Simply Grand

Pebbles I'm not sure that's really a funny story ;) I don't know much about tetanus, is there treatment available if you do get it? Are there early symptoms (I remember it bein called lock jaw, it causes the muscles to freeze up doesn't it? Do you have much time to get the shot/treatment after you have an injury? I think my last shot would have been about 20 years ago (that makes me feel old!!), when I was 12 and we moved overseas...

Here are some dog breedsI know of that live outside and some of my observations about them (I'm not recommending for or against any particular breed based on this as I don't know enough about the full situations involved, just making observations): - German Shepherd. I wash one who lives outside. Approx 7 yeas old. She is gentle and quite affectionate with people, pretty anxious and fairly clingy when people are around, doesn't seem to destroy things or escape, but they have 2m colourbond fences surrounding the yard. Barks at passing dogs, not at passing people or cars. Doesnt get the regular brushing she needs so her coat gets matted. - Husky. I occasionally wash a group of 3 who live outside (together). Fairly indifferent to people, happy enough to be around them but not very interested (in me or their family members). More bonded to each other. Need to be physically moved to you where you want (ie pulled in the direction with the lead rather than responding to voice commands). Youngest one digs in the garden. Again, don't get the brushing they need to get matted. - Lab. Adopted as an adult to a family with 2 primary school aged girls. Friendly, gets excited when she comes in contact with people, jumps, licks, pees , pulls on lead to get to people, though apparently all his is getting better as they train her (over several months, not quickly!). Very sweet girl, raised on a property so used to being outside but also used to hanging around while the people worked outside etc. - Rotti, cattle dog x great Dane, Aussie Bulldog pup. These three live together outside with a family with a 6 year old daughter. The 2 older dogs are older than the little girl so were already trained and settled when she was born. The puppy is pretty calm, more interested in the other dogs than people, does get excited and jumps around a bit when patted but being a Bulldog is not all that agile ;) The cattle dog x is an escape artist, finds any gap he can to get out and takes himself and the Rotti off for an adventure around the neighbourhood. The older 2 bark at anyone coming near the house but don't seem to be aggressive. I can't think of any others at the moment... All of those dogs are perfectly fine health wise etc living outside and none of them have major problems, and all seem fairly content. Obviously the issues they do have are not purely because of being outside so any of those breeds could be suitable I suppose. It does really come down to the effort they put into the dog and how committed they are to dealing with any problem behaviours. I do agree with the suggestion of getting an older dog that is past the jumpy puppy stage. Any puppy can do damage to a toddler when jumping up, especially a larger breed and it is hard work to get them not to jump!! My Aussie Shepherd puppy (3 months old) is around 10kgs and she's getting better at not jumping up but the thing that gets her most excited and jumpy is of course little kids!! Then they run and yell and she gets more excited and chases and jumps more... It is taking a lot of work and all my attention to catch her before she does it and she's still too quick for me quite often. It has ended in tears! And she has 2 other dogs to keep her company, daily offlead running/playing, training sessions and is inside and with me whenever I'm home.

At the risk of being controversial (and please note that I personally am quite happy to follow the above etiquette and have with my 2 purebred pups) but I'm pretty sure many "general public" pet puppy buyers would be totally turned off reading something like that, especially in today's "informed buyer, negotiable, right to choice" marketplace. I absolutely agree that what is said above is the best way for dogs to be homed, but I just wonder if there is a more effective marketing method for educating and appealing to the general public if we want this to be the way all pets are eventually acquired (as opposed to pet shops, puppy mills, unscrupulous breeders etc etc). I don't have the answer, it's just something I often think about.

I don't think it's the actual being outside that's the problem, as long as there is adequate shelter etc, it's a dog spending a lot of time on its own. As you know, having inside dogs yourself, much of the time they spend with their people is just being around entertaining themselves while we get on with whatever we're doing. An outside dog is just not going to get that time so if people have an outside dog they need to make a big effort to spend as much time as possible doing things with it otherwise the dog is likely to get bored and be destructive, bark for attention, escape, etc to amuse itself. It will also most likely either be super excited when it does get some attention and be difficult to control and get calm around people, or develop other behavioural problems like aggression or anxiety because it's not that bonded to the family and/or doesn't know it's place in the pack. I don't think there is any particular breed that would be happy amusing itself outside a lot of the time and then fit in nicely as a family pet, at least not without a LOT of work, activities with the dog every single day, not just walking/running (although that too) a "job" for it to do...

Sheltie? Small but not tiny, working dog energy and persistence but people (well, certain people) focussed, coated but don't shed day to day and easy keep clean, just a quick brush every couple of days. Mine has no prey drive whatsoever! I have 2 cats and of my 3 dogs the Sheltie is the least interested in them, he'd rather play with the dogs or me. He's a bit of a stubborn, entire male teenager at the moment, at 9 months but generally good with other dogs and respectful of pack order. He doesn't love being grabbed and hugged by little kids, or anyone, he doesn't know but once he knows and likes someone he's super affectionate.

I've emailed details to our Canberra team, fingers crossed someone spots her!

Oh no, how scary! I live in Canberra and work in Queanbeyan/jerrabomberra (dog washing) so will keep an eye out and ask around and definitely call if I spot her

For me it's generally when I get out of the shower I have lots of help licking my ankles dry (hmmm, yeah thanks dogs, I have towel)!

Hehehe so many dogs joining owners in the ladies room...

Sorry pockets but I am quite happy if my dogs growl/snap/ show teeth so long as they don't make contact. They have good bite inhibition but they have the right to warn that they are annoyed. It sounds like this dog gave plenty of warning that she was uncomfortable, and both child and parents heeded it. OP obviously you can see that your child needs to modify his behaviour with the dog, he knows it too and I do think you need to monitor and stay in control but overall you are on top of it.

As far as dogs go: Poodle x Maltese Don't get either it you are not willing to brush!!! Sheltie Dont get one if barking bothers you, and as previously said, if you don't want a dog on your lap when you go the the loo Aussie shepherd Do get one because they are gorgeous! (well at least at 13 weeks)

This thread is great! There are a couple of posts saying if you don't want xxx in a dog, get a cat... Probably not a great idea... If you don't want shedding, don't get a cat If you want affection on your own terms don't get a cat If you want obedience don't get a cat If you don't want pursuit of small creatures don't get a cat If you want devotion regardless of who provided the food don't get a cat Etc etc etc

I guess many of us see a dog being under effective control as a dog that you can get to your side when required, through either verbal or physical methods. Under control also means that you can stop your dog approaching another dog/animal/person, especially an on lead dog and especially (for your dog's sake) a dog displaying aggression. I agree that it isn't acceptable for a dog to cause serious harm to another dog in its vicinity but the only thing you can control is yourself and your own dog.

Re the OP, it sounds like an unfortunate situation where neither dogs nor owners acted in the "right" way and unfortunately a problem arose. Sometimes we learn the hard way and hopefully both owners will think more in future. It's impossible to say exactly what should have been done in the situation without having been there but clearly the dogs should not have been within reach of each other.

This keyboard warrior doesn't and has freely admitted so. As such, my dog doesn't get the opportunity to be off leash at the beach. Going back to something you said earlier, why should someone have to stop at the entrance to an offleash area and wait for you to leash/control your dog? I don't really mean that but that is exactly the holier than thou attitude that a lot of people on this thread are coming out with, and that was the point of my post(i.e not an attack on you directly) p.s where i live there are no fenced in off leash area's that i'm aware of - not that i'd take my dog to one of them anyways Because we're grown ups who can communicate and, I assume, have the best interest of our dogs at heart. There will never be a black and white, 100% effective rule that works for everyone in every situation so we have to rely on owners knowing our dogs, communicating and respecting what others say. I would much much rather someone ask me to wait before entering a park for them to leash their dog than have them say nothing and there then to be a problem.

I agree with aussielover, I would (and do) let the puppy finish once they've started. I haven't had much success with interrupting them and taking them outside, it's just ended up with a trail across the house... If you stick to your routine, same spot, same word outside etc I don't think having the odd accident inside will ruin your training and puppy in pen when finished and quick clean up straight away will be less stress than trying to juggle puppy, mess and toddler while getting outside and downstairs in time for puppy to actually realise that you're taking him outside for the toilet!

Happy birthday amazing Charlie!!

Oh for crying out loud... I was just saying that there is a difference between a "newbie" who hasn't posted here before and asks for advice and someone who has been around the forum and starts a topic like this one. It doesn't take too long to realise that if you decide to start a topic or post a response you might get critical responses. Up to you how you deal with them.

How horrible and scary for you! I do hope you find them or they somehow get home safe and sound

Firestone I've been thinking exactly that through this whole thread! If the kid was able and willing to climb the fence into ellz's yard unnoticed by whoever was meant to be looking after him seems like he could just as easily have taken himself for a play in the middle of a road.

Brooke and everyone else saying DOL can be hard on newbies, I totally agree with you and don't think it's helpful, if people see us as a bunch of judgmental snobs they won't hang around to learn all the positive stuff from DOL. However cybergenisis (the OP) is not a newbie, he's been a member fo over a year, has posted in other topics and has been really quite rude to other members (see quotes in earlier posts in the thread). He also said early on in his thread that he wasn't really after advice, just some sympathy. As others have said, my sympathy is for the dogs.

I think they are just gorgeous! And I don't have much experience with them, I've met two and both were quite timid, with people and other dogs. Their main focus was their person, so I expect they'd be quite trainable but both were distracted by others nearby so had to sort of move away from everyone else for their owner to get focus. However, that's only short experiences with 2 pups! With the right breeder, the right lines, socialization and training for what you want I expect you could find a great pup.

I personally wouldn't take it as a sign of anything bad on behalf of the breeder of a pup had rear dewclaws left on. And from what minimiss says it sounds like Poms regularly do have them. Having said that I would still probably go ahead with having them removed during desexing, I think general anasthetic is more of a risk than the actual removal so I'd do it while they're already under for desexing rather than risk an injury down the track. Let us know what the breeder says though mm.

So cute! What a funny dog :)

Mm, I'd go with removing them when he's desexed, he won't need them and doing it while he's already under GA seems sensible. None of mine have had them but a friend with a toy poodle x had her pup's removed during desexing and it was no problem at all.