conztruct

Danielle, you have done a wonderful thing with the effort that you have put in here and don't let anyone tell you any different. Also your bravery for posting on DOL about is also commendable. Look - online is difficult, things aren't always expressed as well as they could be but I think the vast majority of posters are simply concerned about the situation and making statements and suggestions based on their experiences and opinions - please don't take it that they're attacking you - I think they're just looking at the situation and assessing it based on how they'd handle it which is different for everyone - I don't think anyone could reasonably be negative about what you've done for this puppy - there's very little more you could do. You've told us everything as your friend stated it so if they're telling porkies what can you do about it? If the pup really is aggressive, I think it's very bad that it's been readvertised but you've done what you can in telling her.

Some really good advice here that works. I've done a few of these things to address a problem with my boy. He's a bit timid around people - we've been showing for quite a while and he has some good and bad days with it but the tips especially with the food rewards and training can help build a relationship with you and your dogs. Also, I used to get my friends (who my dog didn't know) to do it as well when they came over - it's a slow process especially when the dog is older but it does work. He's probably at a manageable stage I'd say at the moment but we keep perservering and the little improvements happen all the time. My dog was never fearful of me though - it's a bit frustrating really when he's timid out and about but in the backyard or with people he knows he's probably more on the boisterous side.....LOL. It's not meant to be easy but can be overcome with a bit of work. I'd be concerned and seek a behaviourists assistance if there are any signs of aggression - fortunately for me this wasn't a problem.

There's nothing that fixes the attitude of rude bike riders like a stick in the wheel......only kidding - lol. Just remember that you were doing the right thing, you know it and that's all that matters. In my neighbourhood - I can't even walk my dogs more than 50m without encountering an off-leash dog wandering the streets - fortunately, I know most of them now. I've politely told the owners as I've walked by that their dogs should probably be contained so that they're safe from getting hit by cars, etc but it's pretty much fallen on deaf ears. I came across a wandering dog on the busy street near my place one day obviously not used to being out because he seemed a bit distressed and frightened - fortunately we weren't far from home, he was happy to follow me away from the commotion when I called him and my dog behaved. I put a lead on him and found his owners looking for him and they were very grateful - so sometimes doing the right thing does pay off Well done for your concern.

QUESTIONS 1. What is my relationship with the breed? (ie breeder, first time owner etc) I have had my bullies for a few years now but was a first time dog owner when I got them - although I had exposure to the breed through knowing people who bred and showed them. I am registered for breeding but it's not on the radar at the moment. 2. Where and why was the breed first developed? Not absolutely sure but in England and bred to pursue small prey - eg rats, etc and of course fighting - mostly a thing of the past now which is good. 3. How common is it in Australia? There are more bullies around than it initially seems there is. The number shown isn't a very good indication - their stubborn attitude can be an impediment to people showing them. 4. What is the average lifespan? 10-14 years. 5. What is the general temperament/personality? Bull terriers love people and are very doting however, they can be quite intolerant of other dogs and pets - they become very jealous as they love attention from people. While some people do have bullies who run with their other pets, this generally only occurs when they are very well trained or known to have a history of socialising with other animals. Caution should be taken when interacting with other animals as they are powerful and although they rarely start an incident they often finish it - they are reactive rather than being outwardly aggressive. 6. How much daily exercise is needed for the average adult? Daily walks are good - it keeps them in shape and helps to tire them out so they don't become bored and destructive. Roadwork helps to build strength in the feet and general muscles. Bull Terriers also love games and toys but destroy these quite easily - an old go-kart tyre is a very good playtoy for bullies and very resilient. Short, sharp regular training sessions stimulate a bully's mind and they respond well to this - they are quite clever but rarely give you something for nothing. 7. Is it a breed that a first time dog owner could easily cope with? Unless a first time dog owner has researched and had some interaction with the breed, they can be very frustrating (but they are also very rewarding to own). Unless they are able to provide a secure and stimulating environment for their dog, the results can be disastrous. Recommended as a great companion but for the right person - from my own experience, exposure to bullies owned by an experienced breeder and exhibitor was a great way for me to learn about the breed and responsiblities. 8. Can solo dogs of this breed easily occupy themselves for long periods? Yes, bullies love to sleep (be careful about letting them lay out in the sun all day for sunburn though). They are quite happy to curl up when nothing for them to get into is happening however, any activity or people in the vicinity will get their attention. They will sit quietly with (or on - lol) their owners being quite happy to just be near them. Left alone for long periods without any exercise or stimulation, bullies will become destructive......they can be destructive chewers even with exercise and stimulation so it's important to dog proof living areas so that things you don't want chewed aren't left around for temptation. Never assume that something will be ok........ 9. How much grooming is required? Regular brushing to remove dead hair and dirt/dust is recommended. Bathing more often if showing but a wipe over with a damp cloth is good also to clean and freshen - a blast with a hair dryer can help remove dead hair. There are many shampoos on the market however, I always look for soap free ones and bully's can have sensitive skin - I also give mine a rinse in some water with very heavily diluted antiseptic, eucalyptus, tea tree and lavendar oils......just a personal thing, it keeps them smelling clean and fresh. Ears should be checked and cleaned regularly (seek advice for dirt deep in the canal or smell), eyes should be checked and cleaned regularly as well as feet. Long periods on cement can result in callouses so something to be careful of - balm, vaseline etc can help treat. Nails should be kept trimmed and not allowed to grow too long. Bullies frequently have scrapes and cuts due to their boisterous nature so I've found having some antiseptic cream like savlon can be good also. Bathing and grooming often result in your bully looking at you like you like you're the meanest person in the world and long periods of sulking however, treating while doing this can ease the "pain" for them and also make them more amenable to hygiene. 10. Is it too boisterous for very small children or for infirm people (unless the dog is well trained)? Mostly Yes - well-trained bullies are fine with children or infirm people although would never recommend a bully with a very small child without supervision. Bullies don't often realise their strength when playing so can innocently cause harm even to strong adults without intending to. I always err on the side of caution and make sure the dog is contained or under control if small children are around. 11. Are there any common hereditary problems a puppy buyer should be aware of? Yes - there are hereditary diseases for which tests should be conducted especially if breeding is being considered. Details of these can be found on many breeders websites and also the bull terrier association sites for each state or the national one. 12. When buying a puppy, what are the things you should ask of the breeder? (eg what health tests have been done (if applicable) and what is an acceptable result to those tests so the buyer has an idea of what the result should be) A few things I can think of are: Hereditary disease testing results for the parents and for the pup - usually certificates and results are available - again, the websites with information about health testing will outline what a desirable result is Support that's available after sale What happens if I can't manage (while the breeder will screen and ask questions to manage this, it's always good to have a backup plan) Diet tips for puppy - a total change in diet isn't good - your breeder can advise Breeders usually provide a puppy pack containing a lot of information that is useful so check it out and if you haven't got one ask about it Any questions that you feel are necessary to make you totally comfortable with the purchase - ie if something doesn't feel right keep asking until it does - breeders are used to being asked all sorts of questions and good ones will answer them for you I'm a newbie really so these answers are just based on my experiences and some of the more experienced breeders will be able to provide more comprehensive information. My number 1 tips for owning a bully is to start and maintain a relationship with the breeder who will be invaluable to you (I have a great one), try and find some other bully owners in your area, socialise your bully from as young as possible so it is used to people and learns how to interact while young and it can be easily corrected, and get involved in obedience either just yourself or with a club - clubs are better for the socialisation aspect. Also, even though you may have great control over your bully and have done everything you can, always be vigilant because you can't control the actions of others which can sometimes put you into difficult situations as the owner of a powerful dog.

It's labouring the point but for the record, in case you haven't seen the earlier "In the News" thread, Moselle described Michael Linke as "full of shit" and "a contradiction in terms". She also said he suffers from "foot in mouth disease" and that he was "shallow" among a a number of other unflattering adjectives. Mr Linke is well-respected in the Canberra community. Very few respondents have been as insulting as Moselle has. Oh sorry - as I said, I didn't agree with Moselle's comments but I forgot that just because she was insulting to Mr Linke then everyone else should sink to the same level. I guess if she jumps off a cliff then that means everyone else should too.......... I guess my point is people can make a point without turning it into a slanging match. Sorry - off topic - I'll stay out of things now

Each to their own I guess. I don't agree with Moselle at all but she's entitled to her opinion. It's not the fact that people disagreed - it's the way they did it that I don't believe was very fair to Moselle - it's little wonder she ended up getting upset about it and from the comments posted it seems that's just what posters were trying to achieve rather than debating the point.

I'm not copying that great big list but I can add: Candy Cynna Gloria

Gosh - how did I miss all this excitement. I think that this statement doesn't do anything to cast a dim view on any breed at all. Sure, if you focus on one sentence without the context around it - you could make an assumption that maybe he is but making a that assumption when the context is available to refute it is probably something that only the media would be up to, to try and sensationalise something that isn't really that sensational. Sorry Moselle - don't share the same opinion as you on this. You probably didn't quite deserve the battering you copped though.......

All the time - I hope my neighbours don't listen to me - a couple of the things I'd get caught out on would be: When bathing the dogs "well, if you stood still we'd be done a lot quicker" When putting disinfectant on a cut "if you will try and wriggle under the fence then you will get a cut and it will hurt" Barking "if you don't shut up you'll be a tri-colour bathmat!" "Well since you knocked your water bowl over, you'll just have to put up with a wet blanket....." There's plenty of others....I talk to my dog like they're naughty kids and I can reason with them with grumpy parent sarcasm. It's so much like my mum used to be with us that it's scary..........

Agree with the other posters about destruction of bedding. I proudly and stupidly got all my dogs new soft beds and pillows when I first got them and the longest one lasted was 2 hours into the night - needless to say - the whole place looked like a blizzard had gone through it. Now - my guys all have carpet to sleep on which takes them a lot longer to wreck (I just have a big stack and can replace when a piece gets too tatty). Do I feel mean and cruel and would I prefer to give them a lovely doona and pillows - absolutely, but realistically - even that towel folded in half would end up looking like it's been through a blender if I gave it to my guys. You try and be nice to them and look what they do........

You should be dumbstruck and offended by that - absolutely untrue - showing has nothing to do with whether you're a good breeder or not - absolutely nothing! There are plenty of great breeders who show and do great and there are just as many, maybe more who don't. A lot of times you'll find there's a partnership between a breeder who doesn't show with a person who loves showing and exhibits their dogs for them. For me, if a breeder knows their breed, tests them for hereditary conditions and looks after their dogs and abides by the code of ethics then they're a good and reputable breeder. I love showing but it's certainly a personal choice that doesn't have any bearing on your credentials as a breeder - it is a way of getting your breeding recognised and known though which is why a lot of people do it. This might be controversial but sometimes I think that someone who specialises in a particular breed will know a lot more about it and what is quality in that breed than a poor judge who has to try and remember all the standards for many breeds and stands in the sun, rain or whatever all day and decides whether they are of good quality. No offence to the judges but I'd be going with the specialists opinion if I was looking for a pup or a dog.

I feel for you. When I got my first boy he lasted one night with free run of under the house and from then on was in a crate when inside at night. Why? Well I got up that morning to find the washing machine dragged halfway across the floor and the cord chewed off, a hose chewed up, boxes destroyed, washing powder everywhere and his bed torn to shreds. I also built runs in the backyard using star pickets and old weldmesh panels wired together where he was able to chill out when I couldn't supervise him. I quit while I was ahead and admitted defeat then - he never changed - any time he had free run and I turned my back for a minute something would be destroyed - trees chewed up, dug out, washing off the line, sprinkler munched - even when I thought I'd left nothing for him to wreck....... I blamed myself, I knew what he was like and if I left him with something I was stupid to think that anything else but total destruction would result. Sometimes you just have to admit defeat with them - don't get me wrong - I loved him like nothing else and he was the sweetest boy but however little or much I did with him and for him, he was like a cyclone going through.

Omg was that at Duthie Park? That's disgraceful I would have slapped her if she'd said that to me with Atlas, but your response was way classier! Yeah - she was just an idiot. I wasn't going to sink to her level and say anything awful about her dog and I didn't want to be too cruel - nature already beat me to it.......LOL.

Yeah - I've had the comments from pedigree and x owners alike that my dogs are ugly and stupid - whatever. I don't judge people's choices to have the dog they want - it's their choice and they reap the benefits or the consequences for it. If I talk to someone who's looking at buying a dog I try and dissuade them from going for a x breed but if they end up choosing one I'm not going to snob them over it. The only time I've ever been majorly snobbed was at dog obedience where a lady right beside me said "ugh what an ugly, stupid looking dog!!!" I smiled sweetly and said "is there a mirror here?". I don't think she got it at the time but I hope the penny dropped later on :p

Sorry about poor Max - hope he gets better soon I totally agree with Poodlefan - don't waste your time asking the club for the contact details of the owner, send the bills to them - it happened on their grounds, in their classes and occurred because they haven't taken appropriate steps to remove or control a dog that has previously shown aggression - it's a straight up case of negligence. I know the owner has offered to pay up but where's the club's responsiblity here - are they going to allow this dog back to maybe do the same thing again? Take them to court and add a bit on for your emotional pain and suffering

I'm of the opinion if the group judge thinks your dog is good enough to award and send through to GS and the breeder is doing GS, it's fine. I'm inclined to agree - the dog has got to GS on merit under a different judge so I can't see a problem.

It is a very sad story - do you think that maybe the owner of the pup being returned has maybe been a bit affected by the first pup and at the first sign of something going not quite right with the second they have panicked? I know some people are really keen on the showring and doing well but I would hope that pups are pets first who may also happen to be shown and not a like a racecar that gets traded in for a better model when it's not winning. I know that's not always the case. I hope this owner doesn't see the pup in a few years and regret the decision. I think that this move is maybe a little rash and a reaction to the gaggle of negative criticism. All dogs have their good and bad points and I think it's awful that a bunch of people came and picked on one that is still developing when they have no idea how it will turn out - I think there's some bad blood with that breeder, if the pup is really that "ugly" at the moment, I would think that a gaggle would maybe just suggest to postpone showing until the puppy has developed a little more if anything, I'm sure they're having a wonderful time now laughing about how they scared a poor newbie off and got their enemy (the breeder). I have a bitch who looked like a whippet with a great big bull terrier head when I first started showing her (seriously, this is true) - now at 2, she's starting to grow into her body and while she has some faults that will prevent her from ever winning anything much, she loves the showring and I'd never deprive her of it. All the kids and some of the adults on the sideline think she's just lovely as do I, and that's good enough for me :rolleyes:

In the show results I've seen where a judge has put a bitch up for challenge which was their breeding. PLEASE NOTE: I was not at the show, so I'm in no way making any assumptions about what happened or questioning the decision and having shown under this same judge I'm absolutely confident they would have judged all the dogs objectively. It just made me think about how when the poor judge saw it coming they'd really have to be thinking "just look at the dog as though it could be anyone's" LOL. I don't even have a problem with it from the exhibitors point of view - after all the judge should just be looking at what's there objectively. I just feel sorry for them in this position because of all the gossip and stuff that goes on. Even if they have made the right decision you've always got your hardcore people who must win at all costs looking for a reason why they didn't - and really I guess that's the issue moreso than the judge or the exhibitor.

Send the dog in with some body else and stay out of the road altogether. I guess that's the decision that the person entering makes and everyone has different opinions about it. I don't particularly have a problem with it although I do feel for the poor judge - if they put the dog up then inevitably some will consider they did so just because it's their breeding and if they don't then inevitably some will consider they are saying their breeding isn't any good - a very difficult position to be in..............

PS Rysup and Pappylove - what beautiful dogs you have :D

Thanks for the info guys. I thought it would be something along those lines ie the judge can't own them. But I'd have to say I agree with you that it would really put the judge (breeder) in a very difficult position. I guess that's a moral question for people and since that isn't very clear-cut, I guess it's up to each individual to make their own decision. Thanks again.

Hi - pretty self-explanatory really. Should judges judge a dog they have bred? Just so everyone knows I'm not pointing a finger anywhere it just got me curious. I kinda wondered whether it was allowed? I mean, a judge has no control over what is entered under them, so is it something the exhibitor should or should not do? Are there any rules around it? Thanks guys.

I just thought I'd say "Congratulations Fran and Luuka". I watched you pick up best of breed at the show and do a damn fine job of it too, so well done I'm sorry about drinks last night - I got home, fed the dogs and then sat down in the chair for five minutes which actually ended up being 9.30pm when I woke up. OMG, I can't believe I've turned into an old man ;)

I'd be forgetting about it unless you have irrefutable proof rather than a suspicion - even if you do have this proof, I'd probably leave it. Sometimes standing up for the rules and the right thing can cause you more harm than good. As some of the other posters have said, the judges should be picking up on any signs of this and it's their job. I once heard a judge say to an exhibitor that they had to judge what was presented in front of them then and there and this is true - even if you said to them that you believe the other exhibitor was cheating they have no "before" picture to refer to in order to see what has been altered. Leave it and just concentrate on your own dogs that you're showing as they are and be proud that you don't need to and aren't sad enough to go to these lengths. Some people will do anything to win yes, and it's a shame that this kind of thing happens but I think you need to consider whether it's a battle you want to fight because it will be and may well end up being a war.

I think all the club's are very thankful that they're receiving entries but let's not kid ourselves that everyone is busy and make mistakes with their entries that make the secretaries life hell. These volunteers usually bend over backwards to get everything right and ensure people are entered in the show - they are busy enough organising a show and it's little wonder that they get a bit miffed after having to chase up people as well. I don't think there's any simple answer to the problem as most clubs are small and can't do bpay or credit card payments and EFT would be a nightmare because I'm sure people wouldn't put their reference numbers in correctly all the time and it would be good if there was a better solution than sending paper entries and cheques (mainly because I can't find my chequebook) but until then we should all try to do our best to get it right.