jacqui835

There was a thread a while ago about dog toys, and somebody gave a link to a really tough rabbit toy for tug of war games. My dog loves tug of war, and anything we buy from the shops is torn apart in seconds (he's a doberman), but this toy lasted us many great fun tug of war games. Unfortunately, it finally met its maker Does anyone know the toy I'm talking about? It had minimal stuffing, squeakers, reinforced multiple times and strong yellow layer under the fur to provide additional strength. I really need a new one, as we used it for training (he won't work for food). Really should have ordered more than one, but I think they came from the states, and I wasn't sure how good it was going to be. If anyone knows of any other good tug of war toys - preferably fluffy and with squeakers, I would also be keen to hear of them.

Playing devils advocate here - in what situation? Suppose the dog was protecting a flock of sheep and a neighbourhood dog out on a walk with its owner entered the paddock to chase the sheep and was injured by it. I guess what I mean is fine people for creating dangerous situations. If you live in the city, and you create a dog that is dangerous, then you should be held accountable for what happens. But for example, there is at least a decent chance that my dog would attack someone who came onto my property without me knowing about it - you can never know for sure of course, but I would never say to a stranger, oh you'll be fine going onto my property without me being there. I do not consider this dangerous, trespassers are breaking the law and disrespecting others - when you do this expect consequences. But, I take my dog everywhere with me, and say I had him at a cafe and he attacked a waitstaff person, or someone else's dog, well that's unreasonable and dangerous and I would expect to face consequences. If you own a hunting dog who will kill other animals on sight, then obviously you need to avoid creating dangerous situations but if you do that, and say just use your dog for the mouse plague, well, that's like having a gun and just using it for hunting roos. For me it's just about the owner taking responsibility for the animals they choose to own and making sure they don't infringe on the right of others to enjoy life. If you're not hurting anyone, I have no problem with what you choose to own, and will never support any legislation that demanded otherwise.

This. Have very high penalties for anyone whose dog injures another pet/human - not just these breeds. My breed is meant to be aloof with strangers and naturally protective - he has displayed threatening behaviour towards weird people who have approached me at night and is no labrador - but he's what I want him to be - otherwise I would have bought a golden retriever... But I have no tolerance for people who own my breed and don't train it and make it a dangerous dog.

Oh that a was a beautiful video, and I liked it so much that I watched one of the others that came up afterward. The one with Joey the jungle cat made me cry, what happened to him

Haha this is a great thread, and a very enjoyable read. I love my dog beyond all ridiculousness, but there's no denying that he's a cunning little "insert assortment of expletitives". Some examples: he'll be playing with an ilicit item in the backyard and thinks we don't know. We call him, he stashes his item in his little hidey spot in the bushes and then comes running. He is playing with one of his toys like a good boy, when suddenly he sees something he would much rather be chewing (eg remote, a shoe etc). Moves his toy right next to desired but forbidden item, and then 'somehow' ends up chewing them both... My partner gives him an order he doesn't fancy - eg go outside because we're about to leave. Sad face on, runs to me and hides behind me - even though I always support my partner's orders (even if I disagree with them).

Ha I get the exact opposite - I have had lots of people tell me how much they hate their tails (I have a dobe with a tail), and how they hope people will eventually come to their senses and let them be docked again. You just can't please everyone... I saw a fantastic ridgeback the other day myself. He was a very impressive specimen with a good size head, because so many these days seem to be small and with out of proportion small heads. He was about the same age and size as my doberman, also entire because he was a show dog. They played so well together, I think because they had similar attitudes in terms energy and dominance, but they're nice, well socialised and balanced dogs. Made me feel very happy to see that some breeders are still breeding dogs that seemed capable of their original functions and winning prizes with them

;) Bed wetting is not a behaviour exhibited by entire dogs anyway... This is strange to me, because I had a dog who also hated going out in the cold and the rain (a dobe - so short coat), so he would not go outside to toilet in poor weather. But he never, ever peed in his bed. He would cry and whine if he couldn't get out of his bed, ie he really really didn't want to go in his bed. Typically he would go right next to the back door, which fortunately was on tiles (so easy to clean). Is she a normal dog in every other regard? Everyone on this forum will likely disagree with this approach, but he only stopped doing it when I started telling him off for puddles found indoors - I think prior to that he thought that going outside was better, but there was nothing really wrong with going inside, so he needed push and pull factors if you like. And I'm not talking about beating the dog and putting its nose in it, merely expressing your disappointment and associating that with the puddles - the dogs know what the puddles are and how they got there.

Maybe you yelling "No pee!" at him all the time and then tieing him up so he can see all the fun but can't participate? If he pees anyway after you say "No pee", then he doesn't understand the cue. Time outs are a wishy washy punishment at the best of times. I don't know how a dog is supposed to gather from a time out that peeing is not on. If your dog doesn't know how to stop a punishment he will get stressed. Any animal will. The general rule of thumb in behaviour is if a dead dog can do it then it's not a behaviour. Can a dead dog "no pee"? What is he supposed to do instead? I'm with Corvus.. "NO" means nothing to a dog. You'd be way better off to stop stressing about your dog peeing when out and about (its what dogs do) unless he's pulling on leash or doing it on people. Training will fix the first thing and a supervision and a good recall the second. Tell him what you want him to do and reward him.. it can't be any less effective than what you're doing now. Seriously, what's the issue with dogs peeing on a walk?? My dogs poo too. I pick up the poo and don't let them pee on folks lawns.. other than that, who cares? Have you got any idea how uncomfortable it is to walk when you need to go? I honnestly don't understand the issue either Just out of curiousity, how many times would your dog try to pee on a walk if you let them whenever they like? Because if my dog only wanted to do it once or twice, I wouldn't mind either. But when it's in the double digits for a walk just down to the shops, well, it just gets a bit silly. Even when the tank is empty, he still stops, sniffs and lifts his leg to try. He has off-lead activity every day. Perhaps if I couldn't offer this, I would have to accommodate more of his desires whilst on lead, but as it is, I think one toilet break on lead is sufficient near the start, and then no more until off-lead.

I'd call that a training issue. You solved it in one way but there are others. Well I think it kind of helped him to understand what the walk was meant to be about. We walked briskly, but even if I run he only has to trot so he still has plenty of time to sniff the flowers. Now that he knows that when he's on the lead with me, he doesn't sniff, he doesn't stop to check things out and he doesn't stop to pee, well I think he gets that it's our pack walk thing. He likes to walk very proudly now at my side, holds himself up as high as possible and focuses on me and what I focus on - ie he gets that the walk is not just about being outside, it's about walking together. Maybe it's easier with an entire dog, because given half a chance, he will mark, so it's easy to get him to pee on lead and I don't have to worry about creating a dog that will only pee off-lead.

Well we taught our dog that whilst on lead, he can pee, but only when asked to. His 'go toilet' command works whether he's on lead on not, only difference is that's the only way he can pee whilst on lead, whereas when off-lead, he can pee as he pleases. ETA: he's a large dog. Before we introduced the no pee without command on lead rule, he could literally jerk you to a stop so he could pee on something - it just wasn't practical.

Maybe you yelling "No pee!" at him all the time and then tieing him up so he can see all the fun but can't participate? If he pees anyway after you say "No pee", then he doesn't understand the cue. Time outs are a wishy washy punishment at the best of times. I don't know how a dog is supposed to gather from a time out that peeing is not on. If your dog doesn't know how to stop a punishment he will get stressed. Any animal will. The general rule of thumb in behaviour is if a dead dog can do it then it's not a behaviour. Can a dead dog "no pee"? What is he supposed to do instead? I'm with Corvus.. "NO" means nothing to a dog. You'd be way better off to stop stressing about your dog peeing when out and about (its what dogs do) unless he's pulling on leash or doing it on people. Training will fix the first thing and a supervision and a good recall the second. Tell him what you want him to do and reward him.. it can't be any less effective than what you're doing now. Seriously, what's the issue with dogs peeing on a walk?? My dogs poo too. I pick up the poo and don't let them pee on folks lawns.. other than that, who cares? Have you got any idea how uncomfortable it is to walk when you need to go? It's not about making him hold it in, it's about not letting him pee on every single obstacle. When off-lead, my dog will pee a little bit on almost every tree, bush, sign, fence - you name it he wants to pee on it. So when he's on lead, I take him to one tree early on in the walk, tell him to go toilet, and then until he's off-lead (and there's an off-lead component of every walk), I don't let him pee. He doesn't even try anymore, doesn't seem to be an issue. As for holding it in, he holds it in all day whilst I'm at work (even though he's outside, he's just weird), and all night from about 9:30pm till 8am. It's almost comical when he does go, because he will pee for minutes at a time - we call it peeing for Australia, unless he's on a walk, in which case he will pee for a couple of seconds every couple of seconds.

I couldn't do that to a dog ... forbid peeing off leash at a dog park and correcting/disciplining all the time NO peeing on leash unless given permission , and no peeing indoors etc . is a sensible rule ... .. when free running and in the presence of other dog scents /other dogs, though, It's a doggy thing to do ,IMO I do the same thing. I have an entire male dog who would love to be able to pee on everything, but that would be impractical for walks etc (because it would take forever to get anywhere). So we made a rule that there is no peeing whilst on a lead, unless given the command. He has actually peed on people too a couple of times when off-lead, and it is terribly embarrassing. But I don't think it's intentional. Every time (and it's only been like 3 times), he has chosen people in daggy sorts of clothes, who always say it doesn't matter and they were those clothes especially for the dog park. My thoughts are that the clothes smell very doggy (worn several times without being washed and always at the dog park), and my dog doesn't pick up on the scent of human strongly or quickly enough - sometimes he will be peeing and mid-stream it's like he suddenly realises it's a human, so he stops immediately and makes a run for it. He never does it to people that have interacted with him in some way - so again, made it clear that they're a human. Of course, this doesn't make it an acceptable behaviour by any stretch, but he hasn't done it in a while now that he's older and I figured it was just a matter of him learning to be a bit more aware of himself and making a bit more effort. I see plenty of dogs do it at the park, many who aren't desexed (and in fact my personal hate is for dogs that pee on your bags etc and there are a few repeat offenders - all desexed), so I'm not sure that desexing would fix the problem. I just started keeping my dog closer to me when he's off-lead - the closer you are, the more control you have and you can provide more input.

What a gorgeous dog, I would be very proud to own a dog like that

Owners of breeds that fail to acknowledge the heritage of their beloved breed, fail to acknowledge the percentage breakdown of personalities attracted to their breed of choice are more likely to make biased comments. Some people do themselves no favours with head in the sand attitudes of what their breed is capable of without correct training, and using their own insular experience with their own dogs to say that people are unjustified to be wary of breeds which they HAVE had exposure too, even if it is just at the dog park. need that like button again... :D This is all true, any breed in the perfect home can be the perfect dog, but that's not what this thread is about. I don't think anyone here has even tried to say that no matter what the conditions, a particular breed will always be bad. As for myself - one of the people prejudiced against staffies, my argument is merely that whether it's because staffies are a harder breed to raise correctly, or because they attract the wrong sorts of owners in the first place (or indeed a combination), a solid percentage of the staffies/bully cross types are dangerous to other dogs. As the owner of a large male doberman, I am not scared of most dogs, firstly because I know and have seen that my dog has no desire to fight and secondly because he's big and strong enough to mean that should for whatever reason he actually end up in a fight against another dog, there's a pretty good chance he'll win (or at least not be destroyed), unless, it's a staffy/bully type. Additionally, it has also been my experience that when dogs do get into a fight, knowledgeable humans can often intervene and reduce the damage done (as I saw with a blue heeler vs a lab fight). But when it's a staffy involved, they are too compact, too hard to grab and too tenacious to stop, and they have a very strong bite. And of course then there's the fact that my dog has been attacked seriously by a staffy/bully type 3 times now, when he hasn't had serious run ins with any other breed (and as I've said before, he spends a lot of time with new dogs at new dog parks - so plenty of opportunities). So that's why I'm prejudiced, that's why I don't let my dog play with other staffies unless I know them really really well and yeah, when I see one off-lead, I react quite differently to how I do with any other breed. If someone on this thread, the owner of Angel or any of the other staffies requested a play date, I wouldn't hesitate, because I am confident that in the right hands, these dogs can be beautiful (I have after all seen lovely staffies for myself). But if I don't know the dog, I am more scared if it happens to be a staffy/bully type. Just having a quick look on the DOL main page, there are 548 Stafford breeders registered here which I think tops the charts then along with the amount of Bully cross breeds BYB's etc there is a lot of Staffy type dogs around, many of random cross breedings and probably some registered breeders who don't know what they are producing either, so it doesn't surprise me in a breed that can have a predisposition to dog aggression that in the sheer numbers of them pure bred and cross that dog aggression is seen more often in Bully breeds than perhaps others. I know a couple of very nice Staffords from good experienced breeders that are wonderfully stable dogs and not the slightest bit DA, but especially in the cross breed BYB faction, I doubt these breedings have anything in mind in the progeny traits other than making puppies Yes and I am very happy to accept that there are lots of reasons beyond the dogs' themselves as to why they are involved in as many dog incidents as what they are, but of course that doesn't change the fact that I feel they are typically dogs I need to be quite wary around. The stress isn't worth it, so I just avoid them. To the people afraid of GSD's and rotties (and probably dobes too), I think your position is quite reasonable. I have met only a handful of dobes that I didn't think would be dangerous off-lead, I remember one the same age as mine who actually attacked his owner over a chicken bone on the street at 6 months old - the owner then hugged him whilst asking me how I got my dog to sit and wait so nicely whilst all this was going on :s and if 99% of the GSD's I saw didn't have such wobbly back legs, and I didn't own such a large dog, I would probably be scared of them too. I do often see them charging smaller dogs in the parks and causing a lot of shrieking and fear. That said, I have yet to see one involved in a real fight (but to be fair, whilst you always see a lot of young shepherds at the park, you very rarely see any adults, so maybe they become more aggressive and their owners just can't handle them anymore, so they don't take them out). I would never try and say though that dobes and GSD's and rotties don't need more careful and stringent rearing than say my sister's papillons. The problem is people who would struggle to own a papillon can just as easily go and buy a staffy...

Owners of breeds that fail to acknowledge the heritage of their beloved breed, fail to acknowledge the percentage breakdown of personalities attracted to their breed of choice are more likely to make biased comments. Some people do themselves no favours with head in the sand attitudes of what their breed is capable of without correct training, and using their own insular experience with their own dogs to say that people are unjustified to be wary of breeds which they HAVE had exposure too, even if it is just at the dog park. What did I say about Moronic statements made by people who have never owned these Breeds, you have just proved my point. ;) In a perfect world every Breed would be under control when out with the owner,but it's not a prefect world is it. so you think all breeds behave in the same way? all breeds are likely to react to a threat or another dog in the same way? Dogs bred for different purposes will react to situations differently. If you've owned different breeds then you will know that you have to manage some breeds quite differently. Exactly.

Owners of breeds that fail to acknowledge the heritage of their beloved breed, fail to acknowledge the percentage breakdown of personalities attracted to their breed of choice are more likely to make biased comments. Some people do themselves no favours with head in the sand attitudes of what their breed is capable of without correct training, and using their own insular experience with their own dogs to say that people are unjustified to be wary of breeds which they HAVE had exposure too, even if it is just at the dog park. need that like button again... :D This is all true, any breed in the perfect home can be the perfect dog, but that's not what this thread is about. I don't think anyone here has even tried to say that no matter what the conditions, a particular breed will always be bad. As for myself - one of the people prejudiced against staffies, my argument is merely that whether it's because staffies are a harder breed to raise correctly, or because they attract the wrong sorts of owners in the first place (or indeed a combination), a solid percentage of the staffies/bully cross types are dangerous to other dogs. As the owner of a large male doberman, I am not scared of most dogs, firstly because I know and have seen that my dog has no desire to fight and secondly because he's big and strong enough to mean that should for whatever reason he actually end up in a fight against another dog, there's a pretty good chance he'll win (or at least not be destroyed), unless, it's a staffy/bully type. Additionally, it has also been my experience that when dogs do get into a fight, knowledgeable humans can often intervene and reduce the damage done (as I saw with a blue heeler vs a lab fight). But when it's a staffy involved, they are too compact, too hard to grab and too tenacious to stop, and they have a very strong bite. And of course then there's the fact that my dog has been attacked seriously by a staffy/bully type 3 times now, when he hasn't had serious run ins with any other breed (and as I've said before, he spends a lot of time with new dogs at new dog parks - so plenty of opportunities). So that's why I'm prejudiced, that's why I don't let my dog play with other staffies unless I know them really really well and yeah, when I see one off-lead, I react quite differently to how I do with any other breed. If someone on this thread, the owner of Angel or any of the other staffies requested a play date, I wouldn't hesitate, because I am confident that in the right hands, these dogs can be beautiful (I have after all seen lovely staffies for myself). But if I don't know the dog, I am more scared if it happens to be a staffy/bully type.

In my neighbourhood there are a lot of dogs, almost every second house seems to have 1 or more dogs. There are some dogs that bark at everything that walks past their house, gotta love them. There is one dog that walks past twice a day every day that every dog hates - a pug cross with a bad attitude and ridiculous owners. This is the only dog that my dog will try and bark at, if we're not there to stop him. This is where the language part comes in - somehow, from how the other dogs bark, he can tell which dog it is and you'll see him, listening to each bark, and then running seemingly randomly to the window to look out - and every time without fail, it's the pug. So I guess he must be somehow able to understand from the other dogs which dog they're referring to. The rest of the time he ignores their barks. Is this because they name other dogs, or something else?

I have learned the hard way that I can't lie to my dog. He knows how I'm feeling - whether I mean something or not, whether I'm scared, sad, happy, sick etc and I can't seem to fool him. There are moments when we almost share some sort of telepathy. He just watches me very closely, and he can read me so well so that he knows what I'm about to do. It's cool because it makes me feel like we're a team, but it's also annoying because sometimes, if I'm feeling a bit down, I can't control him as well as usual - he behaves perfectly when I'm in a good mood and feeling confident.

I guess I'm the opposite. I had no fear of any breeds, didn't see any as any different from any others having watched Cesar Milan... Anyway, then I started visiting dog parks. I witnessed many dog fights - since I was there like every day, and more often than not a staffy was involved. Additionally though, when a staffy was involved, you just knew it was going to be bad - injury wise. What scared me was that I started to feel like most dogs perhaps have a scale, 1-10 of how worked up they are and hence how likely they are to fight, but with staffies, it was more like a 6-10. And yes other breeds make lots of noise, but I'm talking actual fights. They do happen with the other breeds but I have yet to see another dog need vet attention from a fight involving anything other than a staffy (and I visit many dog parks several times a week). My dog has been involved in 3 fights, all 3 were with staffy types, only 1 was provoked imo. The first, he just got charged and fortunately I could still pick him up at that stage because I don't think he would have been ok otherwise. He actually screamed when I went to put him down afterwards. 2nd time, he was chased by another one back to my legs, I wasn't quick enough and the staffy bit his face. The vet said it was lucky he was a dog with a long snout otherwise he would have lost his eye (because on dogs with long snouts, the eye can be pushed into the socket). He did not fight back on either of these occasions, just squealed and cried. 3rd occasion, I had left my bag and lead on the ground to go put a poo bag in the bin. It was my fault. The staffy tried to grab my bag for whatever reason, my dog growled at him, the staffy attacked. The staffy had no collar, and the owner had to literally lie on top of my dog to save him. When we finally got him away, my dog didn't need a lead, he didn't want to fight. The staffy was lunging, barking and carrying on because it wanted to attack my dog an had to be dragged away. I am scared of all staffy type dogs now (only when I have my dog, I can see that they have no issues with humans), and unless I know them very very well, I leave dog parks when a big one arrives. I think it's naive of people to say that staffy types are no more likely to want to fight than any other breed - that's like saying my dobe would have as good a hunting instinct as a hunting breed.

Thank you. Am now looking into the option of a white shepherd On another note: I understand now that they can be stacked like that. My concern is that I have seen GSD's in parks in both Sydney and Adelaide who have what I can only describe as a curvy back and their legs go outwards at the back, and almost wobble when they walk. They are slow and unco-ordinated. In fact, I almost never see shepherds without these features, and so I just assumed that every breeder who has photos of their dogs looking like this (and no photos of their dogs otherwise)had these dogs with the curvy backs - like that it was a common thing and a trait breeders were selectively breeding for. This has been an interesting and enlightening read.

Well I know that from now until forever, I will have a doberman. That is the breed for me. That said though, I only want one dobe at a time because they are so intense and bond so strongly, and so now that we have decided we want a second dog, we're looking at getting a GSD. We feel they're similar enough that we'll still get what we want in a dog and it should be compatiable with our dobe, since he loves playing with other working dogs. I also have a thing for Italian Greyhounds. One day I want one, but I just can't see how it would fit in with a doberman so for now that's on the backburner.

I saw a very interesting documentary a while back on the evolution of dogs. They made a very interesting point that although you can't take the wolf out of a wolf (ie it will never be a dog regardless of how you raise it), a wolf can accept and relate to a human on some level. The african hunting dog on the other hand never could - even if you raised it from birth, the african hunting dog always looked at the human as completely foreign and as something to be feared. So you can train a wolf to a degree, but you could not achieve the same results with the african hunting dog.

Well if nothing else, at least this thread has provided us with beautiful photos of Bear, he's truly gorgeous and he looks like a very special boy Thank you to everyone who has provided helpful advice - and a special thank you to everyone who has pm'd me. At the end of the day, it's a huge decision for us to bring another dog into our family, and we really want to be sure that we have the one best suited to us. These forums are so valuable because I've learned of breeders I doubt I would have been able to consider otherwise and hopefully one day we find the right pooch.

Bear is from Macklin, can highly recommend them Definitely going to contact. Do you have any photos of Bear that we can see :D

Thanks guys, very helpful. I had a look at Macklin Shepherds and they do look fantastic - and not even too far away :D