corvus

Kivi is a mama's boy and always has been. He is quite free with his affection and visitors get the most, but no one gets quite the joyous greetings that I do. He comes whining to me when the dogs at the park aren't playing nice, it's my side of the bed he's been sneaking up onto all week in the dead of the night when no one is awake to stop him, and he's nearly always in whatever room I'm in. Erik is a pack dog. He is most happy where the most members of the pack are. He hates to be left out of anything, so it doesn't matter who is leaving the group, he's trying to throw himself after them. He snuggles equally with OH and I, but prefers my legs as his favourite resting place. I think it's mostly habit, though.

I wouldn't! The reaon why is because I have seen it several times turn a bad situation worse. IME a dog that is already excited is quite likely to be tipped over threshold if they see someone pick up a small dog. My dog isn't small, but when a dalmatian tried to attack him, and wouldn't stop lunging at him, the only way my OH could keep him out of the way is to pick him up and hold him high in the air while I kicked at the attacking dog since this dog's owners just stood there. For me, the priority is to get my dog out of harm's way. That should be everyone's priority! My point is that sometimes it PUTS dogs in harm's way. There are no hard and fast rules with dog-dog interaction IMO. You stay on your toes and adapt to the situation. My rule of thumb is to avoid (not never) picking up a dog around strange dogs, even if all the dogs are calm. I have that rule because I have seen it make matters worse and had it happen to me. I have had a scary situation erupt out of a worrying situation and it's just bad news all around. Obviously if you have a dog attacking yours the situation can't get much worse and you do what you have to.

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I don't remember exactly where I got mine from, but they have them here: http://www.wagschoolbooks.com.au/shop/nina...a-ottosson.html Mind you, they are not the best toy for a sleep-in! Erik slams ours around the kitchen so hard that I swear he's going to put it through a wall one day. He is always getting it wedged in the most ridiculous places. Behind the fridge, under cupboards... basically anywhere it will fit it somehow ends up. So either it's being slammed across the kitchen or it's stuck somewhere he can't get it out. If we want a sleep in and the dogs don't, we give them cow hooves or a Kong. They don't get them when we are not at home, though, as they can get stuck on the roof of their mouths.

Yep, I have found the same thing. It keeps it a much lower key affair. My boys both come back to me if they are uncomfortable. I would have tackled the Lab. Much easier to catch and once you've got him the little dog is out of immediate danger and can then be picked up if required or simply put back on leash. If it's on leash and the Lab tries to menace it again, it can't bolt and you can crouch down and protect it as above. Better for everyone as the Lab doesn't get the fun of chasing and the SWF doesn't get the terror of being chased. Often the small dog can come around and decide they aren't so scared of the big dog after all. IME if you are going to pick up a dog at the dog park you should do it when no other dogs are watching. If they see the dog in your arms but didn't see it get there they seem to be less excited by it, although it's still no guarantee. One time my dogs found a dead possum in the yard. They were quite interested, but only poking it with their noses. The moment I lifted part of it off the ground they both got extremely excited and started to bite and try to play tug with it. As soon as I put it back on the ground they left it again. Weird, but it's the same sort of thing with small dogs sometimes. It's like when you pick it up it becomes a toy to bite and pull on.

Dogs can be quite sensitive about changes in your muscle tension. If I talk through my teeth at Erik but am just playing with him, he does not get upset, but if I am angry and talk through my teeth at him he gets very submissive and comes looking for reassuring cuddles. He doesn't know what he has done to make me turn unpleasant, but he knows that one is bad and he knows when it's directed at him. One day I found him chewing on my $900 binoculars. I didn't yell at him because it was my fault, not his, but he could tell from my body language that I was very upset and I was ignoring his attempts to gain reassurance from me because I didn't trust myself to be fair to him. In the end, he grew increasingly distressed until I let him up for a cuddle. Sometimes I think he doesn't know what he's done, but senses that I'm upset with him and seeks to "mend" the rift with submissive and affiliative behaviour. Once he is reassured he relaxes and the submissive behaviour stops. As for the clam shell, I think she's old enough. We also have a funky pyramid toy that has a hole at the top where treats fall out when the dog knocks it over. It is weighted so it bounces back upright again. It's a good change from Kongs. You can also make them "pass the parcel" style games where you tie pockets of treats into cloth strips so they have to undo the knots to get the treats.

Thanks everyone. OH thinks it's all immoral madness. I've thought about getting involved with the local hunting club, but frankly most hunters I've met have been rednecks and not especially interested in welfare. Around here it's all deer and pig hunters. I don't want to hunt large animals. Just want to be a little more self-sufficient.

If it is anticipation of food, you could always mess up the anticipation by adding in other rewards, like play or life rewards. I do this for many things as soon as it is on cue. You can shape something automatic like lovemesideways suggested starting with very small durations. I once shaped Erik to hold his right front paw up starting with clicking for the moment he lifted it as he was walking. It took maybe 10 minutes, which is a long time for Erik. I wouldn't be able to do that with Kivi, though, because I doubt he would ever be aware of what his tongue was doing. For him I would click for licking first and put that on cue, which would probably work to make him aware of it and thus realise when I was clicking for NOT sticking it out.

I wouldn't! The reaon why is because I have seen it several times turn a bad situation worse. IME a dog that is already excited is quite likely to be tipped over threshold if they see someone pick up a small dog. It's like the moment the dog leaves the ground it becomes a toy. They will jump up and try to grab the dog out of your arms. It excites other dogs and you can quickly find yourself in the middle of a pile of dogs all trying excitedly to snatch the poor terrified dog out of your arms. Then you're stuck, because you can't put the dog back down while you're surrounded by a bunch of dogs trying to grab it. My small dog doesn't flee and squeal, so we don't ever have this problem, but when he was a puppy if he was being harassed I would crouch by him. That way he could shelter under me where the other dogs couldn't get to him and everyone had a chance to calm down. He could go back to the game when he felt comfortable and know that I was there if he needed a break. Incidentally, my dogs are well socialised and not very prey driven, but they would still get quite aroused if a small dog was running away from them squealing. I can call them off, but it's one of the hardest things to call them away from because it's REALLY exciting. I don't really blame an owner that can't call their dog off that kind of thing. It took a lot of practice for us. It might be that owners of such dogs have a right to walk their dogs off leash, but if I had a small dog that did that I sure as hell would never let it off leash in a dog park. IMO it's asking for trouble. So I agree with wuffles that both parties have a responsibility. Big dog owners in being able to call their dogs off and small dog owners in being sensible about putting their dogs in potential danger. Occasionally I get asked for advice, but most people seem to think they have their dog well in hand. I restrict what I say to simple stuff like "reward him when he's doing what you want him to do".

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When my dogs are anticipating food they drool rather than lip lick. They do drool during training sometimes. I'd be leaning towards the anxiety theory as well. Some dogs lip lick at surprisingly low levels of stress or anxiety. Erik will do it in training if he's unsure of himself. Usually means I need to raise my reward rate.

As much as I love clickers and CU, I don't think either would help much on their own in behavioural modification. You have to actually know why the behaviour is occurring IMO. Otherwise you're just stumbling around in the dark hitting things and hoping you hit the right thing eventually and not break anything else while you're trying. I would get a vet behaviourist's opinion if you can. Feuding females in the same house is very scary. Very, very scary. Let us hope that is not what is budding amongst other things, but a behaviourist would be able to identify the most likely causes for the behaviour, and that means you'll be treating the right thing rather than what you hope is the right thing. If you treat the wrong thing you don't know what's gonna happen. Maybe it'll work for a while through some indirect effect, maybe it won't do a thing, maybe it will make it worse, maybe it'll change things you didn't want to change. I don't think that's a risk worth taking when dogs are getting injured and such. Poor things sound scared. Hope you can get some help.

Most of the time when animals freeze in a situation like this it's because they feel helpless to escape perceived danger. I think anything you can do to reduce his sense that he can't do anything to make himself feel more safe would be good for him. If it were me, I would be giving him something to do, like a task he knows well and is very successful at that will be rewarded with something good, probably food. Feeling like he can control something at this moment would, I think, help him cope with it. People often say targeting is good here, because you can have them concentrate on, say, your hand as you walk them through. Leslie McDevitt does the Look At That game, which is essentially rewarding the dog for looking at the scary dogs and then eventually putting it on cue. It turns it into a game or a training task and so the dog is focused on earning a reward rather than checking where the scary dogs are.

Looks like I've only got one left, but I'm in Sydney and I could post it in an envelope no worries. It's still within its expiry date, but it says on the pack dogs from 4.6kg-9kg. Not sure if that's an issue if the dogs are smaller than that? Before Comfortis came along I was using tissues or cloth with a few drops of Lemon-scented Teatree oil wrapped around my older dog's collar. She was really having a hard time with them, and that was the only thing I found that had any impact at all. It seemed to discourage them. She hated the smell, though. I thought if I could get her to wear some around her ankles it would slow them down more, but she never agreed to that one. As far as nausea goes, Kivi threw up the first two times he had it and was a little subdued the first time. My other dog didn't throw up at all, but was a little subdued the first time. After that, they were both fine. We always dosed them when feeding a meal, which is supposed to help. I did what ReadySetGo said and it only knocked them down for about a week. Seriously, it is horrible when you've done everything you can and still have a massive flea problem. It made me look and feel like a terrible owner. We were that close to ripping up the carpet in sheer desperation. Come to think, probably should have done that anyway. It's horrible stuff.

Sounds like what we went through. None of the flea treatments were working. Every time we used one it was less effective than the last time. Flea bombs didn't do much as we have shagpile carpet. It seemed there were always some that went deep into it and survived. In the end, Comfortis saved our lives. We were flea-free in 3 months. Our whole house has been flea-free all winter and we are no longer dosing them. We have some ready for when the weather warms up, though. It is not very nice and made them throw up the first couple of times we used it, but man was it worth it. I think I still have one or two tablets left for dogs under 9kg that I can't use if you're looking for donations. Would have to check if it's still within the expiry date.

Kavik, I'm a cow lover, too, and I've nurtured baby steers and cared for them and loved them and then eaten them. Maybe I'm weird, but I think there's something to be said for caring about the animals you're going to slaughter for food. I mean, really caring about them as an individual. Feeling sad about it. I love my pet bunnies and obviously I wouldn't dream of feeding them to my dogs, but that's because their purpose in my life has been well-defined as companions. You don't feed your friends to your dogs. But when you raise an animal for the table it doesn't matter how much you love them, their purpose in your life is well-defined as food. Otherwise no, I wouldn't be able to do it. I guess you have to find your moral boundaries somewhere. As much as I love my bunnies, I can't say I love them more than I have loved some of the dairy cows I have worked with. Does that mean I shouldn't eat beef? I have to reconcile myself with that dichotomy somehow. However I do it doesn't really matter as long as I'm at peace with it. Sorry, that wasn't meant to be a speech. I guess I just want people to know that I believe it is possible to love an animal and also kill it at a young age and eat it (or feed it to a dog). I don't expect everyone to agree or understand where I'm coming from, but I've done it and found it to be very meaningful to me. Never appreciated a meal more than when I personally knew the animal it came from. It's sad and weird, but that's life. Better to know the animal and feel sad than just eat something you're not even sure where it came from or what kind of life it had. Anyway, we have a large bunny and a wild hare, so we already go through plenty of pellets and we get meadow hay by the bale from a place out at Picton. We have found it to be very cheap to keep rabbits in the scheme of things. 25kg of pellets costs us about $27 and lasts us a couple of months. To feed the dogs on raw for two months it costs about $100. Plus extra for supplements and organs. The rabbits hardly ever get sick or injured and I don't think I've ever medicated them. The bunny is sensitive to heat, but it's only a few days in a year that we have to manage that. The hare is tough as old boots. My worm farm gets most of vegie leftovers (and the used rabbit litter), but the rabbit gets carrot tops and sweet potato offcuts and asian greens leftovers and the hare gets over-ripe fruit.

I looked into this when I was thinking about it and from what I could make out it is illegal to release an animal for the purpose of allowing a dog to chase or capture it, as SSM said, but given it is not illegal to hunt pigs with dogs, or rabbits with ferrets, it seemed bizarre to me that it would be illegal to hunt rabbits with dogs. From what I can tell it is not. At least, I haven't found any laws that suggest it is. Although you need a hunting licence to hunt rabbits on crown land or state forests in NSW, distributed through the Gaming Council, whom I have ethical issues with. Also, I hate guns. I won't have anything to do with them. I have looked around quite a bit for cheap rabbit carcasses, and contacted one of the commercial rabbit farms around here, but they never got back to me. Rabbit meat is a niche market and rabbit carcasses generally go for around $20 a pop around here. My local butcher sells rabbit and other game meats, but it's all gourmet stuff. They charge an arm and a leg. Although I would get hold of some to make sure my dogs were actually going to eat it if I did decide to go ahead. It's very much hypothetical at the moment, though. I like the idea, but not sure if it's worth pursuing. I remember looking into this one, too. I don't remember the details, but I think this has to do with residential zoning. I seem to remember coming to the conclusion that I actually would be able to do it. I think I checked my council's LEP and couldn't find any mention of it. But at any rate, I would actually ask at the council before I went ahead with it to be sure.

I certainly have! I even looked for some ferreters, but couldn't find any local. I don't know anywhere around here that would have lots of rabbits. We live in an area that has lots of bush and rocks but not a lot of open grassy areas. And lots of National Parks where I wouldn't be able to take ferrets anyway. And I realise it's probably more labour intensive than looking after a handful of bunnies. I've even thought about getting myself a rabbit-hunting dog. :D Thanks for the info, guys.

My Vall rivals Shelties for unnecessary noise. I live in hope that he will settle down in time, as he's still quite young, but I don't expect him to. He takes his watchdog duties very seriously. He has not been the easiest of dogs to raise and at times has really challenged my abilities, but he is a very drivey, outgoing, bold dude and he's the toughest little dog you'll ever see. He crash tackles my 26kg Lapphund when they are both galloping. It's quite spectacular, once the dust settles and you find that they are both still in one piece. He is small, but very solid and strong. Corgis are like that as well. I like my small dogs to be robust. What about a Tibetan Terrier? They seem quite fun.

I remember seeing my ex kill a wild rabbit with his hands and it was quite quick and clean. Current OH would be petitioning for the permanent safety of the bunnies for the extent of their natural lives... And who can blame him. On the other hand, I would know what the bunnies had been fed on and what medication they had received, they would have a good life for the short 12 weeks it takes to raise them, and I would be a little more self-sufficient and sustainable, which is a nice thought. And it would make giving my dogs a more complete, biologically appropriate diet easier. I dunno. More research, I think.

I had a vague notion that I could farm rabbits to feed the dogs (and us??). But then it occurred to me that I have a pet rabbit and bunnies are about the most ridiculously cute animal in the world and while I could deal with a feral rabbit I don't know that I could kill a fluffy white thing I had raised myself. So I binned the idea. But then I thought about it again and thought if I knew they were destined for the table I wouldn't let myself get attached to them in the first place. I've been involved with hoof and hook cattle competitions and never got sad about saying goodbye to my steer because I had always known it was going to happen and had concentrated on giving him a good life while he was with us. Then again, I didn't have to kill them myself. Basically, just wondering if anyone has tried farming bunnies for meat. I'd like to hear about it.

Pembroke Corgi was my first dog. A good size and very easy to train. Shelties IME can be a wee bit highly strung.

Okay, just a passing comment here, not an argument... Personally, I find the animals I work with influence the way I work with all animals. I crossed over from correction-based methods in the first place because I started working on wild birds and just naturally found that all the things that were being drilled into me about considering the consequences my activities had on the birds started to bleed into my interactions with my pets at home as well. I found it impossible to hold one set of standards for birds and another for dogs. It just didn't work for me. I would be more comfortable with a trainer that had trained a broad range of dogs rather than one that had trained a particular kind of dog to a particularly high level. Yes, all K9s are different and require flexibility in the approach, but they are still a particular type of dog, that being very strongly driven, very motivated, very bold, a little aggressive, fast bounceback and all the rest of the myriad things that go into a good working dog. I know that if it were me, heavy experience in that kind of dog would colour the way I dealt with most animals I worked with. To me, I think regardless of how good a police dog trainer may be at training police dogs, this doesn't automatically make them good at training all dogs. Training all sorts of dogs is what makes them good at training all dogs. My only issue with police dog training is that pressure they have to put on them in proofing. From the conversations I've had I think that is the only area in which it really strays far from positive, motivational training in the first place, so that's what I thought people were talking about. Some dogs get corrected, but to those dogs it's more an interruption than a correction. Some of them just need swift action before they get themselves really riled. One of my dogs needs that sometimes, and I use a positive interruptor because it works just as well for him. He's not a GSD.

I know that sooner or later a police dog generally needs to be triggered into defence or fight drive, they call it. That dog needs to fight for real or else how can we expect it to hold someone who is trying desperately to get away? I do not think the methods are particularly harsh or cruel for those dogs, because they are the kind of dogs that will handle it or else they wouldn't have been trained as police dogs. I think it would be harsh and cruel for my dogs, though, regardless of how much "building up" they may get previously.

But that was my point, really. Although I didn't want to get side-tracked and embroiled in an argument about detection dogs so I didn't really make it very clearly. I know someone who competes in agility with Basenjis. They tell me with the right Basenji it's doable. After all, they are fast and agile and physically able to do it and fast physical activity is usually fun for a dog. It's just a matter of finding an extremely motivated Basenji. And doing loads of work. And always being prepared to have your dog abruptly decide they are not performing today, thanks. And that's the crux of it. Are police dog training methods going to make that dog ALWAYS perform in the agility ring where lots of positive reinforcement didn't? If so, I would like to see it. It would be an eye opener, I'm sure.