors but when we're out, we prefer to keep them outside rather than in the house - even when it's raining. On a work day, they could be out in the yard for 6-8 hours, a few times when I was dealing with a family medical emergency, Elbie was left alone for much longer than that in the back yard. They have shelter, they love playing in the yard. Hoover came to us at 3+ months and having been born on a farm, had never been inside a house before, having stayed in a kind of open shed with his litter mates and mother. He loves being inside, hanging around with us but he'd probably be just as happy outside as well - like wuffles has mentioned, we like having him in the house. Elbie prefers being where we are, whether that's indoors or outdoors but again, even when he was an Only Dog, we left him out in the yard a lot and he was fine and very beloved. I don't think our dogs would want to be shut up in the house if we're not there. They like to run, play and jump - snooze in the sun. They don't nuisance bark and they outgrew the digging ages ago. Even when we are home, we frequently have them outside - they have a dog door so they wander in and out as they please if the weather is decent. You just have to look at and you'll see how incredibly happy they are in the yard. At the end of the day, shouldn't we just be happy that (for the most part) the dogs on this forum appear to be happy and healthy and save our disapproval for sickos that torture and neglect their dogs?

Lovely photo

Honestly ... One of my dogs is a crossbreed and I'm not fussed in the slightest that there are organisations that would prefer to help their members only or purebred dogs only... There are some who would criticise if one donates only for dogs and not other animals some would say that we should be donating towards humans over dogs. You can't help everybody and this is about trying to break down what seems like a Huge Overwhelming Horrible into smaller, more manageable pieces. Personally I think it's great that we can have a choice about where to donate, that we can donate where our interests lie. There's a reason why there are special interests groups - breed rescues and clubs etc. My question was just because my personal preference is to donate to dogs generally regardless of parentage. You could argue that members who are helped out by the purebred associations/associations of which they are a member will therefore free up a spot in the "general dog assistance" pool for another dog. It's win win really because there are different groups to cover different areas and conceptually there shouldn't be gaps. Many of us have to work hard for our money - we can't donate to everyone so we have to make choices about where the money goes. The more reputable assistance groups out there the better I say. Right now it shouldn't be an issue of arguing about ideology, it should be all about helping out as many starfishdogs as we can.

I want to take our two monsters for a run around the BDOC grounds. They'll have a ball.

I love this question – so interesting. We only really learned about Kelpies early last year even though they're supposed to be such a ubiquitous dog in Australia. Kelpies get such a real bad rap sometimes – people assume that they're massively high energy dogs, that you can't have them in a suburban backyard. Some people think they're biters, fence jumpers, hole diggers. Other people think that they're very intense and have to work all the time. It's sad but there are so many Kelpies/Kelpie blends in the pound that it can be easy to assume that there's something undesirable about them … For us, we love our Kelpie (and our Kelpie blend) for lots and lots of reasons: 1. Smart. So smart. They're thinking dogs so they process and anticipate. They're also very trainable – house-training was relatively easy. Training them about boundaries was also pretty easy – we have bags of Royal Canin on the ground and they never touch them, they don’t chew on furniture, cables, books or anything like that. They've learned not to jump up on beds/sofas/tables etc. They never, ever bench surf even if I am forgetful and leave beef/ham/cheese on the edge of the counter!! They know which toys are indoor toys and which are outdoor toys. They have learned not to bark at the doorbell. They love obedience work. 2. They're responsive and very keen to please. The trick is making them understand what you want but once they understand that – they deliver it up and seem to have fun doing it. They love to play and play and are such happy dogs. They're not mindless though – both our dogs have minds of their own and can be quite naughty and disobedient at times – when it rains, neither wants to go to Poo Corner 3. They're very motivated – food, toys, cuddles, attention, doesn't really matter what … 4. They can be very sensitive. Elbie and Hoover are both extremely sensitive to correction and also to our moods. Elbie in particular is very mood-sensitive. Hoover is a little more oblivious but he is extremely sensitive to being reprimanded – just a harsh word and his head and ears drop and he will give puppy eyes. 5. They are people dogs and incredibly affectionate. Both our dogs love being around people. They will play on their own in the yard, but they prefer to be near us even if we're not playing with them. They love pats and cuddles. They're not bitey or aggressive at all. 6. They can be very veggie. They're happiest in their dog beds snoozing/resting near us. Sometimes for hours and hours on end. Basically they do whatever we do – if we go out, they do that. If we walk, they do that. If we're on the computer, they snooze and play among themselves. If we watch a movie, they snooze or watch with us. If we play Rockband, they snooze or watch. Elbie gets hyper in the car sometimes and in new situations but he is a bit bonkers and that's probably the crossbreed in him rather than the Kelpie Hoover is pretty placid. At home, both are extremely calm and placid. 7. They're not very obsessive. They don't have 'jobs' but Elbie will play Elbie ball on his own for ages if we don't play with him and they play among themselves. They love it best when we play with them of course but they're very well-entertained by their own antics. Our two are not very destructive (some minor hole digging in early days but not so much now), they're very much homebodies who show no desire to stray/fence-jump/bolt out the front door. They are not very barky either – Elbie only went bonkers when our neighbour was standing on the fence between our properties trimming his tree with an electric saw thing that was very noisy. Otherwise they don’t bark too much except to warn us that someone's approaching the house. When I spoke with breeders and the Working Kelpie Council, they were all of the view that a working line Kelpie can make a wonderful, wonderful member of the family as a pet. Well-bred working line Kelpies don't even actually need that much early socialisation and they're still fine because they're so adaptable – Hoover and his litter were all on the farm until 3-4 even five months and all have apparently adapted beautifully to city life. Hoover's fearless in the face of an electric mixer, a Dyson, a washing machine, a car ride, a thunder storm …

I'm fine with them collecting for whomever they like as well - it makes perfect sense to me, but by the same token, I'd also like to be able to tailor my donation so that it goes where I want it to go i.e. to dogs generally. People in my office (who are not dog lovers) would of course think that that makes me bonkers.

Ah, that's ok Very, very sad situation for all concerned. But I do love that people are doing what they can - there was this gorgeous photo this morning:

I'm sure you weren't trying to be provocative, but just to clarify - I'm not judging anyone. I'm talking about how I'm feeling seeing all the new footage ...

This is so heart-breaking. I am one of those people who believe that if you you have pets and you think that you're in danger, you get out early, but now having read about the flash flood - there are times when you just can't plan in advance ... I just am not sure I could leave my dogs behind even if ordered to do so especially after reading a report here about a crocodile being seen savaging a dog that was left behind. Also reading about how frightened the dogs must be that are left behind

The website says: Dogs Queensland will announce shortly a number of Flood Relief initiatives to aide all Members in this time of need and our thoughts are with all those Members. So it looks like it's just for members at this time.

Thanks for the info! Just wanted to double-check before I donated because from memory one of the donation links was for purebreds only (totally understandable given the forum) but I would prefer my donation to help dogs in need generally etc.

Can someone let me know which of the charities will help 'all dogs' rather than just purebreeds? I suspect that a lot of the dogs on rural properties might be crossbreeds and in any case, as an owner of one purebred and one crossbreed I'd want to save both of mine

Jacqui835: your dog is beautiful!!! Some expression shots of my two. Impatiently waiting for the ball to be thrown "Please take this off my head" Stoic Elbie: Please get this dog out of my dog bed Hoover: Muahaha "I mean it - please get this dog out of my bed." "Feed me"

Hope all the Qlders are ok ... ;)

wuffles: I'm sure your wedding invites will be wonderful - you are always so conscientious!! As to the dog patting thing you mentioned in an earlier post, I've noticed that Elbie and Hoover get lots of pats when out but people never ask first. So many kids will pat without asking permission, too. It's fine with our two because they're not aggressive at all - but if excited, they can jump up which might be scary for some people. I find it interesting that people don't ask permission. I always do because just because not every dog wants to be patted by strangers. Our two are total tarts though and pretty much love everybody Niques: I sympathise! I really am not quite sure what to do about the whole vacation thing if we decide to go somewhere that isn't dog-friendly. People could come and feed and walk the dogs but I'd feel bad asking friends and family to do poo picks and with two Poo Machines, we pretty much have to poo-pick twice a day!! I'd also feel a bit weird having people staying here when we weren't here and I'm not sure how the dogs would cope in a kennel. Ah well, I'll cross that bridge later I think. lilli_star: Hee! Half a BBQ chicken for Queen Roo. I'm sure she loved it. betsy: poor Ziggy! He always looks so happy in his photos, I'd hate to have seen how dejected his face was when he couldn't play with the other doggies. What is meant by two boisterous? Does he jump on the dogs? Or is he a bit humpy sometimes like my two Here is a video of . He made up the rules himself and will play it for ages and ages so long as someone will kick the ball to him. It involves holding one toy in his mouth and then using his feet to stop and kick a tennis ball. He sort of played it before but his aim is getting pretty good!=. doing biteyface - it's a bit long but I wasn't sure where to cut it Elbie sounds like a cross between a wounded tauntaun and a distressed wookie and Hoover lets out ultrasonic squeaks. It's pretty funny. I also love the tug with the squeaky steak because not only is Elbie not resource-guarding, he keeps running back and shoving the steak in Hoover's face in the hope that he tugs. Also, the 'vicious crinkle face' that Hoover shows Elbie when playing bitey-face is something he only ever shows to Elbie - thankfully we've never seen it. But I love the bit at the end when I call his name and his face changes from Crinkle Face to Puppy Hoover in a heartbeat.Also, I was having a chat with Hoover's breeder today. She's expecting another litter soon if anyone feels like getting a naughty little Kelpie puppy ETA: also, two small successes today: 1. Elbie and Hoover were left in the car today when we went to pick up dinner and Elbie didn't make a sound - he was very quiet till we got back. 2. He was also much calmer in the car than he usually is - he still goes a bit hyperactive and excited at the turns but today he was very good. Maybe he will become a good car traveller after all ...

He is absolutely gorgeous - love that face. Those eyes~!

chellz: There is a lot of information to read and sometimes it can be overwhelming but we just kept it simple: 1. crate door was left open during the day with treats and toys inside to make it tempting 2. we took the puppies out to toilet very promptly after meals and drinking 3. we go to bed at around midnight so in the early days, we'd wake up every 2 hours - 2am, 4am, 6am - in the early days of Elbie we didn't sleep much past 6am 4. Then it was 3am, 6am and then just 4am. Eventually we just toileted them at bedtime and they would sleep through the night. There are mixed views about drinking at night. Some people say the pups should always have access to water, some say no water after 9 or 10pm until they can hold. For a while, I was withholding water from Elbie after 9.30pm or so, but OH is tender-hearted and always gave him water and it didn't really matter given that we were taking him out to toilet regularly anyway. Apart from night times, the other ways we used the crate: 1. When the puppy was young and we didn't want to leave the puppy in the yard alone, it was crated if we went out - but we made sure we didn't go out for more than an hour or two. Admittedly, I always had a secret worry that we'd have an accident or something and poor Elbie would be trapped in his crate. These days, the puppies (11 months and 6 months) are always left in the yard alone when we go out, even if it's raining. 2. Sometimes when guests come over, the puppies are crated initially so that they get over their excitement - then they can come out to play. 3. Crates aren't supposed to be used as punishment but our puppies can sometimes wind each other up when playing and be a bit boisterous so we actually use crates as a sin-bin/time out sometimes ... one pup gets popped in a crate and the other continues to play. It calms them both down - the one in the crate usually snoozes. For us, because we have two young dogs, it's good to separate them regularly so that they don't bond with each other more than they bond with us. Hoover's still zipped into his crate at night but with Elbie, he has the run of the study and kitchen and he can choose between the crate or his dog bed. Mostly he sleeps in his crate. Both our dogs love their crates and will chill out in them during the day when they want to have a snooze. As for the age of your pup - six weeks is very young and it isn't ideal, but some things can't be helped. Our family dog when I was a kid was brought home at 6 weeks and he lived a long, happy, healthy life. A girl at work was forced by the breeder to take her Great Dane puppy home at five weeks and he's totally fine. Of course it would have been best to have the puppy with its litter until it was at least 8 weeks, but what's done is done ...

No Kelpies