~Anne~

Be aware that many brands use a spray on oil apparently on kibbles (it keeps the kibble piece looking edible and 'moist' I am told) that contain chicken and or beef by products. I would think the label should state this but I am not sure, and if it does, I am not sure how clear it is. This is why kibble is considered a common allergen. It is usually not grains, but the beef and chicken additives and by products. A question: why are you feeding kibble at all if your vet thinks it is grains. Why not feed an alternative to kibble?

Aaah, yes. True! I see that now. :laugh:

That maybe so but I got the idea that the OP lives South of Sydney. They asked for recommendations for the South Coast.. . Sutherland is Sydney.... we South Coasters don't feel connected to them at all. :D

Hanrob is at Sutherland..... about 90 minutes from Nowra or more. :laugh: Not unless they now have a closer branch?

Wow, talk about transient living! What an unsettling lifestyle for the children. I'll bet they leave a trail of unpaid bills with each move too. Let's hope they haven't any more animals in their care.

Curiosity is killing me......

Thanks Jules. Agree, many of us are feeling recent losses of very special dogs. Sylvie, The greater majority of monte's also occurred at night after he had gone to sleep. Monte had clusters of seizures instead of single ones and suffered more than 300 over his life. He too was always a happy little dog though who loved life. When it comes to 'knowing its time' I am not sure we all do. I had to make that heart wrenching decision with Monte and to this day, my mind still plays havoc with thoughts of 'what if we have him this or did this, we might have turned him round'. When I'm feeling logical I know it was time... in fact, I sometimes think the decision possibly should have been made a few hours earlier. I guess what I am saying is I don't think we do really know. Be guided by your vets and your heart.

Yes, stress can impact on seizures. It depends on the dog though, which area of the brain are effected by the seizures and other variables. In my case, with Monte, he had no triggers that we can pinpoint but it did seem that the number of seizures increased in the hotter months.

I recently lost my epileptic dog, Monte. He was on phenobarbital (Pb) for over 9 years. He was a pug and died in April this year a couple of days short of his 11th birthday. Yes, Pb has side effects. The most common and least dangerous I would say is an increase in thirst (which increases urine output), an increase in appetite and ataxia (weakness in the hind area). These side effects are normally ongoing. There are more dangerous side effects such as damage to the liver but this is normally seen in dogs on long term Pb or very high doses. Pb is not a set dose type drug either. You have to trial and adjust. In the first 6 - 12 months the blood serum level of Pb should be tested several times and the dose adjusted as necessary, taking into account the level of side affects. Dogs usually settle into a dose so the side effects such as ataxia may be quite noticeable at first but it will settle and either totally disappear, or like Monte, continue in varying degrees. It takes up to 3 months for a dose to settle. It must be given every 12 hours. The level of Pb rapidly decreases after 12 hours and you are at increased risk of the dog having more seizures. If your dogs have a reaction to each other during, before or immediately after the seizures you will have to keep them separated. I've read horror stories over the years about dogs killing or seriously injuring the dog with epilepsy. It is thought it is either a total misunderstanding from the healthy dog what is happening and they read the seizure and associated symptoms as attack or aggression or it's an instinctual 'killing of the weak' reaction. Thankfully I never had any aggression between my dogs, or the rescues I took in, but that I would think is breed related. The pug is very non aggressive as a breed. I would contain him if possible. Perhaps like Kelpiecuddles suggested above. Monte was a classic epileptic until January this year when he suffered what was thought to be a vestibular episode. He recovered but not as completely as what he should have. He had a head tilt and his balance was never great again. A few months later, over a couple of days, his head tilt greatly increased, he started circling and then went into status (seizures that continue and never stop). We couldn't bring him out of it despite repeated doses of Valium and other drugs. He was given his wings. (I still find it hard talking or writing about his last few days). Monte saw a neurologist as well as his normal vet. After the vestibular type episode, his Neurologist advised me that he may have something more sinister happening ie a tumour on his brain. After what occurred a few months later we now believe he did. This was on top of his epilepsy it is thought. He was just an unlucky boy to have epilepsy all his life and then also end his life with a brain cancer.

I'm not sure what breed you have or it's size... but think of it this way; a chic chip biscuit for your dog is the equivalent of you eating a hamburger. Most people think they are not over feeding their dog. They are, and then some! My tips: Do NOT feed anything over and above their regular feeding. That means NO snacks, and NO tidbits from what you or your family are eating. They will not die from the absence of snacks. They do no need treats, particularly commercial treats, or any other rubbish food. If you feed twice a day, each meal should be HALF of what the daily recommended amount is. Most people tend to feed two meals that are equivalent to the daily total amount in each meal. If you really think your dog will not get enough to eat and will look for more (in reality, he may look for more but he'll have had enough in his meal... it is the owner who thinks he hasn't eaten enough usually...) then make up the bulk with something like boiled cabbage. It's mainly water and it's filling. Seriously though, just reduce the amount of food. You have to be firm. It's for your dogs benefit.

^ this! Dogs are well known to bury meaty bones and dog them up weeks later to eat them. They're basically scavengers. They should be fine. Just watch for any symptoms that might worry you. A couple of occasions of vomiting is fine but of they look flat and stop eating for more than 24 hours then take them to the vet for a check.

Sadly, that attitude is held by some Australian rescues too. It's illogical and over reactive IMO.

My process for rehoming was very similar. I visited to see how the rescue would be housed and cared for and to see the dogs behaviour in the new environment and with other pets. Whilst there I made mental notes of what I thought. Visual clues of dogs only living outside, inadequate fencing or too many animals were obvious points to me. It's also a lot harder for potential new owners to lie to me when you are sitting in their living room having a cuppa. I also took the dog back home with me that day explaining it gave me, the dog and the potential new owners time to think and assess. I asked them to speak with all of the family during the interim now that they had met the dog and to contact me within 48 hours so we could discuss if and how we would progress the adoption. I never had any negative comments about my process. I never 'grilled' people or spoke to them negatively. There's a way of talking to people and you have to use judgement. Some people can be sensitive to rejection.

Sorry, I didn't realise you thought microchipping was lifetime registration. I thought the dog was already chipped and registered. I think all of us were under the same impression. Oopsie!

I guess the important point is that the message rescues are sending is being seen negatively. I'd suggest it's time to think about what is said and how it's said, and processes that are followed. Not just when it comes to screening either. There are many areas of rescue sending out wrong messages to the public. Media articles like his I see as wake up calls. If we are not careful we will see a similar situation of reversal as we saw in the pedigree world where oodles became more popular than purebreds dogs.

Not all dogs have the capacity or ability to detect cancer I believe. Have you read the book by Alexandra Horowitz? She covers this in her book and there maybe other publications of hers that delve more deeply into it.

Agree. I have a bitch who scoots but she is actually scratching around her vulva, not her bum. Your vet would have checked the glands and taken into account the issue of worms. If you are concerned return to your vet and speak to him.

Lifetime is lifetime. She advised you incorrectly.

CaseyKay, you have a way with words that brings both KC and Maddie to life. Keep writing. I'm sure there is more than just me enjoying their stories.

Rescues in Bathurst or Orange would be close enough to check. From memory, Cowra is about 45 minutes drive from Orange isn't it?

It's the smell. I've mentioned it before but I am reading a great book that explains so much of this type of thing. Dogs noses are to them like our sight is to us. We would know by seeing the rock melon. They would know by smelling the rockmelon. Remember, their sense of smell is so great that they can smell and track criminals. They apparently do this by smelling the 'stress' of the fleeing person. We see stress, but we can't smell it.

I'm so sorry CaseyKay. We've shared a few stories about epilepsy and your KC and I came to know her a little through you. I can't imagine how devastated you must be. To lose both like that is so hard to comprehend.

Maybe send an email to the breed clubs in question with a query on average price so you can advise your friend? Be careful of how you word it though... I've read some strange comments about puppy buyers who ask the price before anything else. :laugh: I'm sure if you explain it well you'll be fine though.

I can't answer the poll as there isn't any answer that suits. I've had many breeds over my life. The Pug has been a significant recurrence though. My next breed? Not sure. If I do get one I'll figure it out then. For the meanwhile I'll enjoy my pugs.

Why not a Maltese OR a Shih Tzu? I'm not sure Malts are that highly priced are they? Not sure about the Shih Tzu though.