RallyValley

I finally have a sort of brag..... we did a mock rally trial today and had it been a real trial Toby would have passed And if I knew the difference between right and left he would have got 85/100 However.... he was freaked and shut down and not really working well until he got to the third station. There was only one or two stations I thought he worked at his best. The excuses... he was camped with the show dogs (baby's debut show) and all the hubub plus me being in a rush to get Toby in the rally ring between Zora's show runs (she had to go in the ring 4 times )... (My baby Brittany also got 2xBaby of Breed and had lots of kisses with the judges )

Good luck to everyone today! Last night me and ST bathed three Weis and bathed, blow dried and trimmed one Brittany. Today I want to run Toby in Rally and will be bringing him but it all depends on timing.

So sorry RS, RIP Chloe. These past few months have just been awful. I am sure it will be a comfort to your family having Pippa there to bring some joy.

GSD Girl I don't know personally but http://www.benotto.com.au/ has a really good reputation

Maybe leave it at that Matthew - you will never win here. I think there is a Poodlefan fan club. ;) Yes we are called 'Poodlefans Army' or PA and we have magical coins that tell us when to meet up and get online and blatantly agree, cause none of us have our own minds.

The FCI groups seem quite disproportionate size wise, a dachshund group for example. However I don't understand FCI so won't pretend to know much.

Fixed. Thanks PF! I was wondering if I would get some interesting PM's if that was left in my name

You honestly think banning guns has made Australia safe from gun related violence? And banning alcohol in the 20's made Americans stop drinking. Tell you what Matthew, if you can stop needling me with personal insults long enough to go do a bit of research, come up with an example of where prohibition ALONE has resulted in the end of a practice and I'll start paying heed to your argument. Just to be clear that is NOT my quote! It belongs to Matthew_B

Actually I'm a poodle and whippet owning female who's never owned and will never own an APBT and I live in one of the only places in Australia where it is still legal to own one. Matthew, you show me ONE place anywhere in the world where banning breeds has lead to a decrease in dog fatalities. I can tell you now that you won't find one. How is that a "futile" argument? Breed bans don't work. There are no simple solutions to the questions of what makes dangerous dogs. Until we as humans accept our responsiblity for creating such animals, children will continue to die. It's quite simple, even you should be able to understand it. Ban the breed and it ceases to be around to kill or maim people. Yes, the dog was bred to fight other dogs, but in the absence of another dog, it'll attack anything that moves if it's in the frame of mind to do some damage. Your argument is as dumb as that regarding guns. "Guns don't kill people, people do". Take the gun out of the equation and there'd be a massive drop in the homicide rate. Same thing applies to this vicious breed. Take it out and there won't be any pitbulls to attack people. Matthew, drugs are banned but people still take them? Police actively try to track down the people producing these drugs and still people die from Overdoses and side effects. Banning something does not mean it stops, it means the deceptions and black markets start forming. These things become more glamorous to have for people who like to flaunt the law, they are getting it for an accessory, just like people got small purse dogs for accessories ala Paris Hilton when it was the trend. Only the consequence is that these fad owners don't get the dog for a dog and don't know how to raise the dog correctly and the consequences are awful. It's like giving an unltrained driver a V8 and them showing off on the road in it... potential for disaster. True on illegal drugs. But consider this. You get attacked by a dog which has been banned. Chances are that the owner will face much harsher punishment for owning a banned dog that attacked you than if the dog was not banned. Having the breed banned would hopefully make people think twice about "underground breeding" of these dogs in case the mentioned scenario eventuated. People would hopefully not think it is worthwhile to risk such a harsh penalty just for the sake of a dog. I really don't think so, as far as I am aware it already illegal to breed Restricted Breeds, yet there is a never-ending population of them. Consider this. You get severely mauled and lose the use of an arm due to an attack by a *insert non banned breed here*, you have a long hospital stay and many months of rehab - the owner gets fined $2000 and the dog is PTS. The person who owned the dog goes out the next week and gets a dog of the same breed and raises it just as poorly as the first. Your friend gets a bite from a banned breed, he just has a puncture wound that does not require stitches or medical attention bar a prescription of antibiotics - the owner gets sent to prison for 5 years for owning a banned breed involved in an attack and the dog is PTS. They are also banned for owning dogs for life. So in answer to your question I would like to see tough penalties relevant to the severity and the situation, regardless of breed, it should be based on the owner and the deed. I would be hugely peed off to be told 'well the person only gets a fine, their dog isn't a banned breed'.

There are a few Brittany's that compete around Aus, they are in the 500 class.

Actually I'm a poodle and whippet owning female who's never owned and will never own an APBT and I live in one of the only places in Australia where it is still legal to own one. Matthew, you show me ONE place anywhere in the world where banning breeds has lead to a decrease in dog fatalities. I can tell you now that you won't find one. How is that a "futile" argument? Breed bans don't work. There are no simple solutions to the questions of what makes dangerous dogs. Until we as humans accept our responsiblity for creating such animals, children will continue to die. It's quite simple, even you should be able to understand it. Ban the breed and it ceases to be around to kill or maim people. Yes, the dog was bred to fight other dogs, but in the absence of another dog, it'll attack anything that moves if it's in the frame of mind to do some damage. Your argument is as dumb as that regarding guns. "Guns don't kill people, people do". Take the gun out of the equation and there'd be a massive drop in the homicide rate. Same thing applies to this vicious breed. Take it out and there won't be any pitbulls to attack people. Matthew, drugs are banned but people still take them? Police actively try to track down the people producing these drugs and still people die from Overdoses and side effects. Banning something does not mean it stops, it means the deceptions and black markets start forming. These things become more glamorous to have for people who like to flaunt the law, they are getting it for an accessory, just like people got small purse dogs for accessories ala Paris Hilton when it was the trend. Only the consequence is that these fad owners don't get the dog for a dog and don't know how to raise the dog correctly and the consequences are awful. It's like giving an unltrained driver a V8 and them showing off on the road in it... potential for disaster.

What data did you use to compile these statistics? If the answer is none I would not rank breeds and instead out a - next to them under catagories. Or re-title the thread "Most popular agility breeds by height"

Wouldn't Curly Coated Retrievers be too big? The two that I have met were both bigger than a GSD. Maybe PF means Muarry River Curly Coat... because Curly Coated Retrievers are the tallest retrievers, so that would put them at at least 30kgs, probably bigger.

I assume gundog and herding breeds would be right up there with bites PF given how mouthy both groups are. However if they tabled bites that require hospitalisation by breed I think those stats would be wildly different.

At the risk of being flamed, Brittanies can be hard work for agility.. IMO they can be hard to keep on task. Their athleticism doesn't translate into results for the most part. A working ESS would be a better prospect IMO. What size Skip? Small, medium or large. My bet that most agiiteers could name the top five or so breeds in each size for you to consider. PF I would encourage the OP to look at various breeders and lines before they make their choice. I believe the Britts in the ACT are mainly 'French' type and they work differently to the US type, to the point the UKC has registered them as separate breeds. The US lines are known for their higher biddability and obedience, here is an article from a US breeder who breeds both strains (separately of course) explaing the difference. http://www.wyngold-brittanys.com/page9.html

I think Carl mentioned ACDs in that interview with lady because that is what she owns and was trying to say 'what about of this was your breed?' however he did it badly and I am not 100% sure many people would have picked up on that. I have to say if Pitbulls are banned what next? None of us want their breeds on that list. However people equally whine about how governments want to crack down on dog owners which is the other alternative.

There are similar comments being sent into the Today show by viewers. One was 'Why don't these people think the lives of children are more important then their breed?' and other inflammatory type statements.

Definitely look into Brittanys! They sound quite suited (Spotted Devil I think we will find wherever ESS suits Britts suits too). ETA I can't see it either Spotted Devil.

A Britt should be quite a light agile dog, definitely not heavy boned, that's a breed fault. Have a look at a Brittany puppy v a Welsh Springer Spaniel puppy, Brittany's are definitely lighter on bone (on average). aussielover Large Munsterlanders are LARGE lol... they would rarely be under 25kgs fully grown! They are GSP sized ;) If I read correctly and it's for your parents who live in the UK I would recommend a Kooikerhondje or Small Munsterlander. There is a well known UK breeder Tournesol Brittany's (Thier site here) and they describe a breed that is a bit different to the US Brittany type we mostly have in Australia. Do you think Brittany's would be a bit full on then? My parents are looking for a companion only, they have no interest in dog sports or field trials etc. The dog would be guaranteed to get plenty of exercise though! How do english and american brittanys differ? Are they getting the dog here and then leaving or getting one in the UK? Any Brittany would need some kind of mental stimulation BUT American Brittany's are said to be more family friendly (if you believe what you read). However officially they are the same breed and I have not met any UK type Brittanys, only seen them at an agility trial so I cannot personally comment. From American Brittany Club "He is noted for an exceptionally keen nose and a very biddable disposition. Many of the country's top dogs have been house pets as well as field winners and fine hunting dogs. The Brittany is a high energy dog who is bred to hunt. He does need lots of exercise or opportunities to hunt to keep him happy. He has a typical friendly disposition and is very willing to please his master. He may be expected to absorb training more easily than some of the other pointing breeds, needing only a sharp scolding or slight punishment." From the UK Brittany Club: "The Brittany is primarily a hunting dog with character, stamina, speed, and great courage. The Brittany is a force to be reckoned with, having the urge to hunt fixed into it's temperament. It must be remembered at all times that gundogs must in general, by their very being, be a social animal without vices, not only with their human companions, but also with other dogs. It is not very often that a shooting day has only one dog present - there are many - and the dog's temperament must be such that it is a pleasure to take with you on such outings, not a pain to have to guard against unfortunate encounters with others. The Brittany loves to be loved - but it also loves to work. They need an occupation or will readily turn into a hooligan. Almost any occupation will be taken to easily - not just shooting! The H.P.R. in general needs work, whether it be actual Gun Work, Bird dog Work, Obedience, Agility, or as a well trained family pet taken out for long, free-running, jaunts with the children. "

I am 99.9% sure this is an American breed, not sure how common they would be in the UK.

A Britt should be quite a light agile dog, definitely not heavy boned, that's a breed fault. Have a look at a Brittany puppy v a Welsh Springer Spaniel puppy, Brittany's are definitely lighter on bone (on average). aussielover Large Munsterlanders are LARGE lol... they would rarely be under 25kgs fully grown! They are GSP sized ;) If I read correctly and it's for your parents who live in the UK I would recommend a Kooikerhondje or Small Munsterlander. There is a well known UK breeder Tournesol Brittany's (Thier site here) and they describe a breed that is a bit different to the US Brittany type we mostly have in Australia.

Show line Welsh Springer Spaniel and English Springer Spaniel might suit too... Plus most of the other spaniels depending on preference.

Brittany fits your criteria. The variance in hair may be more to do with grooming. The American Brittany standard states that excessive feathering should be severely penalised and that a less heavy coat is preferable to a light coat. I was looking closely mainly at Tollers, Flat Coated Retrievers and Large Munsterlanders. I went for the dog that from what I had heard is the most sound in body and mind, I NEEDED a people friendly, dog friendly outgoing dog. Tollers came a close second and there is one special Toller boy in WA that I would have if I could have a carbon copy of him ;) But at the end of the day I wanted a Utility Gundog as you can do more - retrieving trials as well as UG ability test and field trials, I liked the idea of a pointing dog! Vizlas would also suit but I only briefly considered them as I wanted a hairy dog that I can make pretty for the show ring.

Thought so - another thing to be aware of in the future. Thanks for the food for thought. Yes that's true, maybe it will! Yes very very fun, I just feel so in sync with her - I'm sure you know what I mean I hope you do RV. :D I dare say you will. I wouldn't say Trixie is independent at all, certainly much less so than Kyzer, in fact I think that's part of the reason she responds better, but she is just so different, she is almost fluid like?? I dunno maybe I've had too much sugar today This is going to sound ridiculous But it's like Trixie is so fluid and smooth, and Kyzer is more jerky and wiggly and can change direction at any moment, whereas Trixie gets on a line / curve and follows it, weird hey As a result, my handling with Kyzer is usually jerky and wiggly, and with Trixie it is smooth and fluid Not ridiculous at all... Toby felt like he was skipping along with a big grin, almost chasing after me. His handling was mostly intuitive as he just followed my shoulders and where I pointed. For my pup I actually want to implement a handling system, so she has consistent responses and I am more consistent - not making it up as I go along.

that is disgusting and totally unacceptable. Shame on whoever sent it. We all have bad days and we all say things we regret. All you can do is learn from it and apologise if you see the woman again eta i can kinda of understand where everyone is coming from though. I often see people walking down the sidewalk with very small puppies that look like they are too young to be out- something to consider i guess Agree about the PM being awful. I have seen a few newer members say people have sent them nasty PM's... is there anyway that the OP can report the person who sent the PM?