jacqui835

I do not think that people are saying BM + 6 year olds = disaster. It's the combination of this, plus the mother has been saddled with this responsibility and was not consulted and, by all accounts, not interested. Father will not be there to take much responsibility - yet he chose the breed. They do not sound dog saavy - choice of breed under the circumstances plus father was hoping that the 6 year old could take the dog to dog training. Hell, I hope they take the dog to training, but I hope the whole family is on board. Six year olds should not be the main care provider for any dog. Do I think a BM could work with a six year old? Yes. But the main adult caregiver would have to really, really want the dog and really do their research. It couldn't just be a dog 'for the kids', that gets left out in the yard 24/7 and should just magically behave without being taught what is appropriate behaviour. Not that I think any type of dog should be bought under these circumstances. Edit to add something Oh thanks, that makes sense then. The families I knew with these breeds were very passionate about the breed and yeah, at least one adult was desperate for the dog (and the other quickly came around lol). I should have read it more carefully to begin with...

Wow I'm guessing I must be really wrong about this breed, but I actually thought it was quite a good one with children. I've always heard them to be described as gentle giants and the ones I've seen have conformed to this image. I have seen a couple of mastiffs and rotties raised by young children (of course with the parents supervising and assisting but with the child really fulfilling the role of main caregiver) and it's been a beautiful partnership. My cousins were virtually raised by a rottie, it walked them to school each day when the little girl was only slightly taller, but the parents did teach them how to be firm and assertive. Unless the parents/adults plan on having absolutely nothing to do with the dog, well I would imagine it could work out quite well. I guess I don't know the full story here, but to be honest, I would be freaking out more if the child was going to be trying to raise a really high energy, intelligent breed rather than one bred to basically lie around and guard his territory...

Thanks guys, this thread has been really interesting and helpful. Gosh Dan would just about think he'd died and gone to heaven if I said I wanted a Great Dane, but whilst I think they're beautiful, I don't think I could handle the short lifespan. Additionally, all the ones I've met haven't been prolific droolers, but there's definitely more there than what you have on a dobe (which is pretty much none - only time I've seen him drool was when he ate weedkiller). If one of our dogs needs at least an hour of intense physical exercise a day (and several hours of intense loving lol), we may as well get another that's similar so that we can get maximum happiness with the time we have. Everyone seems to have different ideas about which breed/diet is worst for odour, so seems like it might actually be more dependent on the individual dogs. Whatever breed we decide on, I think meeting the parents will be key...

The worst dog that I have ever smelt (that was not ill or injured) was a malamute than had a moudly coat. Bacteria causes odour, so of course some breeds and individuals are going to be smellier than others. Ask different breed owners how often they wash their dogs for one clue. It seems to be that poodles do get washed much more often than some other breeds have to be washed. From my observations, it is the 'waterproof' breeds that have an oily coat that produce the most sebum, that oxidises with a very distinctive dog smell. Labs, beagles, GSD, etc tend to have this coat. The smell does build up on the dog and its environs depending on how much sebum the dog is producing. Then you have the white dogs that are so prone to secondary yeast infections settling into sensitive irritated skin. Westies, and white dogs of some other breeds. The more they smell the more they get washed, the more potential for bacteria overgrowth through improper drying of coat. Give me a lovely clean greyhound, whippy, doby, weim, vizsla, or dane to hug. Even if it hasn't been washed in 6 months. Or maybe a spitz that gets brushed heaps but not washed as often. As long as those dogs are on a good diet, their coats stay fairly fresh. Very helpful post, thanks Dan will be overjoyed with that list of potential breeds lol but I'm starting to think the weim is definitely worth looking into. Sounds similar to a dobe but with a bit more of a hunting focus, but still a guard unlike the vizlas etc. Dan would love a dog that actually wanted to retrieve from time to time, because our dobe certainly has no interest...

Yes my partner would actually love a greyhound, and I'm quite keen on them myself. Only thing is, one of the main reasons we would even be getting a second dog is so it can be a companion to our dobe. He is about 40kg and loves to chase and wrestle and play, and ideally we want a second dog who likes doing this too. Even though you sometimes see greyhounds who are quite muscly and strong looking, I worry that the dobe would accidentally hurt her with his paws. It's just he plays best and seems the most interested in other dogs similar to him, GSD and Belgian shepherds, rotties etc. Plus I've heard greyhounds can be real couch potatoes and always seem quite shy, though very sweet. Just yesterday we took our dobe for a 15km bike ride where he ran along side at about 20km/hr and then to a housewarming party where he turned out to be the life of the party. He seems to love our bushwalking and bike rides, and also enjoys being the center of attention in a large house party with lots of noise and people. Champagne corks exploding, strangers trying to hug him, little toddlers pulling on him - he just takes it all in his stride and is ever optimistic and opportunistic. I love the whole sighthound family and would love one, but I just don't think it would fit in with our lifestyle and that wouldn't be fair

They certainly loved them a lot and the dog I saw at least had no obvious ear issues, nor did he smell of anything other than dog - it just smelt like a normal dog. But they were fed pet food you buy from the supermarket, cost them a lot but I now know there's virtually nothing you can buy from a supermarket that's good for your dog. But most people don't know. It wasn't a really bad smell, just, they smelt like dogs. My old dog smelt the same and I know he didn't have any ear infections. I don't really mind the smell that much to be honest but I don't think I could go to work smelling like that. And I guess we're spoiled now because you can literally bury your face in our doberman and not really smell anything, certainly nothing unpleasant, and I haven't really met many other dogs (none that I can think of except for his parents) that I would say that about. My sister has 2 little papillons, and although they're washed, groomed and fed well, they smell doggy, so I guess we've just assumed it was a breed thing. My dobe is lying on the floor in the sun next to me right now, and shivering from time to time because it's very cold outside so there's a price to pay for his thin coat. I'm really glad to hear some people have GSD's who don't smell, because I still really love the breed. My partner has started requesting a weimeraner, so looks like decision making is still a way off...

Hmm this is really odd, because I met his family's latest poodle and it was as stinky as any other dog. Dan says all of them have been the same, and he's had 3 in his life so far. And they washed him like once a month, which is about how often we wash our dobe. When you patted the poodle, your hand was left with that oily, smooth sort of feeling you get when you pat most dogs - if anyone knows what I mean, hard to describe lol. They have all been standard pedigree poodles, all black and all with papers so I'm not sure what's going on there... I just had a potential epiphany though; maybe it's the diet that makes more difference than the breed. Our dobe is fed almost all natural food, and I think his parents were too and none of them smelt at all, despite his parents actually being dirty enough to leave your hand coloured. Our earlier dogs were always fed supermarket dog food, and always smelt, even like right after a bath. This gives me hope because maybe I can have a nice smelling GSD. Does anyone else have a dog that eats a natural diet and doesn't smell? PS I think Samoyeds are beautiful dogs but probably not the right sort of temperament for us, big dominant working dogs are one thing but I don't think we could handle a spitz lol

For some time now, I have had my heart set on having a GSD, perhaps a white one, as my second dog. However today whilst we were discussing it, my partner brought up the shedding issue again. He has always been keen just for us to get a second red doberman, only a female this time, but I don't want two dogs that look almost identical, and he doesn't like black and tan dobermans (he just worries that it will be received differently). So we have decided that if we get a second dog, it will be a different breed. Anyway to the point, my partner said he was worried that a GSD would not only shed more and make our house a lot hairier than what we're used to, but also that it would bring that 'doggy' smell that our dobe has never had. Even if he hasn't been washed for several weeks (which is pretty rare to be fair), he never smells doggy, or makes your hand smell after you pat him. Don't get me wrong, he can get dirty but his coat seems to be almost self-cleaning and he just doesn't seem to produce the doggy smell. His parents were the same, and I remember we noticed this and were really happy about it, since both of us had had stinky dogs before. My partner actually grew up with standard poodles, and although they might not shed, they certainly have that doggy smell! I guess now we've been spoiled and we are in agreement that we would like another dog that smells like our current one. Has anyone noticed other breeds that don't have that doggy smell? In particular we would be interested in the working breeds with similar temperaments to dobermans -ie dominant, energetic etc. I also want to add that of course we loved all of the dogs we've had, but I love that with my current pooch I can hug him in my work clothes and whenever I want, have him in the bed under the covers etc and no-one can tell just from smelling me that I even have a dog, or that a dog even lives in our house even though he spends most of his time indoors. Just means now that we're both working full-time in professional type roles we get to spend a little more quality time with our pooch.

Wow cuteness overload... I think the rotties, the beagles, the corgis, the ACD and aus shepherds are particularly gorgeous, but don't think I could pass on any of them. I'm glad to see one dobe has already featured, but really, to me they are the cutest things out there and so here are a couple of my boy and his siblings from when he was a baby

AWW a baby dobe!

not every dog has the luxury of this. Many owners want to see safety or it's a one way trip to the vet. Dog behaviour is not always going to be warm and fuzzy. You do what you have to do to make the dog safe, yes it may be confused for the first time but you show it the right way to remove that confusion. Many owners just can't even handle it. Think about it. If they let their dogs get to this point, do you really think they are going to be willing and/or able to rehabilitate them slowly and properly? CM always says he's there to rehabilitate dogs but people are the ones who need the training.

Would you hit him in the inguinal region in the same way? Is it a good analogy? Haha just the other day we noticed the exact same thing. I often hug my dog and whack him on the side a bit like you would with a horse, and he loves it. Dan pointed out to me that I pat my dog harder than I smack him, but, it has a totally different affect on him because he knows he's in trouble and that's what makes him upset, not the actual smack (plus he doesn't seem to feel physical pain). We raised our dog on CM methods, starting with choosing a balanced puppy to begin with based on CM's book, and he has a bit of a fan club these days because he's such a wonderful dog who I really can and do take anywhere I want. CM doesn't advocate smacking your dog, and there's a difference between when I smack my dog - which is more symbolic than anything else, to when I touch my dog on the neck, or under his stomach to shock him a bit and draw his attention away from the rabbit or whatever he's fixated on. CM taught me that a slight tug on the lead (rather than yanking your dog, which is what I would have automatically assumed) is actually the more effective way to get their attention back on you and wondering what you want. I have watched almost every episode of CM and I have never seen what I would term abuse - I have never seen a dog sustain any sort of injury, I've never seen him angry with a dog, I have never seen him not want to help a dog and I've never seen a dog dislike or fear him more than it dislikes or fears the general public. For the most part, I see the exact opposite. I've even seen episodes where he refers the dogs to other people because he thinks their environment and approach may suit them better. I think what some people seem to be forgetting here is that these are dogs that without CM would be put down. These are dogs that are completely unsuited to living in society, that have fallen so far from the norm that they're basically existing in a different world. And how many people have invested as much time and money into the welfare of dogs as CM? Is there anyone who would even come close? He is a true champion for the dogs. The only thing I would ask him to change is for him to put more emphasis on the fact that the majority of the public shouldn't be trying to implement his strategies themselves, and that the dogs he's dealing with require different sort of treatment from the dogs they meet in the park (ie if one more idiot tries to roll my dog in the park claiming to be a CM fan - well it's enough to drive you mad). Perhaps to state that he is running a program to show you his experiences, not to try and teach people how to handle or identify red zone cases...

What a crock : You can apply Cesar's methods without being violent towards your dog - the only time I see him use physical force on a dog is when it's at the end of the road, about to be put down and has some serious issues and results need to be achieved quickly. I have raised my dog based on Cesar's methods from day 1 and he is a very well balanced, confident and happy dog who can feel comfortable and trust in us because we pay attention to him and watch for his attempts to communicate. What I admire about Cesar is that he watches and recognises the signs, and if your dog feels like you're seeing and understanding the situation, they (in my experience at least) tend to be a lot happier to surrender to your command and not be so worried about everything. The problem I think stems more from the fact that people watch only part of the show or read only a bit of the book and then go and try and apply particular steps completely out of context. I'll never forget there was an idiot at Centennial Park back in Sydney who I saw a couple of times, who was going around trying to roll everyone's dogs and saying it needed to be done so that they could then all be friends. He said he was a CM expert. Some of the dogs just accepted it, some ran away, and some displayed defensive behaviour (which in some cases the owners then attempted to punish), but all of the dogs were very uncomfortable. He then approached my dog and grabbed his collar and starting trying to roll him. My dog growled and slipped away and ran to my side. I told the guy not to lay another hand on my dog, and in return, received a massive lecture about how I was ruining my dog etc. Fortunately, I was well-known enough around there as having a very well-trained dog who didn't cause any problems in the park that several people stood up to him, and he left, saying that we were creating dangerous dogs or some crap. Didn't see him again. Although I personally really admire CM, for the most part, I run for the hills if someone comes up to me and claims to be a CM endorser. I have met very few people who I would actually class as CM endorsers, and I would also argue that the majority of people couldn't achieve what he does because more than anything, it's about the frame of mind. I know that for me at least, it's a lot easier to be calm and assertive with other people's dogs than with my own, because emotions get in the way, so whilst I try, I would not class myself as competent either, but at least I think I'm better than what I was before I saw CM at understanding my dog and communicating with him.

That's interesting. My dog is almost always fed at about 8-8:30pm after we eat, but every now and then, I will give him his dinner earlier just because and he seems to understand that he only gets fed once a day. He also seemed to have an understanding of time, or at least routine, because from his actions, I can actually tell what time it is. 6am, he will wake up, start annoying my partner as he knows he'll get nowhere with me but Dan may very well let him out. 5pm he knows is walk time, and I know it's 5pm because he will come and find me and try to rest his head on my lap and look up at me, asking to be walked (this was before I started full-time work). We get home at random times each night, but he starts to loiter around the gate from about 5:30pm onwards and runs towards it if there are any car noises or people walking past (this is according to my neighbour, who loves him and watches him during the day for me). If they don't have 'memories', they can still definitely build associations. He knows whole trips off by heart, for example, if I start heading for the vet, he knows after about 1-2 mins in the car that that's where we're going. You can tell from his reactions that he knows where we're headed.

I wish this forum had a thanks button like the other one I use does. THANKS! Agree, that would be awesome. And thanks My dog has eaten/humped his existing bed to death (he had it for over a year which is pretty good) so this sounds perfect.

Great post and really well worded

That's very sad and scary, but one thing I thought you should know is that just bc your dog gets attacked, doesn't mean anything has to change. My dog was attacked as a baby by a large bully type dog owned by someone who knew he was aggressive but had him off lead anyway. But my dog is fine. He loves other dogs and I don't worry about it anymore same way I don't worry about crashing every time I get in my car. With dogs you get out what you put in, but the best part is it's on a sliding scale so you'll find they can give a lot more than they get after you hit a certain point. Try reading up about your breed, and if you really don't think you can provide the right home then give him up. But keep in mind, you guys are everything to him, and most dogs surrendered never leave

http://www.smh.com.au/executive-style/luxu...0316-1bx40.html Paying more to get them but not sure if this is a good thing for the dogs

Question: I am liking all the definitions and explanations of dominant, and it still seems to fit my dog for the most part. But here is my question. Most dogs who see him give him the movie star treatement (I previously put it down to his good looks lol), lick his mouth, crouch down in front of him etc whilst he doesn't even look at them, or else they might ignore him except for a quick sniff, or want to play with him and sometimes he'll play a bit with them. But every now and then, I will see, usually before he does, another dog who I know will try to cause problems. They typically seek him out from across the park and beeline for him, holding themselves super erect and stiff etc. My dog doesn't start fights, but he seems to annoy the occasional male to the point (just by his mere presence) where I can see that they want to fight him and then my dog refuses to back down unless I intervene and shoo the other dog off (and pray that I never come up against a dog who will take on a human). So what happens if 2 dominant dogs come face to face - as I'm guessing this is what's happening in these cases?

Ohh what is Bossy? He's beautiful

Lol that one actually made me laugh! Some really great photos in this thread

Me too! And thanks, I love black dogs though because they look so shiny I love the way Elbie's ears point with the rest of him lol

Seems I moved to Adelaide just in time for the holiday that Sydney doesn't have - Adelaide Cup Day! Today we went for a drive up through the Hills and the Barossa, and naturally, took the pooch. My partner is as in love with his camera as he is with the dog and myself which for me fortunately means a constant stream of awesome photos of my dog Here are some of the ones I liked best that other people might also be interested in seeing. We then went to check out a few wineries and lookouts. Doing his little one paw raised thing Looking extra regal Doing his one paw raised thing again And finally, here's one where you can see some of the view plus me and the pooch. Unfortunately all the rest of the view also include me :s It's also cute because he's doing a head tilt as I smile at him, I really like this photo of us.

Very informative post, makes perfect sense to me. My dog I guess is fairly dominant as he has a strong desire to be higher in rank and exudes a sense of self-entitlement and confidence. He doesn't however, appear to have any desire to be aggressive or cause injury. He was indeed dominant from when we first got him - 8 weeks old.

My dog has been described as a good typical dominant doberman by our old training club and he is similar to this. He refuses to submit to other dogs - I have never ever seen him on his back, put his head down or submit in anyway. Only difference is that he tends to evade fights even if it's his behaviour that led to the start of it (he wasn't always like this, but we really worked with him when he was a teenager). He will just walk away, or spin around continually so they can't get behind him, trying to stare them down. He is taller than almost every other dog, and he uses this. He has only ever been in 2 fights, despite the fact that I visit dog parks several times a week - both times were with bully type breeds who had attacked other dogs before, but I know that had he submitted instead of acting like a cocky idiot, he would not have been attacked. He nearly lost an eye once as a result. Only thing is he's not dominant over me. He is dominant over strangers though he has never been aggressive towards humans. Just if I'm not around, he has been known to push them around a little, steal their food, and doesn't listen to anything they say. To this day, although he loves my partner, if he issues him a command, he will almost always look to me first and see if he can't get a reprieve. I always make sure I support my partner's orders. He will listen to my partner even if I do nothing, but typically, my partner has to actually get up and go over to him - or catch him first, and then the dog will sometimes try and turn it into a half challenge/half game - get down on his front legs and bark at him kinda thing. This is what I expected though getting a doberman. They might be dominant, but they're also really needy and sensitive towards their chosen person/people, so that gives you a lot more control. There's absolutely no way I'd take a dominant, independent type breed like an Alaskan Malamute or something.