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Thanks Craig! I meant to reply to your message but I forgot because I was asleep when I got it I may need to get a lift with you yet, stupid car company in Bris mightn't have my Jeep ready Are you taking a tent? LOL - that's fine. A lift out to the ag is fine - just let me know. I'm heading out early that morning. I'll have the gazebo in the car so there'll be plenty of shade

Not so much a handling error but maybe a lucky save........my boy is not the happiest in the show ring so can be a bit difficult at times. We were lined up for a group once and he decided it was time to go and completely slipped his lead. As I saw the glint in his eye as he realised he'd just managed freedom (which is usually followed by tearing off into the sunset), I dove on him....so while everyone else has a nicely stacked dog in the line up, I'm sitting on the ground with my dog in a headlock as he's trying to squirm his way to freedom until I could get the lead back on him. The judge had a little smirk on his face along with a few of the others and one lady from the ring next to us later came and told me what a great save it was - apparently a "try-saving" tackle....LOL.

Hi Iggy, For whitening I use the Fido's White and Brite - haven't tried the PP though. For general I use a Fido's Herbal Shampoo - I find it very good.

Congratulations on BOB . Well done. Remember that Luuka is a baby still and it may take a little time for her to adjust to standing because she's been used to sit - but she's super smart and she'll get there, jusst keep persevering with it, my two were the opposite - because I was doing shows they always did stand but wouldn't sit - it took a while to happen. For now just take on board how complimentary the judge was because they don't usually say anything that they don't mean - so well done Can't wait to see you guys at the Bilo Ag

I don't agree with cross-breeding which is why I joined the relevant dog authorities, but I hope that this man does win and it sets a precedent that council's cannot make these blanket by-laws. My opinion only - these laws would only hurt registered ethical breeders who would probably need to pay for special permits and meet who knows what other requirements to do what they are doing while others breeding crosses, etc will just go further underground - the people who would normally comply anyway will be punished. I also am very concerned with the way that various levels of government are imposing more and more rules on everyone - we virtually have no rights on our property as it is - do we really want to lose more? That's my take on it - both sides of the discussion have merit and I understand the reasons but I don't believe it would deliver the outcomes desired.

Hi, It sounds like a pretty good diet to me....although I don't really use a lot of supplements - I do occasionally throw in some fish oil tablets (for coat) and occasionally half a multi vitamin. I'm really no expert but I do use the principles of BARF - when I use veges, I whizz them up and it probably works out to about 1/5 of the mix with the mince/meat, etc. Good luck with it all. There are some really good articles and some people in the forum who have had a lot of experience and know a whole lot about diet so there's a wealth of information available.

There really isn't any explanation anyone could give to justify this. Poor dog is all I can say - what chance does the poor thing have with an owner like that.........glad you had the foresight to be wary about the situation, well done.

From what I can see you've used it appropriately to control a situation that you had tried to control by other means, and you've had to use the choke chain as a last resort. I don't believe your use of it is cruel. My dogs can be difficult and stubborn at time - I generally use a choke chain on them but very very rarely have to check them. I think you're doing fine. I can understand the feeling bad bit - as I have felt like an awful bully the few times I've given mine a jerk.....however, you are using it (and it's the way I use it to) to correct behaviour that would otherwise have the dog in trouble (eg biting). I always make sure that if I have used the choke chain to correct a really bad behaviour, once it stops I give my kids plenty of praise so they know I still love them.

The longest mine will go without a bath is a fortnight, although i usually bath weekly. Haven't had a problem with my dogs' coats from doing it that way.

She sure does go mental when I get home She's pretty cute, she does those crazy jump-up-spin-around things It's every Friday night! You just let me know when you want to go again :D We could go this Friday if you want! Sweet as!!! I'm free tomorrow night - well after I've evicted a delinquint housemate at 5pm :D How about 6.30ish by the time I've fed the dogs and stuff. Yeah - see, you're better off than me - when I get home B is happy to see me - Cynna is usually laying down sleeping and I'm lucky if I get an ear flick.....LOL

Hi Fran, Hope you're good and not worrying too much about this. All dogs are different - some like to hang around and others are very independent - it's got nothing to do with how much they love you......I have no qualification to say this but I'd say if Luuka hadn't bonded with you already, you'd eventually be getting growls and other warnings. My dogs all have varying degrees of independence - B loves to be around me all the time and get into everything I'm doing, whereas Cynna couldn't care less and would rather go wandering around the yard on her own. When I used to have Simba - he'd have it all down to a fine art - looking at me lovingly with the tail wagging as I let him out of the gate and then headbut me in the knee or push me over as he ran past to go and try eat grass at the other end of the yard ignoring me completely. I guess I'm trying to say don't worry about it, Luuka does love you - it's probably just her individual personality, her comfort with the surroundings and her relationship with you. I think the fact she's excited to see you when you get home is enough evidence to support that. If she really didn't care she wouldn't even bother with that..... When's the next beer night at the Harley Club?

I totally agree Ellz. I tried supercoat on mine and it turned my boy into a fountain....yuk!!! It just didn't suit him - he's got a very fussy gut (shame about his mouth, I'm sure it likes everything but then the stomach has to make up it's mind) - but I don't necessarily think that supercoat is crap because of that one experience - my girl ate it without a problem. Since then I've fed a mainly raw diet but it certainly wouldn't qualify as BARF - I've just tried things and stuck to what's worked and I'm happy to be doing my own thing, as I read about different things people do I try them sometimes continuing and sometimes stopping. Just my choice - I don't side on any particular part of the argument. I would like to know of people's experiences with different dry food brands as I believe there's a place for it in the diet I feed mine as part of a meal to beef them up, and this thread has provided a few good ideas and options for me. Apologies up front to those who have got a bit emotional in this but the sniping was jolly entertaining too

Hi All, This is interesting to read. Can I ask if you guys have had any experience at how this brand goes with dogs that get an upset tummy easily. I feed my dogs mainly meat, bones, pasta, rice and a bit of veges, yoghurt, egg, etc - but would like a kibble that I can mix in with it to beef it out a bit. Problem is my boy seems to have a pretty bad stomach when it comes to processed or rich foods - he gets the runs bad......I tried supercoat before and it didn't go too well - haven't really tried any others but always interested in the threads about this. My girl is all good - I think she could eat lead bullets and be ok - LOL.

You're absolutely right Jed - dogs and everything else is being cut out of our lives and we're being made to live in a completely sterile world for the sake of appeasing a minority of whingers. Gone are the days where if you say, didn't like dogs being at the cafe, you just went to one where there were no dogs. Now we are all trained to be very demanding and stand up for our rights and make everyone else change just to satisfy our personal opinion - sad world. Evidently these rules simply had to come in to address the very real impact of serious injury, illness and possible fatalities that dogs being at cafes cause every year (I'd love to see the statistics - yes, I am being very sarcastic). Unfortunately, as many have alluded to it seems to be the dog owners who are an easy target for officialdom because it's far too difficult for them to tackle the real issues - what about people smoking outdoors at cafes (although I think this is or is on the way out), cars going past belching all kinds of harmful stuff, people talking on phones, people talking too loud, etc ,etc - where does it stop?? I would think a few dogs at the cafe would be the least of their worries...yet one of the first that they do something about. It seems that they will only be happy when we have a world where everyone sits in silence, in a vaccuum to please a very small minority of people who seem to take offence at everything....sorry, that got a little off topic. I also feel for the businesses here - they just have so many rules and now more to cope with - the lawmakers seem to be doing their level best to not only turn us into robots but prevent anyone from running a business that caters to people........ Gosh it annoys me..........LOL

What has that to do with the topic? It's about her pup being attacked, not vaccination. Why are you hassling the OP with emails? Thank you! Please, if you want to talk about vaccination, start another thread. I love my dog very very much. My boyfriend is still yelling at me for grabbing him when the dog was trying to attack him, because he thought I could be attacked, but I just didn't even give it any thought at the time. I don't consider myself ignorant of the risks, but there are more risks than things like parvo when you own a breed like a doberman, and the vet and breeder have told me it is more risky to keep him inside until after he is 4 months old, which would be when his vaccinations would be complete. My vet told me in his 30 years, he has heard of one case of parvo in the eastern suburbs and in that case, the dog had been in Blacktown the day before. He said the risk was extremely low to nil. On the other hand, he told me he might get Kennel Cough, but that the effects of that would not compare to the effects of keeping him isolated at this crucial period in his development. All about minimizing risk I guess, and I think you would have to agree that reasonable minds could reach different conclusions on the matter. But please don't mention it anymore in this particular thread, it is OT. I was nowhere near a road, I was nowhere near anything but a pond and grass. Like I've already said, my puppy was on my feet at the time, which is where he sits whether he's on the lead or not. I believe I have good recall with him, given that even when people offer him food at their picnics (because he is the cutest damn pup you've ever seen) he will not go further than about 2m away from me, and I have to approach other people first before he will. When he is scared, he tries to climb up me. I don't know, you guys may have a very valid point about how I should have him on the lead at all times, but, it's still not relevant to this particular incident, because the issue was not that he was too far away for me to help, it was that the dog that was aggressive was not controlled. You guys can spend all day trying to determine my agenda if you don't want to take me on face value. I do not post often on these forums because I have seen what can happen to people. The whole point of my post was to firstly vent off some of the lasting anxiety I had from the attack, but then also, on reflection, I felt like after all these years, I could potentially understand why some people actually wanted BSL, and why people will make the distinction between different breeds. I do think an owner would have trouble getting a large breed off another dog, but, I do think the dog itself would have better luck with a huge, slow newf over a pittbull. I was thinking about it more today, and thinking about all the dogs who have tried to attack my puppy so far. There were a few small things, which we all just ignored, there was the labrador yesterday at lunch which wouldn't stop barking at him but who knows how far it would have taken it, and then about a week ago, there were 2 large staffy type dogs. They were on a lead, but pulling out in front, lunging at my dog. I say large because I thought staffies were only meant to be about 20kg, and these ones were definitely larger than that. There are a couple of gsds in my area, all very well behaved. There is a rottie who is also well-behaved. I don't know. In my area at least, all the incompetent owners seem to own the small fluffy things, and the bully breeds. Looking out the window this morning, another large staffy looking thing, pulling out in front of its owner on the walk. The bully breeds and crosses are often considered small-medium sized dogs, and hence owned out of convenience by people who would not want a large dog. But they are not comparable to the other small breeds in terms of power. I am going to try and report the lady today, I remember some of the members of her pack, the male steel grey bully thing at the front, a border collie cross, a brindle large female something, a small tan and white maltese looking thing and a few other small-med sized things. You know it's interesting isn't it? All in the same pack, all with the same crap owner, but only one of them attacked my puppy, no questions asked, and that one just happened to be the bully breed. What a terrible situation - hope you are your dog are ok. I agree with your course of action to report the owner. I can't speak for everyone else on here but I think the suggestion that it is not wise to have your young boy off-lead out in public is not a question of his behaviour and the control you have over him but the risk of what else is out there that you have no control over - such as what happened here. It's not a matter of blame as in an ideal world you should be able to walk your dog off-lead in an off-lead area....unfortunately, there are a lot of people out there that own dogs who make this impossible because they don't have the control over theirs (yet they still take them out off lead - yikes!!!!). In my humble opinion, this lady should be reported as she was totally negligent allowing her dog to be off-lead when it had already been reported and she knew that it could behave in this way. It's the owner to blame here, not the breed of dog, and she should be held totally responsible - her pleading was a nice little guilt trip using her dog to try and avoid accountability for her stupid actions - BSL isn't going to solve the problem of stupid owners. We have legislation that people shouldn't speed in cars - has it reduced the instance of this happening though? Hope it all works out.

You're right that is hilarious ;) Hey, What's a cotton pickin yokel edit coz i put picking & it didn't have quite the same impact as pickin. From the point of view of someone who was involved in that thread (and didn't get a warning.....angelic halo is shining), it was actually really funny. Nobody was getting particularly nasty or offensive (IMO) but everyone was being pretty up-front about what they thought - it just involved someone coming into a thread off-topic and making a statement to cause a stir. Should everyone have just ignored it - yes. Did they - no. It was just too much fun to get involved..... If you want to know what a cotton pickin yokel is think the Beverly Hillbillies, banjos, and a piece of straw in ones mouth.......LOL

LOL - I wondered where that one had gone......and for the record - us "yokels" gave back just as good as we got I think it's very difficult to know exactly what people mean in a written forum - although sometimes people give us little gems that you can't misunderstand and I think if they are unduly obscene, defaming etc that's when we should report and at times when the rules have been broken. If it was me in that situation though I think I'd just say that the comment was uncalled for or against the rules and if it escalates from there then I'd report.

I have found that also giving a copy to the Council members helps. You might get lucky and have a Dog lover on the Council. Also Addressing it to the CEO may help.. Just trying to give you all the insider information Poor dog! Do your council have anything on their website about animal management? If they have spiel about dogs/animals being kept in clean conditions, not barking, etc I'd put it to them that since they've advertised that this is what they manage then they need to manage it. I'd also make sure you mention about your concern for the welfare of the animal and if they aren't able to do something about it you'll have to go to the media/your councillor or state or federal rep to get something done. Also put it in writing in an email or something and give them a deadline - eg, if I don't hear back from you within a few days, I'm going to have to escalate. If they think you're going to escalate and they'll look bad for not acting, they'll often be a little more responsive - even though it's a shame you have to basically threaten it to get some assistance. Keep trying the RSPCA too. I know it's tiring to try and do the right thing and they never make it easy for anyone but your concern for this poor dog and efforts so far are definately praiseworthy - at least someone is looking out for it because it's owners aren't - thank you

Sorry to hear about your dilemma - the only thing you could do apart from what has already been suggested is appeal to the council over the amount of the fine - although it's a major longshot........... If it was me and I had to pay it, from that point on I'd be making sure that I was fully aware of everything the council is supposed to be doing and pull them up every single time they don't - that's just me though with those kind of officialdoms.......LOL

Hi All, Just a really quick question because I know this topic's been done before. Does anyone know a kennel/run distributor in Qld - the hutch ones in WA look awesome but freight would be a killer There was a website for Kennel Panelz but this seems to have disappeared......? Thanks :D

I'm sorry i'm getting all emotional and ridiculous. Its hard to step back when you're scared. I am being naive - I am naive! I've never had to deal with this before which Is why i'm asking advice from all of you. I bought my job into it as from a legal point of view my advice to others, and the advice of my boss just now when he saw me shaking and upset after reading this thread, is that yes, obviously you admit to nothing, and dont say more than you need to, but do give full disclosure, eg, explain that it is dangerous to enter a yard with strange dogs and to warn of that. I don't care if the neighbour gets torn to shreds, I just want me and my dogs to be safe at night. But you are right - I will make it very short and sharp and ask him to respect my dogs and my property and stay away or my hand will be forced to press charges. Not flaming you. I get where you're coming from - it's no reflection on your profession or anything else........ Whenever I write anything, I write loads and then keep cutting it back so it ends being a short, sharp communication that deals with the issue at hand. My first draft is always a rabbling mess way worse than anything you'd ever be able to produce - lol. But seriously, the advice people are providing is good - just address the issue that they're entering your property without permission, you've previously asked them not to and you would like them to respect your wishes. If it was me, so you can take it or leave it, I wouldn't talk legal ramifications yet - you've already laid the foundation by an official request not to enter the property. In discussions with them, I wouldn't say anything about your dog being protective or anything like that (I mean in general discussion, not just in a letter) for the reasons everyone has stated. You just can't guarantee people won't misuse this against you and you don't need that issue to occur. All the best with it and hope it gets sorted out without affecting your relationship with your neighbours (I applaude your desire to maintain the peace, but seriously they're not really respecting you much at the moment).

I totally agree with Ellz. The issue here is that you've asked them not to enter the property and they've ignored it, so that's all that needs to be said. I'd send them a short, brief letter just stating that as you have previously asked, would they please not enter your property unless they have contacted you and been given permission - it's not rude.... If you also want to put a sign up, make it something like "No Entry unless authorised by owner". Definately no reference to your dog.

I agree - I rarely offer a comment one way or the other - if it was a friend then of course I'd congratulate them and be happy for their win. I really don't understand the reasons for a lot of the negative comments that happen. As I see it people come to shows for the judge's critique/decision which they get - they don't need another one from anyone else unless it has been specifically asked for. All the negative comments that occur I think is just bad sportsmanship and making trouble but it's part of what happens so I think it's equally important to be able to deal with it and see it simply as someone not being able to handle their disappointment.

Thanks for this reply - really helpful. I believe it is fear and seems to be in relation to people - he behaves the same way if I bring a person he doesn't know into my yard to meet him. He doesn't completely run away - but he looks like he's in two minds - he comes forward and is curious but then pulls away. When he knows someone (usually takes about 2 or 3 visits - he's a totally different dog - happy, playful, affectionate). The short answer is that I would really like to show him because he's a wonderful dog but I don't want to if it's going to stress him out, I also want him to be comfortable when meeting strangers and that's probably the more important one for me. Some of the feedback I've received from friends who show is that keeping him going will be best so that he gets used to it - I understand the logic but I guess I'd like to get him reassured and comfortable with people outside of the show ring and put him back in when he's happier about it - I don't know if that's the right way - that's my logic only. My main concern is that he is getting worse with it - we showed all last year and he'd let the judges go over him and check his mouth and all without a problem - now he doesn't want a barr of it. Parents and siblings are good to my knowledge - my other two have been brought up in the same environment and are fine. He is a BT - and I'm not ignoring your remark about the handler - I'm an absolute novice so I'm sure I've unwittingly played some part in this. Thanks for the suggestion about the forum - I've got her book which I found great so the forum will be good too. I guess just so you understand where I'm coming from - I'd like to show him, but he is first and foremost a pet so if that doesn't eventuate, it definately won't be the end of the world. This didn't turn out to be a short answer at all sorry but I really do appreciate your advice. It makes me feel better to hear different opinions and questions that I need to ask and answer myself, that I hadn't necessarily thought of.

But where do we go from here ... Is there any good websites that can explain it in a step by step process for stupid people like me .... Hi Tilly, I found this book really helpful - it's about positive training using a clicker. It's also very easy to read and is in very plain everyday language (which made it perfect for me.....). http://www.amazon.com/When-Pigs-Fly-Traini...e/dp/1929242441 I hope the link works for you - my apologies if I've messed it up, but even if you copy and paste in your browser it should work. All the best.