Adnil444

Hi, I have Bow Wow and have been pleased with them - both dogs are in accident cover only which costs me $29.50 per month. I've only had to make one claim, which was paid without any hiccups etc.

I agree with you - wonderful dogs. I met a lady recently who was walking 4 (2 retired racing dogs and 2 rescue dogs). They were remarkably well behaved for her. I stopped and had a chat with her about them and she confirmed that they are the best couch potato dogs in the world, very lazy, easy to groom etc. She said that they have a 30 min walk daily (though on rainy days they don't go out) and they don't need to run. They only race if trained too, in fact she stated that after a 30 min walk, they are tired and will go back to sleeping their 21hrs per day!! They all had lovely natures and I've thought about rescuing one later on down the track.

Awful - I'm really sorry to hear about this. Gosh there seems to be a run of dog attacks lately - innocent dogs on leads being attacked by dogs owned by irresponsible owners. All I can suggest, as other already have, is to carry a spray (maybe one of tabasco, cayenne pepper etc). Also I liked the idea of putting up posters about the dangerous/aggressive dog around - maybe someone will recognise it and report it as well. Keep on at the council/rangers for updates. Good luck and I hope your dog is ok and not traumatised about this.

Well put megan - very sensible, smart ideas and a great way of appraising dog parks.

There's a difference between what a dog can tolerate and what constitutes a risk to its safety. One can be managed by good socialisation (up to a point) and the other can only be dealt with by intervention and/or avoidance. No amount of "exposure" prepares a dog to handle being bitten, shaken or crushed. Sure some dogs can learn to cope with unacceptable rudeness or aggression by others. That may be fine for some dog owners if they detemine their dogs aren't at direct physical risk of harm. However, the question I ask myself is how desireable are the coping mechanisms dogs adopt in these situations. They cope by submitting to behaviour they shouldn't have to tolerate, by becoming pre-emptively aggressive, or by flight - all of which are hardly desireable responses IMO. My 4.5 kg Toy Poodle has had her butt sniffed by dogs up to Newfoundland size and she's fine with it. However a dog that wants to mouth her, grab her or squash her is NOT a situation where I'd expect her to "cope". She has little capacity to stop unwanted behaviour by a much larger dog without an aggressive response or flight.. not what you want to see in a multidog situation. I consider it my responsibilty to keep my dogs safe. Tiny dogs need more protection because they have less ability to withstand inappropriate behaviour or to defend themselves if they have to. Its that simple. If you don't have a tiny dog to protect count your blessings but I'd suggest you walk in the shows of a SWF owner before you determine that their concerns about dog parks are fantasy. Tiny dogs and baby puppies die in them. That's an indeniable fact. Despite the "aggressive SWF" stories that prevail, a significant proportion die because they meet the wrong dog, belonging to the wrong owner and through no fault of their own. That's also a fact. What the dog park bullies fail to care about is that tiny dog owners pay registration for their dogs and should be entitled to exercise them safely. A strategy of avoidance denies their dogs the freedom of safe off leash exercise in many dog parks and that's plain unfair. Same goes for owners of very young, very old and invalid dogs. That's why there should be small dog parks and big/large dog parks - petition your council and hopefully they will listen. I have a small dog as well as a medium and large dog. I won't take my small dog to an off-leash park - simple as that. They cannot take the knocks, and any rough and tumble action that will at some stage happen to them (there are a few exceptions, but generally the small dogs cannot tolerate this sort of behaviour). My small dog gets enough exercise on leash and in our yard and she mixes with my other two plus other dogs we meet on lead walks. She is fine with all other dogs. A lot of the bigger dogs also have drives (whether they were bred for hunting, retrieving, herding etc) and small fluffy dogs do look like prey to them (not all but many will see a SWF as prey). Not all dogs are candidates for dog parks - that goes for all sizes. A dog park is also somewhere were an invalid dog or very old dog should be either - why take the risk that they could be hurt - gentle leash walks for them would all that would be needed. Some of the behaviour you state - mouthing, for example is how many dogs play - unfortunately for the little ones it can be a frightening experience for them and as stated above, that's why I won't take my small dog to a dog off-leash park (unless it is segregated). While I agree with you on some of your points, I also agree with other posters that avoidance is really the only way to protect your dog (or go at times when they are not busy). Better still, why not get a walking group together - several dog owners get together and walk their dogs on lead in a group - you get to have a relaxing walk and chat with friends and the dogs get their exercise and have other dogs with them.

Oh I forgot this one - make sure you clean up after your dog(s) - so many people don't and it is a real shame.

What gives the owners of SWF's the idea that it is okay when their dog can run up to other dogs and bail them up? They are putting their own small fluffy's life in peril by allowing this to take place. It really is so darn annoying that people are aware of what their own dog's peculiarities are and still turn a blind eye, patience has to prevail as it seems that such people are the rule and not the exception Ummm nobody said this? It's again not really a question of size but manners - dogs of any size can be nasty/poorly brought up and owners of any dog can be stupid/irresponsible. My post wasn't really about SWF vs big dog but rather well behaved vs not well behaved... Unfortunately alot of people impulse buy SWF at the pet store, don't socialize their dogs with people or other dogs and in return get a poorly behaved rude monster which bails up other dogs and snaps at people... more a issue of owner than dog imo. They also see it as non threatening because there dog is small. Wrong but this is what happens when people get impluse buy puppies... and it's not really the fault of the breed (most swf you see nowadays are X breeds). I agree with you - as an owner of a large, medium and small dog I can see from all angles. I have seen more and more SWFs coming to the off-leash park that shouldn't be there - either fearful or aggressive but quite a few have gone for my bigger girl that she is now starting to go back and because she is the bigger dog, she will always get the blame. My girl then goes back on lead while the SWF continues on it's merry way harrassing other dogs while the owner is either ignorant or doesn't care. I have explained many times to these owners that if my big dog did that to your SWF you would not appreciate it, in fact I know you would be downright upset and angry about it, but for some reason, many of these owners think it is cute, or funny to see a little dog take on a big dog - it's not and it makes what should be a pleasurable time for all, sometimes a stressful time. I won't risk my girl getting a reputation and she is perfectly fine with SWFs that have been socialised, that don't go for her, she enjoys playing with them (supervised of course). I believe that there should be areas for small dogs and bigger dogs that way many of the issues at dog parks would cease (not all but many). And I agree with you that many of these SWFs have been purchased at pet shops with no idea of what they are getting, probably on impulse too. I also think that because they are small, the owners don't have to train them like the bigger dogs as you can manhandle a small dog (it won't pull you over if it pulls on the lead, you can pick it up if you need to etc etc), so they don't get socialised properly, don't go to training classes (in fact where I go for training, there are very few SWFs considering how many you see around the place). The training classes are full of medium to larger breeds and Xbreeds.

I don't generally go to off lead parks - after being burned before I decided it wasn't worth it - I only was at the off lead beach because it was fairly deserted (maybe 5-10 people across a 2km beach) and it's where my parents go. I generally keep her on lead or pick her up if we go past a dog/something I don't like the look of but this happened when the dog was quite far away i.e. 50-100 m away the first time and she was heeling. She does run towards me if there is trouble but she had to dart and got cut off from me so was circling back to me. DerRottwelier - most little dog owners have to be paranoid because unfortunately our dogs can be killed very easily even without the intention to do so. I am not overly paranoid given the past experiences I have had or heard of. I am not the sort of person to pick up my dog and scream if a big dog looks at me. I know the basics of dog behavior and have had dogs all my life - I know what a friendly playful dog looks like - and this wasn't obviously so. We get as many issues in the small ON LEAD park as we do in the off lead park (which I don't go to anymore) - more so as most people don't use leads. I love her so I try to avoid dangerous situations. Guess I thought deserted beach, few dogs/people, she is heeling behind me - it's O.K. There should be special parks for responsible dog owners i.e. you have to do a test to get in have small, big and puppy sections ... each person could make a donation when they entered to cover vet costs if there was an incident, upkeep, keeping out trouble dogs etc if only Why don't you petition your council to have a small dog off-leash area/park or make the current dog parks segregated? It is worth a try.

Good topic!! I agree with what you and others have said. Also make sure your dog is well socialised with dogs of all sizes - if you have a small dog, don't let it go up to bigger ones in an aggressive or fearful way, it isn't cute or funny (look at the little one having a go at the big one). There is one rule for all dogs - no separate rules for little and big dogs. Supervise, supervise, supvervise.

Unbelievable - I just don't understand it. BTW if your dog was on lead and her dog wasn't in an on-lead area, regardless of what your dog may do to hers, from my understanding, she is in the wrong as she has broken the law and her dog was off-lead. Two amstaffs not so long ago, both on leads/harnesses were attacked by a jack russell/foxie (it got loose from their house and went straight for the amstaffs being walked across the road). They attacked the little dog and killed it, but they were not put down. The council in fact stated that the amstaffs were on lead and under control, the little dog wasn't and was the one that caused the horrible tragedy. Those amstaffs are fine as long as other dogs don't go for them, and the owner always has them on lead.

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Wow so many replies - I honestly thought and still believe I did the right thing. I wasn't stalking anyone, just driving past as I do many times a day, yes I slow down because the house is on a corner and I have to slow to take that turn. You could not miss seeing this dog! It is up to the RSPCA now to see that the dog does get basic shelter - a kennel is not that much to ask for (and hopefully some exercise). I like to give people the benefit of the doubt and I'm hoping these people just needed a bit of education and isn't that what we on these forums like - to educate people about being a responsible dog/animal owner. I hope I never have to report anything again, it was not a nice thing to do and wasn't taken lightly. Most people around where I live seem to do the right things by their animals and this is the first time in many years that I was taken to do something.

I wasn't doing that - I only slowed down the night it was raining. I drive past the house every day numerous times as it is the only way to get to where I need to go and yes I slow down as they are on a corner and I have to.

Hi, I've just ordered my this week - pretty much for the same reason as you (though not as a harness as well). I purchased a Wolf Pack Saddle Bag - they are in the US but have a distributor in WA. They have various styles available. Here are their details: Dxenion Working Dogs 'Providing K9 Therapy for people and K9s for Cameras' 19 Ellington Terrace Port Kennedy WA 6172 Australia Ph: 0407329553 Ph (Int): +61 407329553 E: [email protected]

The Ovtcharkas (which quite a few fall under this breed) are known for their very aggressive nature. I've seen footage of these dogs and not only can they aggressive (towards humans as well as other dogs), but the sheer size of them can well be a recipe for disaster. They must have some stats in their country for this ban. The Boerbel another interesting one. Several of my South African friends (who are dog lovers and owners) cannot believe they are allowed in this country - they have said that time and time again this breed makes the front page and TV news because they have attacked people, and usually members of their own family (of course that doesn't mean all will by any means), but just shows that these large powerful breeds in the wrong hands can be a disaster. What we don't want here are the irresponsible dog owners picking these breeds. I'm all for responsible dog owners having these breeds. Large powerful 'working' breeds are a disaster in the wrong hands. In some parts of the world no-nonsense large powerful working breeds are required. I met someone from sth American and he told me that Cane corsos and Filas were the most popular guard dogs in his country, a place where they carry knives and guns around. I can imagine is some countries around the world, you wouldn't want anything other than certain breeds by your side for protection and guarding. Thank God we live in Australia.

The Ovtcharkas (which quite a few fall under this breed) are known for their very aggressive nature. I've seen footage of these dogs and not only can they aggressive (towards humans as well as other dogs), but the sheer size of them can well be a recipe for disaster. They must have some stats in their country for this ban. The Boerbel another interesting one. Several of my South African friends (who are dog lovers and owners) cannot believe they are allowed in this country - they have said that time and time again this breed makes the front page and TV news because they have attacked people, and usually members of their own family (of course that doesn't mean all will by any means), but just shows that these large powerful breeds in the wrong hands can be a disaster. What we don't want here are the irresponsible dog owners picking these breeds. I'm all for responsible dog owners having these breeds. Hmmmm.......not much else to say really other than my experience with Boerboels is the complete opposite. Again, why we are extremely selective on who owns this breed. Why we continue with the appraisal system of which the largest scores pertain to temprement then health. Why, if the dog doesn't pass its appraisal, won't be elegible for registration. Still doesn't mean your BYB can't go out and breed, but we are doing the best we can. Of all the owners and breeders that i've had dealings with in this country, all has been positive. My experince with them is that they are very protective of their owners. They have great working abilities that are lost in most mastiff breeds, especially in Australia. They are large powerful and athletic for their size. They aren't pussy cats. I think the breeders are doing a great job, not peddaling them out. Yup...you've hit it on the head. They are protective of their owners, but, not excessively and not without reason. Unfortunately our beautifual Cruz passed away on the 29th March this year (we are still devestated and aren't ready to talk about it yet), but I can say that not only did he assume to be our protectors but also our extended family and friends. The children that he grew up with were his responsibility aslo. He never forgot anyone and was a gentle giant to all of 'his' people...all 68kg of him. I have a wonderful bitch here at the moment who i've yet to introduce to everyone here, but I can say that she is an absolute magnificent specimen. The most extraordinary temprement, superb confirmation and my vet Karen Hedberg says the best hips and elbows that she has ever seen the breed here. But....I still can't (or won't) breed with her because we are waiting for representatives from South Africa to come out and appraise our dogs. This is the commitment that we've made to owning this breed and in protecting the integrity of it. Using healthy, sound, stable, solid tempremented stock & screening (even scrutinizing) prospective owners is something that we take very seriously. All we can do is our bit and hope that the dogs good reputation is Australia continues. Sorry to hear about your boy. What a great committed breeder you are - if only all dog owners were so passionate and dedicated. Great to hear that you scrutinize prospective owners too. I grew up with Great Danes and totally appreciate what it is like having an 80kg boy looking after the home (gentle, loving and loyal and sometimes the comedian!). When you see the ads on places like gumtree.com.au and you know that many of these dogs have not had health checks, have not been bred responsibly, the owners are just in it for the money, it's just so wrong. I hope you have continued success with your dogs.

Politicians ban breeds because they are ignorant to what really causes dog attacks, they want to be seen to be doing something about it to their constituents because they are too lazy to do the hard yards and fix social issues and bring about proper change in animal ownership. If only all websites read these dogs are only suitable for committed, strong dog owners, as all breeds need the same attention, but rarely does it happen. Having gameness isn't a problem, having people with a "don't care attitude" is. Yes I agree with you Geo.

Oh no I hope shes ok! !!! Give her extra pats from mum and I. Will do - thanks.

Because when I was driving past their house, I slowed down and watched for several minutes that's how. From the street you can clearly see into the living room - they were inside, the dog outside the glass doors.

Well done - great video skills!!! Riddick is such a lovely boy, you are doing a great job with him. Looking forward to seeing the next one. Rosie should be easy to teach as she does paw things all the time. Will try it with her and hopefully show you next time we are at the park. (PS Rosie is going in for a biopsy tomorrow, she has developed a hard lump at the top of her foot behind her dew claw, the vet thinks it may be a tumour, but hopefully nothing serious. Will keep you posted).

Perhaps they just needed some education and in my opinion, it is a form of cruelty, mental not physical.

Thanks everyone, I know I did the right thing and yes it was worrying me. I was impressed with the service the RSPCA gave - when I made the complaint I said that I could be wrong (about not coming off the verandah, but I was right about the dog being kept in all weather conditions without proper shelter), the RSPCA advised that they take every complaint seriously and they check all cases out. Alot of times, the complaints are unjustified, but in this case, I know the dog will be kept with proper shelter now and hopefully they will walk her (I can't imagine the poor dog kept on a verandah 24/7).

I took everyone's advice and didn't report this - until the terrible weather hit Sydney and there was this poor dog being pelted by the rain and the wind, her blanket also getting wet and she was sitting looking at her owners/family on the other side of the sliding glass doors - she was drenched. I watched this and I couldn't understand how they can sit inside and watch her this way. I reported this. I've now had confirmation that this poor girl has not been taken off the verandah once, in about 11 months, she doesn't have adequate shelter and she isn't being exercised at all. Yes they feed her, but that is it. My gut feeling all along was right and now at least the owners will have to do something. I don't care if they keep her outside, but ensure she has a kennel or something where she can escape the elements, warm bedding, and take her for walks. The owners have been told what they need to do and there will be follow-up visits to ensure that they are doing the right thing by this dog. In future, I think I will go with my instincts, even if I am wrong. If someone thought I was doing something wrong for my dogs, I would hope that someone would report me.

x2 Perhaps you should google the breed temperaments of some of these breeds - one website states that the Caucasian Ovcharka to have agression to people and other other animals (the family and the animals in the family ok) but visitors to your house beware. The sites also state over and over again - not the breed for anyone that doesn't have experience with large powerful breeds, must socialise them more so than other breeds if you are going to have one that isn't dog aggressive. While I don't want to single out other breeds, have you had a look at what these dogs can do in the wrong hands - I know you will all say that any dog can be dangerous in the wrong hands, I agree, but I would rather face a rottie than one of these in danger mode. It's not the people on these sites that are irresponsible. Can you imagine one of these dogs, purchased from a byb, put in a yard, never socialised, rarely or never exercised - what do you think will happen to that dog? We are not talking about a medium or large dog, we are talking about a giant breed with extreme power. I don't see a part in suburban life for these dogs. As a guardian dog of stock where you know that no person will ever get attacked, then ok. My family has a farm, and we have had numerous times people wander onto our land (which is clearly marked Private Property) - what if we had one of these dogs - I'm sure they would attack and the result would not be pretty (plus probably a large law suit to follow). I'm just stating that I would hate to see these dogs in the wrong hands and I don't feel that they deserve to live in suburbia. Google is not your friend if you dont have the intelligence and perspective to process the information that you are given. Probably in your instance, it is consequence of too much information and not enough explanation or understanding. I read many assumptions, built one atop of the other, with ample fairytale thrown in to fill in the blanks. There was a thread somewherre in BSL, about the wording of the Fila breed standard; different content to here, but similar concept. ie: human aggression and what they means wrt guardian breeds. NB: if your farm is in victoria and someone entered your farm despite the signage and warnings of danger, there would be no law suit if your dog was to attack a trespasser. thankyou. Point taken, but explain then why these registered breeders state on their own websites about the history and their own dogs that aggression towards humans and other animals (other than their own family) is commonplace and is part of their characteristics? (Similar to those that say an APBT has gameness). That they must have strong (not necessarily physically) owners, they are not for everyone and only certain people should be keeping them. Also, there could be a lawsuit (and there was from memory some years back now but not in Vic about a trespasser but he was illiterate and couldn't read the signs and ended up in an accident (it wasn't a dog attack). I wonder why the Danish govt has banned them?

Just noticed you live in NSW - I dont want to scare the bejesus out of you but there are quite a few Ovcharkas living fine and well in suburban and rural NSW. I'm sure there are, and if they have responsible owners, that's great. I want to see owners of any dog breed as being responsible. I'm talking of the dogs that are not kept by responsible owners - what happens to them? What would happen to your breed of dog if just left in a yard, no training, no socialisation, no stimulation, no exercise - I'm sure this happens to so many dogs out there and the frustration they must feel would be overwhelming.