LizT

Just trying to learn a bit here too. I have a neighbour who has a female Golden Retriever, beautiful pet. She has since bought a second "better bitch" (her words), that came from "better breeder" and has "better bloodlines' than her original bitch. When the two of them went off for a "adventure", (the original bitch is an escape artist and the second bitch was purchased to keep her company in the hope that she would stop breaking out of their yard, it backfired and the younger bitch has learnt to escape and follow the bad habits of the older dog ) the owner became quite distressed as she was certain someone would "keep" her new puppy as it was such a terrific example of the breed. I saw the second dog when it had matured to about 2 years of age and I noticed how very short in the legs it was, compared to other Golden Retrievers and it's pal. So do Goldies also have this dwarfism problem occurring or can it occur in any breed? I must admit I have often seen it in black Labradors. Incidently if genetics allowed us to screen for all types of diseases and malformations then we wouldn't have people with disabilities. You cannot expect dog breeders to be able to do what human medicine is still trying to achieve with all it's resources. I understand your situation, it's very difficult to return a pet when it has become part of the family. A Vet had told me that my first Cavalier had a heart murmur. We could have returned her but had already fallen in love with her, so since it was classed as 1 out of 10 we felt it wouldn't be an issue for our lovely new pet that was bought for my then, seven year old daughter. We were very fortunate...it turned out to be what is known as a "innocent murmur' or "puppy murmur" with no trace of it when the puppy was 12 weeks old. At almost three years of age she is still "heart clear". My point is we were not emotionally able to give her back either. When a breeder gives a 'guarantee' it is not a guarantee that nothing could go wrong with the puppy, it is a guarantee that the best intentions in breeding and health screenings available were done and if found to be ill within the period stated can be returned for a refund or replacement.

Yaaah!! Way to go little Brighid, you had quite the weekend didn't you!!

Not sure if he was originally against purebreds as such. In his show he started out "Road Testing" a different purebred each week and that was an interesting segment where he went to Breeders and got credible information about their breeds. After a time he jumped on the "DD" bandwagon. Who knows maybe after he ran out of 'popular breeds' he came across a purebred Breeder with less than 'ideal' conditions and then went to see a "DD" breeder who did it 'nicely', with better facilities and cute puppies??? All I know is he did alot to 'push' the idea of "DD" as being healthier and made them 'trendy' to boot. Interestingly enough I recently read a book on breeding purebred dogs and they talk of "line'breeding' and "breeding to type" (line breeding by default) and "out-crossing". It suggested that a "Hybrid-vigour" could possibly be achieved by careful outcrossing. It even mentioned "cross-breeding" as being the breeding of two distintly different breeds so as to explain the differences.

Let's face it there will always be issues concerning ALL types of dog breeding. When there are no controlling bodies there will always be those who take things to the extreme...it's human nature to take advantage of something that could be of benefit ($$$) to you. And where there are controlling bodies there will still be people who push the limits, thinking it's okay because they are working inside the rules. Don Burke is a jerk. I have friends who work in the film industry and they have told me is is very arrogant. This will make him the type of person who sticks to his ideals without any compromise or an open mind. Whether people are breeding cross breeds that have a myriad of health issues or purebreds (and not addressing their health issues either) then we will have dogs that can't reproduce without the aid of a C-section or shred the umbilical cord themselves and there will be the critics. Only yesterday my vet was telling me he had just performed a C-section on a Bulldog bitch that has had three done to date (this was the first he'd done, as the owner has had to go Vet shopping as each has told her the bitch has had enough.) He said of course he had to do it for the bitches sake but hopes he has convinced the owner this is her last litter. He said he is very much against this type of breeding. My thoughts were he won't see that owner again, she'll just go elsewhere.

Hmmmm, a nutbag and idiot to boot!!

Parkeyre are you suggesting the police would do something not above board!!!

If that's the case the dog was doing EXACTLY what it has been trained to do! If anything the Officers in Charge should receive a repremand for not follow procedures correctly by the sounds of things. Someone should have been controlling the entrance to the house.

I thought it was 6-7weeks, then 10 weeks. Everyone round here gets them done at that time. Think they leave it till 7 weeks so the puppies are that little bit stronger... I think you are right, every pup I've bought has had it's first vaccination to be followed up at 12 weeks with the second, when I've purchased it at 8 weeks of age. Anyway regardless of vaccination age the pup is still so vunerable. Many publications state that 12 weeks is a better age to go to the new home and I've known of people who find an 8 week old puppy overwhelming and have asked the breeder if they could hold on to it until 12 weeks of age. (My sister for one). Personally, I think you need to have support at home for a very young puppy as they are very demanding, even if only for a short time with care and feeding etc.

As stated by previous posts there are rules and guidelines designed to help the tranistion to the new home and this person is not abiding by them. It is unlikely they are a registered breeder as it is an irresposible thing to do with possible repercussions.

Just listening to the rain coming down on the tin roof and thinking I'm glad I'm not showing this weekend. I hope that conditions are not too severe across Victoria for all you people who are out and about this weekend. Good Luck and stay safe.

That child is nowhere near old enough to have endured any such mental scarring and guess what? even if that was so you would think that she of all people would have even more compassion for defenceless animals instead of being such a despicable being. Can't find it in me to make any excuses for that maggot. I'm guessing forgiveness and trying to understand others isn't a part of your ideal world either? Suggesting that you hope a child gets raped and brutally murdered has got to be one of the most utterly disgusting things I have ever had the misfortune to read on this forum Rape was never something that I wished upon her so please do not put words in my mouth; I may have mentioned Jack the Ripper but I was not thinking of rape as I am not of the knowledge that Jack the Ripper was a rapist. I said that in a moment of total disgust and despair so hence I do not wish for her to be mutilated which is what JTR was known for; However, I am not ashamed to say that I hope her life is one of unhappiness and total misery. As a clinical psychologist I have dealt with all walks of life and know only too well that not all cases of animal cruelty are due to a dysfunctional upbringing or some sad occurance, some people are just born plain evil so therefore I am beyond trying to constantly make excuses for such atrocities because more often than not there are NO EXCUSES! The perpetrators are simply evil and a waste of oxygen and that is the tragic part! How very scary to let you near people as a psychologist, when you condone throwing children/kids into a river, or condemning them to a life of hell. I've had a fair bit of dealings with Clinical Psychologists and all I can say is I'm glad your not practising in this country. As educated people I don't see how so many of the people "out for violent revenge" seem to think that just because others don't want to see the offender harmed it means that they are condoning what she did? Nowhere have I seen anyone state that what she did is forgivable. Actually given that I reside in Victoria it goes to say that I am practicing in this country. There are other posters who are also of the opinion that she should be treated accordingly; I also realise that nobody has condoned her actions although some have made excuses as to why she may have done it. Look, basically I am at a stage in my life in which I just have no time for callous acts of cruelty and although I personally would never inflict any revenge myself I would not lose sleep either if these cruel individuals were being dealt with. An eye for an eye...plainly put. My apologies there are so many quote overlaps I thought you were from OS. ;) Look I'm sure you would be a very nice and interesting person if we were discussing something with less emotional polarity....but it does worry me that you are working in a field that is supposed to help people and that you have such a strong prior judgement of people that no one damaged is likely to get any unbiased counselling from you?? I've seen this happen in the field of social work, people get very depressed and dispondent, that's when they are in desperate need of a career change. I'd hate to think someone is coming to you or has been brought to you for help and that you have already classed them as "a waste of space/oxygen". Have you considered counselling yourself??? I've often seen that people such as yourself need someone to vent with or they can become discompassonate themselves.

Hopefully this gets the thread back ontopic Yes, at least now she will be delt with by the law and not the"mob".

You wrote.. From my previous post.. Clearly, I am not suggesting that you would be inflicting anything on the child, instead that you wished someone known for several very violent (and undeniably very sexual) murders would harm the child. You can back-pedal all you like on that one but I do not see how your comment could be interpreted any other way than a disgusting (and completely inexcusable) wish that a child be killed. And suggesting that a child ought to have the same ability to judge behaviour with all the insight and emotional developement as an adult.. If you honestly believe children are capable of making informed, rational decisions (where consequences are fully understood and the morality of the decision has been thoroughly examined and deemed appropriate), then you clearly have never met an actual child. Actual children do incredibly stupid/dangerous/selfish things all the time because they lack sound judgement. Children are treated diferently under law for a reason- children sometimes do terrible things but compassion would suggest that you look at ways to help those children become good adults, rather than simply wiping them out as if they were cockroaches. Edited to add.. This* is the sort of thing you've indicated you'd like to see happen to the child. If you still can't see anything wrong with your comment, I think you need to seek help ;) *Warning- very graphic photo I never did say that I wished sexual acts onto that child. If a child is a victim of sexual abuse or a dysfunctional family then I am all for the child receiving extended counselling and help to become a sensible adult. If the child is clearly NOT a victim of either....you will find that counselling is not going to make an iota of difference and such kids have a tendency to mature into adults that will continue their macabre practices and be cunning enough to never get caught. Well, historically what do you think Jack the Ripper did to those women???

That child is nowhere near old enough to have endured any such mental scarring and guess what? even if that was so you would think that she of all people would have even more compassion for defenceless animals instead of being such a despicable being. Can't find it in me to make any excuses for that maggot. I'm guessing forgiveness and trying to understand others isn't a part of your ideal world either? Suggesting that you hope a child gets raped and brutally murdered has got to be one of the most utterly disgusting things I have ever had the misfortune to read on this forum Rape was never something that I wished upon her so please do not put words in my mouth; I may have mentioned Jack the Ripper but I was not thinking of rape as I am not of the knowledge that Jack the Ripper was a rapist. I said that in a moment of total disgust and despair so hence I do not wish for her to be mutilated which is what JTR was known for; However, I am not ashamed to say that I hope her life is one of unhappiness and total misery. As a clinical psychologist I have dealt with all walks of life and know only too well that not all cases of animal cruelty are due to a dysfunctional upbringing or some sad occurance, some people are just born plain evil so therefore I am beyond trying to constantly make excuses for such atrocities because more often than not there are NO EXCUSES! The perpetrators are simply evil and a waste of oxygen and that is the tragic part! How very scary to let you near people as a psychologist, when you condone throwing children/kids into a river, or condemning them to a life of hell. I've had a fair bit of dealings with Clinical Psychologists and all I can say is I'm glad your not practising in this country. As educated people I don't see how so many of the people "out for violent revenge" seem to think that just because others don't want to see the offender harmed it means that they are condoning what she did? Nowhere have I seen anyone state that what she did is forgivable.

For some reason early desexing doesn't sit well with me. My vets wont do it before 6 months even though the council expects puppies to be registered at three months of age now and you need the papers to show it's been done. I do see the merits of it but I seem to have a "block' with it??

Kirislin you are right. The person in question may not have endured the war in general but she has been raised by people who have, in an environment where genocide was enacted upon a population of the same country because they didn't have the same belief system, because they were different from the other. A dog is of no value in a society like that. A goat or sheep would be. Chickens and ducks would, but not a dog, an animal that costs money to feed and brings nothing to the table except a financial drain. An animal that is easy to acquire and just as easy to be rid of. That is the world this child has been raised in. Clearly what she has done is totally unacceptable and probably so even to her peers and maybe even her parents. Perhaps these children were charged with the task on drowing the puppies, hence the fact that they were in a bucket in the first place. The fact that they made a game of it is something that certainly indicates that things are not right in their world. And maybe they would get into severe trouble if their parents were to have found out. But I find the attitude of those who want to inflict a violent revenge of these perperators equally distrurbing. They talk of a world gone mad and yet they throw petrol on the fires of hatred. Is that really going to help??? I doubt it. It would only help to fuel the hatred that is so instilled in this world already. I'm all for justice. I'm all for being held accountable. I don't believe that people should get off from these types of things with a slap on the wrist. No, not every damaged person is able to be rehabilitated. Actual most cannot be. In the half centuary I've been on this planet I've seen things I will not speak of. It's made me cynical at times but it hasn't turned me into a person with a mob mentality.

Did you get your papers in the end???? Mine seemed to take a great deal of time to go through when I bought both my girls from Registered Breeders (Dogsvic)who had both put them through at different times too. Apparently there was quite a backlog of paperwork at the time/s. Not responding to your calls could just be her poor way of not dealing with something that is out of her control. Not very professional but it could be how she handles things she has no further information on. Personally as a Breeder I'd be querying the delay in paperwork on behalf of my puppys' new owner!? Oh, i see the OP has her papers now. That's good.

I, on the other hand, do NOT feel sorry for such a sorry excuse for a human being! In fact I would go so far as to say that this is the time when I wish Jack the Ripper had that girl in the palm of his hands and made the most of it! Gosh, if there is any justice in this world, I just hope that she becomes a victim of a drowning. AMEN If that happens/ed you'd be surprised at how horrible YOU would feel, (I should hope so anyway). I do not believe in an 'Eye for an Eye' or a 'Child's death for a puppy's death', in this case. If you are an animal lover then the first quality you MUST HAVE is compassion, where's yours????? If a child were attacked or thrown in a River I'd hope someone with a different approach to justice would be there to prevent yet another atrocity. Fortunately there are people out there, such as have posted here, that people with a lych mob mentality would have to get through first.

The drowning of puppies and kittens was once common practice and was often the only "birth control" methods many people bothered with. Sad but true. What is extemely disturbing is that this is happening in this day and age. That the puppies appear to be healthy and not just newborn, that they have been loved and nutured by their mother and that there is a video camera, FFS involved!! To humanely euthanais an unwanted litter is one thing. I feel so sorry for that girl, clearly she is damaged goods and doesn't know love and compassion. Oh, don't get me wrong...I'm angry...I haven't stopped shaking yet...she certainly needs to be held accountable for this.... but I'm not going to join a lynch-mob.

Sooo sweet. Gosh I'm getting puppy clucky now! Gosh you must be so very tired after midwifing two litters!! Geez I bet you had to bite your tongue when you found out about the neighbours bitch??!! That was a very good thing you did.

Firstly Congratulations!!! My first litter is due within the week and it's a very exciting (and nervous) time. I'd just like to say "Trust your instincts". I posted a litter notice on DOL and asked for "expressions of interest" and it has been VERY interesting getting emails and calls from people asking about the future litter and telling me about what puppy they would like and why. You get a feel for the people and what they are like. Ask them questions, the response, or lack of, is often an indication of their intention. There are some lovely people out there and one of the first things is ask them what they know or have researched about your breed. Many have owned the breed before and some have done quite a bit of reading. It's great to hear people ask about Health testing and their reasons for contacting a registered breeder. Good luck with the birth/s. Siberian Huskys are such lovely dogs. It's so sad to see they are often on the "Rescue" and "Adoption" listings. I can understand and applaude you wanting to home then correctly. Also... as you now know you'll have to revise you strategy for keeping the dog away from the bitch when you have decided it's not time for another litter just yet! LOL

I've NEVER only had just the one dog so there is often a time when you know that someone needs company because another is getting old and doesn't play with them any more, so you start to think about getting another dog. Thinking about it is the first responsible step to any pet ownership. PS. Cavaliers love Cavalier company too!

And sadly some are just "pretty darn cute and 'appear to be' more ecconomical to the layman. Also once apon a time most people had some kind of cross breed due to people being lax about desexing and most neighbourhoods were filled with these dogs as the much loved family pet. They didn't come with the hype or the big price tag they come with today... just given to good homes because the bitch got accidently (and on purposely) mated with the poodle round the corner. It didn't help that the Media jumped on the bandwagon and made these wonderful claims about these dogs on popular Lifestyle Shows like "Bourkes Backyard" either!

Don't know...can guests?? I do have a "Litter Notice" but the Word "Profile" was mentioned in the Email?? Or perphaps my Breeders Profile or even my bitches Profiles???

While this is not a 'General Dog Discussion' the outlet through which my "future love to lie in my arms" was apparently "My Profile" in "Dogzonline" Typical of those emails from people who in very poor 'engalish' tell you how much they find your profile interesting and want to meet you, she's 5ft 5 inches apparently and slim!! Did I mention I'm a happily married female by the way???!!! She actually mentions my profile on DOL, I thought it was a puppy enquiry at first, but no, no mention of a dog. So silly. What kind of scam are they trying?? ;) Sorry my 'future love' but you're deleted!