ChristineX

or even a smooth collie - same dog (more or less) except a difference in length of hair. Finnish Spitz?

I like all creatures great and small - but if I have a non-standard issue to discuss, I try to get Steve (also Toby, but he has moved on,drat it.) as he and toby were the best at tracking down causes of weird symptoms. They take good notes too, and I do know that all cases get discussed daily. Not, however, the cheapest vet around.

A good behaviouralist is good both with dogs (all types) and with people. They can see and recognise (subtle) behaviours, and help owners to devise ways to improve - not training issues, but 'brain' issues. I tend to refer to it as 're-wiring' the brain. No where as simple as training! For example, last year the behaviouralist (hereafter called Dog Shrink, easier to type), was telling a class mate to watch for that little left ear twitch - that was the only signal this particular dog gave that she was feeling uncertain and was about to lunge. I was watching, and still couldn't see it :) - but that sort of ability is what makes a good dog shrink. So does experience with a lot of different types of dogs. The easiest way to find a good dog shrink is to ask on here - like any industry there are a lot of very shonky people who are happy to take your cash - and with dogs, often the bad ones can cause a lot more damage. Did that help?

Hi Snook, yup, the reactive rover type classes seem a lot easier for our reactive guys to handle. Duke got to go to obediance training and the reactive classes this week - apart from the adolescent dog that triggered off his more dominent features (I didn't think the owner really wanted his dog alpha rolled with a tooth hole in his head... moved Duke away) he went thru an entire pack of bacon in half an hour! All of it displacement focussing on food rather than the scary dogs! Poor boy, reactive rovers this afternoon had four little dogs in it- two of them pretty vocal about how they felt. It was such hard work he fell asleep in the car on the way home - he never does that! You know, I hadn't thought that the people's voices might be part of the difference - where I am, in normal classes despite how often you ask for space, you just don't get it. At reactive rovers, it is really rare that you have to ask for it as everyone is watching the nearer dogs as well as their own for signs of dyscopia. Makes things so much easier. Duke spent a lot of the afternoon being aggressively interested in every blade of grass and leaf - well, its better than the alternative. Although that would have left the new lady with the staffy in no doubt that her dog was NOT the noisiest Kathy has ever had in the class! On a positive note, Kathy brought her siberian along (her racing sibe). He loves Duke - although trying to mount Duke was probably not the smartest thing he's ever done to Duke! I'm still pretty stoked that Duke's "Don't Do That!" reaction was actually entirely appropriate - he is learning canine communication! Snook - welcome to the Socially Awkward Dogs Training Club! :D

Duke and I have been back to Reactive Rover classes for this year, and I am pleased to say that so far, he's doing pretty good. Only whining when the numbers of dogs starts to get more than two (initially it was siren intensity screaming you could hear with perfect clarity 6 football fields away), okay he thru a wobbley when one of the new staffies had a turn (ie screaming and leaping at the end of the leash), but settled very quickly when walked away a bit. Walked nicely with the little fluffybum (usually he thinks they are monsters) - lots of quick looks, but that was all. Also exchanging looks with Hazel - but kept eye contact a little too long and she lost the plot whereupon he lost the plot - but he recovered in about 3 seconds (which is down massively from 45 minutes when we started all of this - we timed him). All in all, a really good start to the year. This year's 'scary thing' has yet to eventuate - but I am sure it will. Last year it was dark brindle staffies after one ran past him at night.... he is genetically reactive but I do love how he has improved over the years!

Hi Bossyboo, couple of quick questions: 1. do you have a crate for Dusty? 2. what sort of training has/is Dusty getting I have two of the larger terriers, and they are crated at food time, or I stand next to my older dog (who eats slower. They also know the 'leave it' command. But I do constantly work at NLIF, and basic training - terriers can and will push boundaries just to see if you will let them. :)

because if you just need a really good dog shrink, we can point you in the right direction. If you are after a specific approach, we'd need a bit more info! :)

Hi Mrstompy - its not that your great dane isn't interested in treats, its that the world outside your home is, at the moment, too distracting. which is why a good training club or school has major benefits. If you can, add distractions slowly (start outside your front door, when he calms enough to be listening take another step or two for example), up the value of the treats (ie something he would normally die for) and keep going with your training - you have a young dog and you will get there if you are consistant and persistant. And reward heavily for any notice he takes of you (ie, reward for focussing on you.)

Ditto on Mark Singer!

M-Sass - exactly! I've been very lucky, when my dog club realised that Duke was outside of their coping abilities, they referred me on to Kathy - and still gave me massive support! But,every single person in the club at one time or other has also said,that Duke is not a dog they would take on or keep. Okay, I'm a bit of a masochist, but like a lot of reactive dogs, he's worth the effort, and he has increased my dog handling skills immensely. Its also why I am happy to donate my time and energy when we get another similar dog thru - those classes are always followed up with a discussion amongst all the trainers (and me) as to whether the owner and dog fit into our general classes, or need to be referred on. We have about 3 different people we refer to, depending on the problem. I've also turned into a bit of a cheerleader for people with reactive dogs - that they can achieve a much better behaved dog, even though it's going to take time. A lot of reactive dog owners feel very alone and demoralised - we all need good support!

Duke is 'self-serving'himself apples from mum's apple tree currently. Rubyblue -what about lillypilly berries? Duke is obsessed with eating those!

Hi Hankdog, love the BillDog Every obediance club will be different - but it can be doable. Duke and I still attend obd classes as well as reactive rover classes. Okay, the first two years (lots of fear was part of Duke's problems) we spent 30 metres away from everyone else, I would basically copy whatever class I attached myself to (not beginners - they just don't have enough control to keep a reactive dog calm) so if they were working on sit/stay, so was I. At 2.5 years, we managed to join a class! There are still days when we spend time at a distance, but its more like 5-10 metres, and its usually if something has upset Duke. The trainers are happy for me to choose what I do. Over the past year, though, I now spend the first couple of weeks 'helping out' with the beginners - if someone is having lots of trouble or a reactive dog rather than the trainer spending their time helping, I'll do that to get them off to a good start. Oh yeah, Duke stays in the car until everyone is in their class - not having milling dogs around helps a lot! :) Luck and fun with the BillDog!

Hankdog - that sounds awful! Here's hoping for a speedy healing. I make jewellery for fun, and Duke in particular likes to 'move' them around the place. fortunatly, no misadventures (yet). Nekhbet, that's a very kind offer! Hankdog, I have no idea of the distances involved, (did I mention, geographically challanged?) but that has got you two really good options with two really good people. :)

Hi again Hankdog - keeping in mind that I have no idea about geography (and get routinely lost),K9pro (Steve Courtney) is at least in your state (kurrajong??)- he'd be a good place to start. I also believe that he keeps a list of good behaviouralists australia wide which makes him an even better place to start. A lot of these guys run reactive dog classes - which is where all the dogs are reactive which means all the owners are working on keeping their dogs calm - and it gives you a great place to practice in the company of people who understand what you are going through. Duke (my reactive dog) loves them - he'll even stop having hysteria about small fluffy dogs in the class - after 10 or 15 minutes. Which is a vast improvement on 45 minutes of total mindless canine hysteria that we used to have just because he spotted the tip of a dogs tail a mile or two in the distance . Good luck, let us know how you go!

Hi Hankdog - the problem is, that reactive dogs need good behaviouralists. If you get a good one, you start seeing the difference very very quickly. Let the people here know roughly where you are - we'll point you in the direction of someone who's worth seeing! :)

Watching Duke hunt mice inside - if he'd been in a barn with farm working equipment, there would have been blood all over the place. That tail could double as a lethal weapon! Also, there are times you have to yank them out of holes they won't come out of - docking meant you grabbed the thick part of the tail rather than the thin part which could be damaged by such an action. (Oh yes, talking about Irish Terriers)

Off my two irish terriers, Kate is docked and Duke is not. Interestingly, it is Duke who is having problems with displaced vertebrae in his tail - above the point at which his would have historically been docked. No idea if there is a relationship, mind, but it is interesting all the same. And admittedly, he is also having the same problems a little higher in the back (sacral vertebrae) as well. Docked tail status has never been an important point to me, it is the dog itself that has my attention.

Hi Ezza, welcome to DOL. I know where you are coming from, my Irish Terrie Duke had a background similar to that. I'd suggest getting a crate - you probably don't even need to shut the door, the crate itself would be comforting if she has been crate trained. Also, getting a good behaviouralist in - if you're in NSW, I think I'd recommend Steve Courtney, k9-Pro. He does have a website, as well as a list of behaviouralists/trainers of good repute, just in case any of them are closer to you. Without the help of ours, I think I'd still be stuck trying to handle a dog with pure 100% hysteria everytime he went outside. It's not much fun for anyone! By the way, she looks adorable!

For the person who wanted to know why anyone would want a dog like this - if you can put the work into them, over a long enough period, they are, or can be, the most wonderful, intensely 'all yours' dog. Duke (my IT) is a lot like this, although he's never eaten the door, he has removed the dog door so I now have a dog 'hole', the lounge got thrown out last pickup as he'd eaten quite a lot of it. He has pretty much stopped that, though. He'll eat anything not nailed down, and a lot of people want to know how I could put up with him (he also has full blown attacks of hysteria when you are walking him - much toned down after 3 years of dog shrink) But- he's a wonderful, people focused dog that,now some focus has gotten into that brain, is translating into a wonderful dog to have around. He's been worth the vet bills, the doctor bills, the slight loss of hearing in the ear nearest him in the car. :) For Eric, if you still want him, a run to go with that kennel, edged either with concrete or with concrete pavers for when you are not there would probably manage the issue.

He's a young rottie cross, isn't he? I haunt the american rottweiller net quite a bit. They would say - the destruction could well be due to the fact that he didn't get that evening walk. Their advice - would be more exercise, and training (and lots of it). I'd suggest also to start training loose leash walking in the backyard first - also a firstrate sit next to you. Should make it also easier to teach him outside the house. I'd get in touch with your local dog club - you never know, they might be affordable, and even have a soft-touch of an instructor who may be willing to give you a home lesson or two to get you started. If this dog ticks all the other boxes for you, I'd work on keeping up the exercise and training, and then take it week by week. (Including NILF and TOT, those are awesome programmes) Oh yes, welcome to the world of 'interesting' dogs. It's a roller coaster of a ride!

That description sounds so much like Duke - standing still, tall,mouth closed ---- he is trying to figure out what to do next - run away or towards. If the other dog gives clear "friend" signals (like so clear blind freddy could see them) you can see his brain tick over, and then, OH - you want to be friends - and he'll playbow. On the other hand, if the other dog is more inclined to 'attitude' or 'I'm top dog' - thats trouble and I walk Duke away. There are reasons he never gets off leash, his canine vocabulary just isn't much good. I've been learning from Reactive Rover classes, but there is still so much more to learn!!

Hi Sandy2, I think, given your criteria, that terriers would be a no go zone. Some ideas: - powder puff; smooth coat griffon; french bulldog, purebred maltese, bichon frise, affenpincher, minature/toy poodle. Keep in mind, low maintenance does not really exist. Its more pet vs show dog which can be massive maintenance. For pets, you keep the coats clipped down(either a groomer or a nice sharp pair of scissors or clippers) keeps things nice and manageable. All dogs really do need regular brushing, it also allows you to check for grass seeds, suspicious lumps cuts and bumps etc. Noise and escapeology and chasing - very strong instincts in terriers, noise can be a problem in dogs that were bred for watchdogs but basically every dog is different, which is why you need to tell the breeder you like what your requirements are. Training is also a strong factor and the ground rules need to be set in place from day one. Do have a look at the french bulldog - they are a seriously lovely and fun dog to have around. There's a breed thread in the subforum at the top of the page.

thank you all for your input - I copied them all to the class trainer (who also says thank you). After consultation with the head trainer, we put young schroeder onto a gentle leader. It seems to me that the pup was calmer (pup - he's 12 months old), and his owner was having more success handling both leash and walking stick this week. From here on in, I think the biggest problem will be that his owners don't seem to remember too well what was said the week before, so we will be writing them up a cheat sheet to take home. We are going to be concentrating on getting the 'reward him when he's being good' and 'reward when he is walking/sitting next to you' concept across. They tell me they can let him go for a run (although never when other dogs are around) and he does come back, so they are doing something right.

Hi, for once, this isn't about my 'special' dog Duke! I help out with beginner classes at my dog club - if you, as a new owner are one of those people that need a lot of assistance, I'm the person who stays with you and helps. This semester, the first person needing help has managed to get to where she needs in the first week, and is doing fine. However, young Schroeder (mini schnauzer) is presenting a challenge - to be precise, both his owners are dependent on walking sticks and in consequence, very unsteady on their feet. Schroeder nearly pulled his owner over about 5/6 times - and these were not the 'full on' type lunges, either. He does have the kind of owners you wish more dogs had, but these guys are going to have lots of problems simply due to mobility, and being new dog owners. Any ideas on how to help them get Schroeder to loose leash walk? Most of our techniques do rely on steady owners who can do a bit of swift moving - they just are not possible for these guys. I've asked them as homework for this week to concentrate on the Name Game (ie, they call his name,reward for attention) and rewarding whenever Schroeder is next to them in the approximate loose leash walking position. The trainer is going to try a haltie next week to see if this can help. Given that they are physically in no way ever going to last the entire class as well, this may well be my semester dog project - but I'd like to think that I can at least get them walking without fear of falling over at some point in time.

I think some people might want to settle down a bit - the OP is learning the way we all learn - by experience. He's also aready contacting a good behaviouralist/trainer, as per advice here on DOL. Also, most of us wind up on DOL because we have problems/issues with our dogs - and then stay to pass on what we have learnt. I do look forward to updates from the OP - because I always learn a little bit more, and because I do like it when things can be worked out. Keep in mind, he hasn't dumped either of his dogs, he's been looking for help - otherwise the dogs would not now be desexed, and he's committed to finding a way, and happy to look at whatever will help him in that. That's good dog ownership, in my mind.