lillim

myriad of tiny differences like.......? The 'circling' you mention. Any stalking (inspired by prey drive) I have seen couldn't be described as circling. It is fairly direct. Feet hard into the ground in prey drive, No hint of the scratchy, scenty, pissy OTT (literally) behaviour of a dog trying to assert its dominance over other dogs. Prey drive is heavy and grounded. Elbows bent. Low. Tail not up so much. A dog in full prey drive is much harder to distract than a dog asserting dominance. Much further removed. There are similarities, and it is good to know the differences. Pugs in general have a low prey drive. But they are still dogs, and owners have always valued the way that dogs play like dogs. ok, so what about heckles, I've always understood that heckles mean a dog feels threatened, but reading a thread a little while ago, someone said that heckles also present when the dog is "aroused", while I'm presuming that heckles are not present in a dog in prey drive, is it possible?

They are still dogs. :D I dunno.... ok I concede I asked a really dumb question without thinking it through :D

myriad of tiny differences like.......? Soley for companionship? Or for companionship and entertainingly despatching any mice, moths and cockroaches? :D People like to watch their puppies play, and while prey drive is reduced in some breeds, it is an inherent dog thing. but what about pugs? I though that they were from the beginning bred to be lap dogs?

The problem with using body language in training scenarios to define anything is, IMO, that you've introduced a whole new factor that is quite powerful, that being giving your dog the anticipation that they will be able to earn a reward. The conditioning involved in that is really strong. I'm sure we've all seen our dogs get excited when we pick up a clicker or a ball or get some treats out of the freezer. To me, that's just anticipation for imminent rewards in general. Most dogs I have seen "training in drive" are in a general anticipatory state and the differences are in the reward delivery stage. There's not much chance to see this with food as it's gone in an instant. I couldn't say with play versus prey drive as I'm yet to see anyone working their dog in prey drive. I know someone who does (using the term the same way I do) and they keep promising to show me videos, but haven't yet. I can't wait to see it. Everyone tells me the dog is unlike any they have ever seen before. My basic definition is exactly as the term states. Drive for prey. Not chasing, not pouncing, not stalking, not tugging, but for actual prey animals. Live prey animals. How they might go for the prey is variable, but not the soaring arousal levels at the very sight or smell of a prey animal. Dogs that instinctively know a prey animal when they see one. A dead animal is not prey; it's carrion. Food all the same, but completely different response. but then how do you explain prey drive in dogs that have been soley bred for companionship for hundreds of year, should this not mean these dogs have zero prey drive?

K9: Yes, but when the dog goes into over drive, you would be able to re direct, so your better to teach foundations before. One problem could be that your dog has a genetic desire for more drive satisfaction than the life it has now is giving, which will mean she will be looking for drive satisfaction where ever she goes. So working in prey drive may help with that too. Ok, I think I know what I'm going to be researching this weekend :D K9: Thats a very basic idea yes. K9: yep it can be and depending on who is doing the testing, is done every time. Ok, I think I know what I'm going to be researching this weekend :D and by basic idea.. do you mean drawn in the dirt basic, or I'm on the right track to understanding prey drive?

You would test for prey drive by bringing the dog into the area where the 'prey' is, and look for various things. The dog's stance, its eyes, its ears, its tail, its movement, its tenseness, will all tell you if the dog is in prey drive or not. An inability to easily distract the dog from the prey can indicate a strong prey drive. Some dogs may 'shut down' during the test if they are weak-nerved. These dogs may show prey drive when in an environment they feel comfortable with. The test is just an indication, it isn't foolproof. But it is much better than not testing at all. yes, I saw that done on RSPCA Animal Rescue with an ex racing greyhound and a swf, what is the difference in prey drive body language as opposed what in my layman terms is a "doggy stand off" i.e two dogs staring intently at each other and very tense bodies? and the difference between circling prey and aggressive dogs circling. I also wondered if testing prey drive in puppies is less effective, due to the fact that they are learning and have limited attention spans? Also, in the case of my dog she never showed an intense interest in birds until she chased one, so I always presumed she had a low prey drive, but her intense reaction to birds has made me think differently. So, is it then possible that a dog can be temp tested and shows a low prey drive, but a situation occurs later in life, that increases a dogs prey drive totally, not just towards the "thing" in the situation? I hope that makes sense :D I have to admit to being a bit of an animal planet freak and do remember some particularly vicious (well from my point of view) hunting footage of primates but I can't remember whether it was chimps or baboons, just that it was really really bloody and I think involved hunting other monkeys. I suppose we humans have modified prey drive anyway. I have seen footage of baboons hunting, all I can say is :D I am really enjoying reading everyones ideas and definitions of different drives, I am learning a lot.

She is trying to catch a treat. She thinks that if she opens her mouth it will magically fall in there. She did not catch it that time, or ever when I have tried to take a photo of it. Here is a different attempt. ahh I see, I think that second photo needs a clever caption about her awesome jedi powers moving the treat into her mouth.

so I need to directing her attention and drive to "something better" when she goes into overdrive? I think this discussion is now way over my head, so of course I have queries: so in a very tiny nutshell can the 'chasing' part of prey drive drive be classed as an instinct, and once the dog is rewarded either with praise or the release of chemicals, this affirms to the dog that their actions are rewarding, hence increasing their prey drive for the particular 'thing' that started it and that chasing and catching moving objects is rewarding? what are the technical terms for different degrees of prey drive, is it just low, medium or high? In temperament testing, is prey drive not tested, and if so how? (not taking into account breed traits)

oh oh me, I want to give feedback (because I'm such a pro with photography ) I really like the first photo, the texture of the fur nicely compliments the patterns of the eyeball.

ok, I'll give an example to explain what I'm trying to ascertain, my dog loves to chase and catch toys, enjoys squeaky toys and like to chase skinks and birds, using the command "leave it" works 99% of the time, for example she discovered a baby blue tongue and followed it, tail wagging and sniffing, but she did not make contact and obeyed me when I told her to leave it, she does this with most live things we come across wether they be moving fast or slow. We did though have a baby magpie in the garden that could not fly and she chased it, in doing so her demeamour changed, she became highly excitable and did not listen to me and snapped at the bird, I ended up tackling her then having to drag her into the house, does this mean that when is is playing with toys she is in prey drive or when she chased the baby magpie is she in prey drive, or is this something totally different? or is are both situations prey drive, just different degrees?

she is gorgeous, I love the yawning photo.

I'm not quite sure if this is a dumb question or not, but is there a test to determine a dog's prey drive?

wow, I have never heard of these. Very gorgeous looking dogs.

Thats great! I have been reading your thread about Tango and it is lovely to hear he is making progress. It sounds like you are doing a great job

Misha - original name was Epic, after owning a dog called Star who is a diva, I thought it was best not to keep a name she could live up to( i.e Epic Trouble). Misha means bear in russian, but me and the partner just liked the name. god I would love to see the look on your neghbours faces when you called him.

i have never done this myself and to be perfectly honest, I think you would have to wade through a lot of charlatans before you found somewhere who may possess the "ability" to do so.

This has nothing to do with this topic, but neither has the above Quote. You automaticly assume that all the people reading the forum are white, sandgroper might be asian for all we know. Who cares! I and my family have spent many years in Hawaii and its got many beautiful people there. So why dont you take off your KKK hood and have a good look around, no maybe better to leave it on so the rest of us dont have to look at yet another ugly Australian. Tolerances breeds tolerance. O/T - accusing people of being in the KKK does not show tolerance. One camel is better than no camels though.....

well just rub it in why don't you . My doggy housemate is a nightmare to live with, she sun bakes all day while I'm cleaning the house, drools at dinner time and I highly suspect she wears my clothes are her hairs are always on them. If you a first time renter, you can always ask your parents to act as guarantors for the lease.

I have printed almost everything off the DPI website and given it the work colleague, she is going to read over everything and read it to her sons, like a story since it has pictures. thanks for everyone's suggestions.

If the dog is not in the company of its owner, they should never approach. If the dog IS in the company of the owner, they should ask permission first and follow the owner's directions. This is all in the literature I have just passed to her, at the moment she does not let her sons approach dogs, as she did not know how to go about it. yes exactly, I'm not the best at clear and concise queries

"strange dogs" as in any dog, i chose strange as my adjective as I figured this implied an unknown dog, not how for the children to approach a dog that has been introduced into the family. no, this is why I wanted to give her some literature instead of verbally telling her,in case I was forgetful in mentioning something to her and so that not only did she know what to do but also what not to do and had a written reference and guide. I hope that clears things up.

thank you, exactly what I was looking for. Yeah I was going to say that too. I disagree, The work colleague herself is wary of dogs, but her sons show an interest in them, instead of teaching her children to stay away from dogs implying that they are something to be fearful of, she wants to teach her sons how it is appropriate to approach a dog. I figure this is a better alternative than subconsciously teaching the children to be afraid of dogs or the kids not knowing any better and running up to a strange dog squealing with excitement then hugging it.

Hi, a work colleague is wanting to teach her sons the correct way to approach a strange dog, I remember reading a really good pamphlet about this ages ago, but now cannot find it. Can anyone suggest any articles, Pamphlets, children books, websites articles or anything else?

Oh no, you better call the "plastic" surgeon

Agree, our dog learnt how to open doors and this was the most effective method. Dead easy to install too.