moosmum

Rescue would have the best advise, but I have had to re-home many dogs for people who have asked me to take them when the pound is the dogs only other option. Thats why I say decide early before it gets to that stage.Not fair on the dog or who ever has to step in. Be prepared to wait for the right home,it may take a while.You may find it happens quickly. Being in the right place at the right time. I would approach breeders 1st,followed by rescue then vet surgeries,friends and family,pound,pet shops,boarding kennels etc... Any place where people interested in the possibilities of a dog might go but starting from the top :) Even Gumtree if thats where people go.Advertising there isn't evil if it gets the dog to a better situation.Disreputable people use it like they use anything available.Just don't be one of them.Rescues use it too,and people looking for a rescue.Include pictures and broad description of the home you feel would suit,and why. List the dogs favorable points and what it has to offer a new owner if they meet its needs.( can give you a new perspective too) You can register the dog in the new owners name with you as second contact,asking them to cover costs for that. A good description can bring a perfect result if the right person reads it. People can seem the nicest,most caring and respectable people of integrity,tell you they know all about what they are doing- and still be lousy pet owners no matter what medium you use to advertize so check things out. They own their home or have stable housing? secure fencing? Willing and able to handle any special needs? Do they use a vet when its needed ? If you give a trial and check on the dog when the trial is up,in its new home you can see for yourself if it realy is working. Trust your instincts. If you have doubts,look harder. If you still have doubts,forget it. You don't fail the dog by re homing to a more suitable home,you fail if you get rid of it. Basicaly,take the time it needs and the dog deserves. Get the word out to be seen,''cos if they don't know they won't show. Rescue should have better advise. Seems its worth discussion tho'.

I agree with Trisven and alpha bet. Harvey had 9 years of shared history and expectation in your family. Hugo can't overcome that by himself.Its one thing to recognise hes not Harvey,another to commit to welcome him to make his own place. Only you can judge the realities of the situation,but best to decide earlier rather than let things progress with no decision. If it gets to a stage of "they go,Now!" finding the right homes won't get the priority it deserves.

Stress relief in the office-

No meeting,but my local member had a staffer call me. Staffer is a breeder,concerned and sounds like having some input to explain breeder concerns which are being treated seriously . Said discussions on going with non commercial groups. Not able to give details at this time. Member for fair trading says not their dept. Ha!

The terrier was a 2 yr old rescue (now 10) The male came to us as a pup 6 years ago,but we already had 1 adult Dobe when the Bella came. She was terrific with all animals and welcomed Bella. Likely taught the boy his gentle manners. She was our baby sitter, teacher and second woman of the house :laugh: .We were always able to leave pups in her care when we were out.She made sure every one behaved.

Our male is over 55 kilos and his his best mate is a 4 kilo terrier cross female. Woe to any one who dares hurt her! he is extremely gentle with her and they are left unattended in the house when we are away. She will tell him off if he gets rough,but thats very rare. Being accidentaly stepped on is all we need worry about.

So sorry,M.M. I hope you are able to write about her one day.Sometimes words can ever be enough. I have never been able to write a tribute for Chimo, A dog who showed me how much is possible and the kind of dogs we could have. Finding that again,for me,its easier to accept that a tribute can't and won't tell their story. I hope you find that again too.

I think once they have need to join an umbrella body though, they can learn to care a lot more. There will some sort of organization to begin.

How would them inspecting all breeders benefit their own members? How would it ensure their members were not disadvantaged when they would have a set of criteria and everyone would have to be judged equally according to the licence requirements? the fact that we are small breeders already disadvantages us regardless of who is doing the inspecting. Of what benefit is it to the government to hand this over to Dogs NSW ? Now if you were telling me they wanted to inspect only their own members I get that but seriously asking for them to allow Dogs NSW to take on this role for all people in this state who might want to breed a litter or 500 is really pushing the ticket in my opinion. Either way they couldn't treat their own members any differently to any other person anyway - that's called corruption. We should be yelling from the roof tops no licencing rather than conceding that if we are licensed we want it to run one way or the other. If we give signs we will simply go with the flow its a lost battle before we start. I agree. The K.Cs stance on cross breeds is a conflict they can't get around.The public will demand equality of treatment and services I.M.O that DogsNSW won't be able to provide.

Thanks guys. Took me long enough to get to the stage where I could write it! I find myself forgetting how much trouble she was having and the reasons we gave her her wings because she left us with so many good memories. Dobbing on kids doing what they shouldn't be, coming to tell me she can't get to her dinner because the kitten sitting in her dish just batting her nose when she tries to get in, Running to try and answer the phone, waking me in the middle of the night to tell me the horses had got into the yard. Rousing on family who thought to backchat with some grumbling and roo roos. And walking in town,when she saw a girl sitting in the gutter with her back to us. The girl had a tiny bun on the back of her neck. Lou wasn't sure what that furry thing was perched there so before I knew it she'd given it an almighty poke and made the girl jump a mile. ( she didn't mind) Not just youngsters she will be keeping in line. Visiting dogs were greeted at the gate and given one of her pokes before she trotted away. Even the most reactive would just follow her to learn the rules.Adults were expected to know them. She blew me away when a fellow near our gate pulled up in car,jumped the fence and started to run towards me...She barked once and ran towards him,me calling her,not sure what she intended. She stopped in front of him only when he stopped,fell in beside him and escorted him to me at a walk,thank you ! She kept slightly in front and watched his face the whole way,like a heel. People used to say it was like she'd been here before. Maybe she will come again. :)

No night is endless,dark and bleak When from the dark,the light I seek Erupts to blaze and fire To guide me past a spirit tired By heavy hopes and wingless dreams To find another futures gleam And when I search the brightness source, I find your heart,a blinding force. Aged 14 short years. My radiant heart. I searched for Lou 4 years,and when she came to me a 6 week old pup,It was like she'd been born just to come to me. Her breeder held "Pick" for me at a special price. She was every ones pick,but the bond was instant. From the time she was separated from her litter mates,she never cried once even left alone,so long as she had some thing of mine near by.Slept by my bed happily through even the 1st night,only needing my hand to reach down when she stirred. She was my helper in all ways,from raising kids and animals to weeding and security,she was known as Goody 4 Feet and The Dog who Never Does ANYTHING Wrong. :laugh: She had a confidence to act that I had never seen before and the intelligence to act in the way that was always right.She defused situations between animals or humans near instantly,and always as a lady (maybe a slightly butch lady) loved and respected by animals and humans alike. She was my right hand in all things. And likely thought that was my role to her. Its been months since you left us Lou, You can be proud of your trainee,who looked for you for 3 of those months to come in from the night on your tottering legs,just as you taught him to look out for the weak. Your constant light is missed and we are grateful for the sparks you set to grow. Run free.

Seems lots of people are having the same problem. Hi - I just completed the form over about 45 minutes with no problems, using the www.dlg reference I gave in my other posting. I just tried again with that reference,still timed out in under 45 minutes.

Might be wrong but My impression of that proposal is for all dogs to come under a single governing body to represent members and guide future policy with the aid of the data base. Seeing what happens in other industries including live stock I believe such a body is inevitable in the long run and likely to be taken up world wide. That would explain why dogsNSW proposal is not acceptable. A shame,because I think such a registry MUST be community owned and run,like DogsNSW who are set up,running and ready to go.Or ANKC if it were taken up world wide. Changing a couple of discriminatory KC rulings would put them in a position to fill that role with minimum impact on pedigree dogs,more likely a huge benefit and upsurge of interest IN pedigree dogs and the industry as a whole,with a common community of interest and information sharing,Enabling broad,balanced self regulation of the whole industry. Any other way, I can only see it getting more difficult for pedigree breeders,becoming increasingly marginalized as long as they insist pedigree, pure breeds are the only justifiable option. Sorry,but thats how I see it.

If there must be a single registry I'm all in favor of DogsNSW offer to provide that role,but wouldn't there be a conflict of interest with rulings that discriminate against non-pedigree dogs? ie; Entire cross breds not permitted to compete? That would be a major stumbling block to an acceptance of the offer.

No doubt there are times when its fear aggression,but in many cases it most definitely isn't.In a dog with out good nerves,theres going to be an element of fear anyway so it would be very hard to tell the difference. Yes,we often read things that aren't there,but in the pursuit of science it can be too easy to explain away whats in front of us too. Why does a LSG protect his flock? Fear? Resource?

Very likely :D But many untrained dogs who have stepped up to protect their owners ARE family pets. I just think a genuine protective instinct in a dog on its own, doesn't always come in a dog thats hard to live with,or so easily predictable.( I've seen a dog terrified of snakes bolt at 1st sign of one,but return just long enough to pull the snake off another dog who had grabbed it half way along its body.It was biting him on the shoulder).Its a quality that can be bred for independent of some of the other drives sought in a purely working dog.

:laugh: My old girl used to get her squeaky toy and if we ignored the noise,she would push it up against our ears and squeak it. :laugh: :laugh:

Confidence and nerves,yes. I can't agree social dominance is always needed though. Social confidence,definitely. It depends on your definition of dominant I guess. I think confidence and dominance can be confused. A confident,social dog can be eager to please,affectionate and have excellent social skills.A dog who avoids confrontation on it own behalf,and with out encouragement may just be trusting its owners as leaders to handle a situation.Its not always weak nerved to defer.

I don't think how loudly a dog barks is really relevant to whether they would bite someone, lots of dogs, in fact most, bark at people coming to the front door etc. Some people also seem to think that because the dog has stopped barking or isn't barking that means they aren't going to bite you. Just being a specific breed doesn't guarantee the dog will act in a certain way, not every German Shepherd is capable of being a protection dog for example and even if the genetics are there training still plays a part in giving the dog experience and confidence so it knows what to do. If you really want to know rather than guess what your dog is capable of doing, get a professional to assess and test it. Then you know for sure! Depends on whos testing and what for. A Personal Protection dog is not the same as a sports dog.It doesn't have to have high drives or even much prey at all.It can be a very soft dog that just wants to be loved by every one. It does not need to be on the offense.

A lot of pups seem to go through this as a stage,so you can hope thats it and the pup grows out of it. In the meantime,short trips to good things might help. There are a lot of more natural remedies you can try,I've heard of good results just by putting a sprig of apple scented geranium in the car.

It says they could apply for a temporary licence, possibly at a reduced price. I checked the current (2013) draft LEP for my council and there was absolutely no mention of requirements for boarding/training establishments except to mention restrictions in a special case where a boarding kennel had been proposed for a residential area. I sent an e-mail asking for more specific information. And how long would it take to come through,considering there are peeps out there who never realize their dogs in pup till it whelps. These types will dump 1st. Does any one know who can be emailed to say their "Official Response" page won't work and they should by rights now extend the time frame after its fixed?

The protective drive seems to be the most misunderstood today. I don't know of any research,but what I have seen strongly supports that.

To be effective and also flexible to future needs,any legislation needs to focus on what it says to influence the culture of opinion.These proposals for breeders or even any owner of an entire dog focus not on better decisions and understanding of companion animal issues,but on reducing breeders. All breeders to be licensed and monitored with inspections. While the public and authorities are focused on breeding practices and forcing uniform standards,You are widening the definition of backyard breeders yet again to include all smaller,hobby breeders. If there is to be a single registering body for all breeding dogs (out side of commercial/farmed) it MUST be an independent community owned and run body that can encourage the dialog thats missing and provide a voice for those who have no united representation.

tried to respond via the on line feed back form and it failed to register 2x. I plan to email a response anyway,but others will give up. There are problems too with not knowing if if we will be working under annual or life time rego. If some proposals pass,but not others it will affect over all out comes so that comments on individual points might prove irrelevent or false. I could find no mention of the microchip numbers to be listed on adds to make comment, The costs of applying for a breeder license could be extremely expensive between administration and inspection of premises.Would this be an annual inspection? I assume so,if not from the start,then eventualy. This alone is going to add greatly to costs of breeding if you consider pensioners,who may be well able to meet costs of raising a litter and any veterinary treatment resulting.Coming up with a large fee for inspection and licensing before they can even consider it might not be workable. The problem with no guide lines to separate a commercial from a hobby breeder,and existing quide lines being made law,is that small breeders will come under increasing pressure over time to comply to the same standards, as the public is encouraged to accept and report any less,and enquiring breeders are given the same information as a commercial breeder. How quickly can a "provisional" license be granted from application, for accidental or one off litters? And what will be the cost? I can can see this resulting in a lot more dogs and puppies dumped by people who haven't registered their entire dogs in the 1st place,especialy if the cost to even own an entire animal are designed to penalize,yearly. My main problems with this as a whole,is in the heavy regulation, administration,and associated costs for small breeders. It sets any future direction to more of the same in the long run and is likely to snow ball out of control.If more people simply chose to fly under the radar due to costs, the original problems may increase rather than decrease.

I know petitions don't get any where near the notice that individual submissions will,but if anyone is adept at creating an on-line petition it will still increase support. It could go a long way to supporting a hobby breeders stance. Many won't take the time or have confidence to make their own submission. A rough idea below if anyone is more capable of doing this. I've worded it to be understood and of interest to anyone who keeps a companion animal,so it could be posted on any forum for signatures.Still editing and refining but might lose my internet soon so apologies for the blunder. The recommendations in their present form leave much of the distinction between a hobby breeder or a commercial breeder to the interpretation of the local councils,planning and enforcement agencies. Compliance will increase among Commercial breeders,who will be stringently monitored.The costs and administration to comply, and of monitoring breeders will require an increasing commercial outlook - There is insufficient room for breeders with goals other than financial,unless cost is no object. That means that if a breeder doesn't have ready capital to support their "hobby" as an enthusiast, They will be squeezed out of the market. It will be much more profitable for those who approach breeding from a purely commercial perspective,so commercial breeders will increase to fill the gap. These recommendations do nothing to increase the understanding and sense of responsibility for purely pet owners. They reinforce the idea of pets as commodities,through increased administration,fees and licensing required to finance the clean up after their mistakes. I don't believe this is the outcome society wants from this initiative. The over whelming sentiment from the original submissions was that companion animal welfare should be a whole community effort. With that in mind,I believe that any compulsory breeder licensing system MUST be a community run/user owned system,able to give back to its members and promote the sense of community needed for open discussion and change into the future. With enforcement of current legislation, a long over due Animal Sciences curriculum in our schools,and an unaffiliated community forum that encourages ALL parties to discuss the issues of companion animals,I believe a more responsible change in community attitudes will evolve. The recommendations as they stand will instead fix future direction and encourage an increasingly superficial understanding of living with companion animals.The need for future legislation will increase. Financial penalties and increased burden for breeders who comply will reduce the number of breeders,but not the quantity of animals bred.They will not increase the expertise and experience of breeders. They will not ensure dogs are bred raised and proved in same situation they bred for. Loosing internet.