minky

I'd have to disagree to a certain extent as many would be open to slander charges. I for one am very strict in my breeding and far from a pf and if anyone were to accuse me straight out of something which I'm not, I would hesitate having charges laid. I also find that some tend to jump to conclusions alot before knowing the facts. I stand by the quote "TREAT PEOPLE AS YOU WOULD LIKE TO BE TREATED"

I agree!

Well, that's interesting. Be good if you could find out more. It does sound like a vaccination reaction to me. And what the vet has said / done doesn't seem like best practice either, or the behaviour of a vet who is au fait with parvo and vacs - and a lot aren't, so more information wuld be great, for Minky and these poor little pups. nickojoy Every veterinary medicine book cites a cup of household chlorine bleach in a bucket of water to kill parvo - clinical trials show it works and it has worked for others. I've used it here after parvo pups who were visiting, and had no further problems. However, it has been proven NOT to kill parvo in the presence of soil so you have to ensure that the area is clean, and you can't simply spray. The pups with parvo should be out of the area, (all pups!!) so they are not in direct contact with the bleach, and if necessary, everything can be rinsed. 1 cup to a bucket of water doesn't give off a lot of fumes, but of course, I have always used double the quantity (can't help myself) without problems. It is a very cheap and effective viricide, and when it dries, there are no fumes, and I've never heard of problems. When you are cleaning, it's easy to miss a tiny bit, and that would have to be the bit where there is some virus. LOL. I wouldn't rinse pens or crates, I'd put them in the sun to dry, but I would rinse toys, bowls etc. Things which pups would have in their mouths. Never used Trigene, but know Virkon S does work - in the presence of soil, but it has to be in contact with the virus for a certain lengh of time, and also at x strength. Great product, but expensive. Microcide worked very well - better than Virkon S, imho, but it was thought to be carcinogenic, and removed from sale. They invented F10, Virkon S and Trigene because they could and I am sure that if people were buying bleach from the supermarket, the chemical companies wanted somethng THEY could make a profit from. Oh cynic that I am!! I have no idea what you can expect. Some thought your remarks were a bit off so that will colour their opinion of you. Whether their future responses to you will be changed by that, I cannot say. Naw, but like anyone else, I am free to express my opinions. As others who agreed with me did. Are you the breeding police? Yes I have when they have been unkind and unpleasant, and I have happened to notice, and I will continue to do so. How many litters the op breeds is up to her, not you. If you think you might be aiding a pf, and that disagrees with your ethos, your option is not to call her out on it, but to avoid the thread so your beliefs will not be compromised. This has been discussed at length over time, but you are too new to know that, and obviously haven't read older threads where it was discussed. Advice is given by those who wish to do so for the good of the pups. Because we are all animal lovers. And because making judgemental calls is distressing for the op, who is already dealing with a bad situation encompassing the loss of pups, which is distressing to anyone. Perfectly respectable breeders have come onto this forum and had the stuffing belted out of them by those who were prepared to judge and condemn with little or no evidence. Some rode through it and stuck around, and have contributed to the forum, some went away, and we are probably poorer for that. And maybe the entire pedigree dog world is poorer for that. Apology accepted, although I am not offended. I simply pointed out the tacit agreement we have had for some time. Allow the poster to divulge before making judgments, consider the welfare of the pups. We are supposed to be dog lovers. Check some threads where 90% of posters have said "go to your vet", and think about why that advice was offered by members who probably did have the answers. That would be great if you get a reply back Jed. Thanks for that.

hi Centitout, Thankyou for your thoughts and advice. No matter what some think I know i'm not a pf and would do everything possible to protect my fur family. I've had people comment on how they want to come back as one of my dogs in a next life LOL. I have been bought up not to judge others and to be truthful life is darn to short to be ignorant, grizzley and unhappy. thankfully I've had no more puppies showing any signs of being sick and i hope it's all over now. Can someone tell me if thhere is any or much difference between Virkon S and the F10 as I have F10.

Tthank You

I'll be waiting till they are over 8 weeks of age. Oh, it was C3 the others had. I only had the pups inside in a puppy pen and outside on one very small grassed area and a small concreted puppy area. I only have the one male. 2 of the girls (4 yrs old) were having a second litter and one (2yr old) was her 1st litter. Iwill be ordering some of that Virkon S for the grassed area. I did ask the vet about if it would be better reducing the vac to a smaller dose and he said no that all dogs get the same amount.

They are 8 weeks old next week but think I'll give them till they are 9 weeks. I'm scared to death about having the vac done.

I did read about another breeder who had 23 pups and 11 died but I can't find that thread now. I wanted to re-read it.

Thank You for your thoughts on the death of my puppies.

Thank You for your good advice and your thoughts on the death of my puppies. where do you buy the Virkon S from.

Thank You for your thoughts on the death of my puppies.

Hi Jed, Thats right, they began to die and get sick within days of having the vaccinations. All symtoms were correct but one other thing I wrote later was the poo resembled a blob of something curdled with mucus through it. Was a tan colour and did not stink rotten like parvo. I had a case of parvo 3 or 4 years ago with one pup I purchased. It died at the vets within weeks of having it. Thank You for your good advice and your thoughts on the death of my puppies. So far and thank heavens I have no more puppies showing signs of being sick. My 3rd litter is 7 weeks old and due to be vaccinated & microchipped and it scares the hell out of me to be truthful. It will be awhile before I bred again as I only let my girls have a litter every few years. I bought some F10 as I was told bleach didn't kill parvo so I'll be doing everything inside with this. I will do all the puppy area (concrete) with bleach a few times before I use it again. One other thing, I have new neighbours (about 3 months) and they have chooks that run around the back yard and they also have rabbits in cages. I asked them to treat they're pets to be on the safe side.

One thing that does not appear to have been considered is the vaccine your vet is currently stocked with may be contaminated in some way. It seems unusual that all puppies were fine and healthy until they had their vaccinations and then so many were lost so quickly. If you are going to take your pups to the next town may I suggest that you give the vet a ring and let them know they are most likely parvo. If it is, by now your entire property is compromises as is your house, furniture, clothing and vehicles. You may wish to consider having kitty litter trays of VirkonS at the doorways to your litters, if you step into them as going in and out you may be able to limit further spread from/to the puppies. Virkon S will bleach out fabrics but is very effective at killing parvo virus. I am surprised your vet didn't know that a positive test would be returned a day after a vaccine. At this point IMHO I would have little or no confidence in your vet at all. The question about what breed are your pups is relevant to the issue. Black and tan puppies apparently have a much higher susceptbility to parvo and have a weaker immune system to deal with it. With the puppies already sick and weakened with the vaccination, it is possible treating with baycox was too much for their little systems.. not that you would have a choice if it was coccydiosis (sp). My heart goes out to you at having lost so many young pups at once. I can only imagine how exhausted you must be trying to treat so many puppies at one time. I would definitely suggest if you lose any further puppies that you get them autopsied (by a different vet than the one you have been currently relying on). If this ever happens again an autopsy will be done. I have sable Tibetan Spaniels. I'll look into getting some of that Virkon S and I've purchased 2 of those entry mats that hold disinfectant. My vet never said anything about a positive test would be returned a day after a vaccine. the first puppy was vaccinated on the Friday and tested positive on the Monday. I've heard parvo is going around but also that gastro is to. thanx for your reply.

There was no sour breath, no smelly poo. We had a lot of birds coming around for water. the poo sort of looked curdled with mucus, it was strange. It wasn't watery liquid. At the time my vet sent me home with my pup, I only had one sick and none were sick until they had been to the vets for vaccination & microchipping. I feed them boiled chicken & rice and Advanced puppy dried food. They're also has some puppy tin food and pedigree puppy milk. Plus still had a feed of mum a few times a day. thank Heavens we are holding our own! No sick puppies, all playing, no depression and all eating.

In the next town which I'm going to have to see if anymore of my pups get sick as I can;t keep this up.

thank you Garth it's devasating and after a week of this I'm surprised I have any tears left as I live for my dogs. i came on here for some help not to be judged on why i had 3 litters at once or why I'm treating at home etc.

Why so many litters at once? Have you been breeding for a long time. If you have already had a case of parvo on your property albeit 3 years ago, then you must of been aware that the virus can live in the soil for many years. Why vaccinate so early. Was the dam of all the puppies vaccinated. Has the vet confirmed it is parvo or not? What do you mean a tad over the positive mark. If she had just been vaccinated then she would have a positive test. A live vaccine is used. If you have had puppies sick from one litter why vaccinate the rest of the litters when you know that something is not right. Their immune system could be compromised. Yep all these questions. No I am not being insensitive. While in hospital recovering from surgery my girls came on season together! My daughter was staying here minding my dogs. And actually 2 of the girls were early. I've been breeding for about 6 years. My Vet told me Parvo can live in the soil for up to 12 months and I think it may be a bit longer in shaded or damp areas.(he never said 3 years) plus my pups had not been outside in that area, I have fenced off areas. The puppy area is always washed down with a Vet used disinfectant as well. I have always had my pups 1st vaccination at 6 weeks as that's what my vet recommends. All my dogs are kept up to date with vaccinations, heatworm, worming and flea treated. Only one pup from one litter had been sick when the 2nd litter was vaccinated if you would care to read again. and yes you do seem insensitive to a certain extent and I'm not an idiot! I wanted to know if anyone has experienced this type of parvo before! Or if someone could shed some light on whats going on with any breakouts. No I haven't had many litters at all so please don't judge until you know the facts. the surgery I had was NOT due to being sick! I'd had an accident and had to have reconstruction surgery and to have pins and a plate put in because of brakes and fractures. Due to being a small town our vet was already full in the o/n care room so he told me to take my pup home to treat. I was injecting fluids every 3 hours and injecting antibiotics every 8 hours. I'm doing this alone at present. Don't you think i would have preferred my pup to be there on a drip. When I drove to the vets yesterday morning to pickup more antibiotics they met me outside on the footpath! When I say the test showed a tad over on the maker it was like a white square with a line in the middle and a red stripe just went over the positive side. No blood test was done. And actually they couldn't get me and my pup out quick enough because of parvo coming up positive.

Yes it can be tested by doing blood work. My vet did the test on a stool sample.

That's what I thought as there wasn't the usual parvo symtoms. I was told the autopsy would have to be done on a fresh body (just died). I will be looking into this futher, it just there's so many different opinions around.

Why so many litters at once? Have you been breeding for a long time. If you have already had a case of parvo on your property albeit 3 years ago, then you must of been aware that the virus can live in the soil for many years. Why vaccinate so early. Was the dam of all the puppies vaccinated. Has the vet confirmed it is parvo or not? What do you mean a tad over the positive mark. If she had just been vaccinated then she would have a positive test. A live vaccine is used. If you have had puppies sick from one litter why vaccinate the rest of the litters when you know that something is not right. Their immune system could be compromised. Yep all these questions. No I am not being insensitive. While in hospital recovering from surgery my girls came on season together! My daughter was staying here minding my dogs. And actually 2 of the girls were early. I've been breeding for about 6 years. My Vet told me Parvo can live in the soil for up to 12 months and I think it may be a bit longer in shaded or damp areas.(he never said 3 years) plus my pups had not been outside in that area, I have fenced off areas. The puppy area is always washed down with a Vet used disinfectant as well. I have always had my pups 1st vaccination at 6 weeks as that's what my vet recommends. All my dogs are kept up to date with vaccinations, heatworm, worming and flea treated. Only one pup from one litter had been sick when the 2nd litter was vaccinated if you would care to read again. and yes you do seem insensitive to a certain extent and I'm not an idiot! I wanted to know if anyone has experienced this type of parvo before! Or if someone could shed some light on whats going on with any breakouts.

I've heard this but it happens so quickly and almost without warning.

Sorry to hear you are losing your pups. You say you have had a pup die of parvo in the past, was this at the same property you are currently at? Yes it was the same property, it was about 3 years ago. I'd purchased her and only had her a few weeks. I've sprayed the yard many times with bleach and am now waiting on F10 to arrive.

I had 3 litters of puppies and am loosing them quickly. Out of 19 pups I've lost 8 and have one quite depressed. They are inside and I watch them carefully every day. To start off I took litter 1 (6 pups) to the Vets on the Monday aged 7 weeks to be vaccinated and microchipped. All were happy healthy pups. Over night I lost one pup on the wednesday, 1 on the Friday, 2 on the Saturday and one today and the last one has the runs and am treating him. they just died with no symtoms or hardly any symtoms except some fluid around the mouth and it was as if they went anorexic over night, I couldn't believe it. Littler 2 went to the Vets on the Friday for microchip & vaccination aged 6 weeks. On the Monday I rushed one little girl to the vet and he tested for parvo, said it was just a tad over the positive mark. I took her home and was treating her with injections of fluid every 3 hours and antibiotics every 8 hours. Ithas been a week tomorrow since I have been treating her. She is the smallest at 630 gms but hanging in but not playful and deppressed. I rushed back into the vet on that same day with a boy from litter 3 but the vet said he was fine, no temp etc. Sadly I lost him and his brother yesterday morning and a sister today. I've been beside myself and have put remaining pups on antibiotics. I treatall with Baycox and am adding glucose to they're water. All seem ok, they are eating and drinking and playing. Only some had a little of the runs, one was green poo. I'd say the fluid around the mouth was probably vomit/fluid. Is anyone experiencing the same or have you heard of anything like this? I had a pup die of parvo 3 years ago and her symtoms were so different. She was vomiting, had the most vile smelling runs! Any help would be appreciated as it's breaking my heart. Minky

Baycox is .4ml per kg once only. Panacur worming serum is .5ml per kg for three days consecutively Great,thanks for that info.

Can someone tell me what the correct dosage is for puppies. A couple of my puppies have temps, the runs (green) and off they're food. My Vet has me injecting them with Antibiotics every 8 hours and injecting fluid under the skin for dehydration every 3 hours. I myself decided to also treat with Baycox 1ml per day over 3 days but my vet nurse said that;s to much. Can someone tell me the amount per weight. thanks.