Souff

What you think it might be about now, and how the legislation might actually read, could well be poles apart. And once legislation is in place and it has flaws, well too bad! You are stuck with it for years. I said this in another thread about the rally ...... I dont want to see dogs becoming the PAWNS of POLITICIANS .... it would be criminal for politicians to now rush through laws based on what they believe is "popular opinion" and has come from the emotion espoused at this rally. Put the numbers on the table, do the comparisons of puppies sold today to puppies sold say 15 years ago, show us the increase or the decrease, and you might get more thinking breeders on side. Souff

"If the RSPCA are not out to get us...let them drop all charges against Judy Guard." Good call, Oakway! It was the Victorian law that was acted on. As I've posted, that law is a minefield and very different from any other state's 'take' on debarking. If this case occurred in Qld, it would not break any law. Here, debarking ops depend of the professional judgment of the treating vet. The Victorian law needs to be reformed. Especially on the point re debarking ops done in another state & in accord to its laws (as JG's were), being illegal in Victoria. Victorian law shouldn't dispute what is done in another state, legally according to that state's law. It's as silly as saying you shouldn't have your car fixed by a qualified mechanic in another state. And, if you do, you've just broken the law in your own state. Yes, and the RSPCA acted on that law. They surely knew that it was a minefield and has the potential to lead to a situation where a case could be thrown out by an intelligent judge, or don't they read about anything outside of Victoria? I think Oakway's suggestion is an excellent one and could go a long way to restoring confidence and mending fences. Souff

Pip, some people cannot properly look after 2 dogs. Others are excellent managers and carers of larger numbers of dogs, dependant on the time and money they have to lavish on their dogs. It is extremely unwise to base arguments on quantity. The focus must always be on QUALITY, not quantity. The NSW Govt got the mix pretty right with the Companion Animal Act. Numbers of dogs that you own are left up to the jurisdiction of councils and are dependant on how the owner behaves. If the complaints roll in about the owner and it is found that they have too many dogs for their circs, then the council can step in and act ..... and they do. A good animal person can keep larger numbers of dogs, IF THEY ARE DOING THE RIGHT THING b the dogs and by their community. It is what Australians used to call ... " A FAIR GO" and it has been working well since around 1995. Souff

Pam, where are these huge numbers of puppies? Who has the microchipping database? Put the numbers on the table and then some of these claims might be more believable. The advertisements for puppies in newspapers has almost disappeared over the last few years. I don't see pet shops overflowing with puppies and I don't see anywhere the numbers of puppies in rescue situations ..... certainly nothing like the numbers that we saw say 15 years ago. Puppy mills are disgusting places and I have no argument with all breeders being licensed and subject to regulations. I support that model. What I cannot support is emotive claims that cannot be backed up with facts and are claims that are likely to lead to politicians rushing through legislation that is designed to do nothing other than capture the "popular vote". We have seen this happen before and we dont want to see it happen again. Dogs deserve better than to be the pawns of politicians. Souff

"If the RSPCA are not out to get us...let them drop all charges against Judy Guard." Good call, Oakway!

Big statement. Prove it. Souff

ANKC breeders are dropping like flies already. There are 30,000 a year fewer ANKC pups born today than 30 years ago! Yet the number of dogs being born is escalating every year. Estimated at over 1 million dogs born a year, of which only 60,000 are ANKC dogs. ANKC breeders are already a tiny minority in the world of dog breeding. I think you are right, the only people who will breed dogs if things keep going the way they are now will be businesses. They will be highly regulated puppy mills that can afford to breed dogs under systems that make it difficult for those not cashed and lawyered up. If they would put up a bill that just banned pet shop sales (yes include internet and other forms of advertizing if that seem right) and do not add on anything else to the bill. It would pass. This would wipe out most puppy farms or at least take away much of their sales. At any rate, I remain optimistic. I am envisioning a future about 20 years from now. A secret underground network of (old fashion) dog breeders. They never sell their dogs. They breed very rarely, keeping the pup they want and place the others with trusted friends and other breed fanciers. Keeping a small gene pool going of selected lines of their breed going forward. When this happens, will you few remaining purebred dog owners let me know, I want in! LOL You and Oakway have pretty much said it for me, IJD. We are far closer to the situation you have described than many of the muddle headed wombats realise. Many of the MHWs have lost their climate change barrow and thinking people now know that the sky is not going to fall in because the weather is changing in much the same way that it did centuries ago. Looks like the carbon tax credits scheme is all washed up too. Many are nothing without a cause. So their focus now is to get rid of dog breeders who have more than a couple of dogs to their name. The wheel will turn full circle eventually but the bloodlines of a lot of good dogs will be lost to this country. The MHWs can hug their crossbred mutts and see Australian dogs become increasingly crossbred and deficient, because there simply wont be enough good quality breeding stock to go round. They will get their way in parliaments and the dogs, as a species, will suffer. Souff

Given he has them i dont think he was rubbishing them, more being honest about the fact that it is humans who bred them for our own purposes and that it has brought some problems for them. Loved seeing the working dogs work :D Same here. One of the most well balanced shows on dogs that I have seen in a long time. Yes, bad breeding copped a deserved kick, but there was not a designer dog or crossbred mutt in sight. Well done Martin Clunes, you showed people a lot about good dogs last night! Souff

Thanks for posting that Shortstep. Good people are being turned away from breeding good dogs. Good dogs need a future but thanks to the activists that future is in grave danger. The many mutts continue to be bred in backyards. None so blind as those that cannot see, somebody once said. Somebody also once said "You don't know what you have got until it's gone" and that sadly is the future of purebred dogs in this country. The "gone" will be here all too soon, thanks to governments and short sighted activists who just cannot see the long term damage they are doing. Souff

:D Eye for an eye. Glue his eyes shut! There is no other suitable punishment imho. Souff

I get that impression with the ones I have seen as well. I'm sure they could still feel good about themselves for having their dogs walking on a loose leash by their side, that in itself is a beautiful thing. It is extremely selfish. Not only does a good dog pay for 1 mistake with its life, but the person who hit the dog is affected badly too, and anyone who is unfortunate enough to witness such an accident. I don't care how much training a dog has had and how good their recall is supposed to be, they MUST be on leash when near roads. End of story. Souff

Now now, Poms only remove FINGERS!!! But there was one that latched on to a Queensland policeman as I recall, after the copper chased and tackled the vicious Pom, rugby style

Here we go again .... ban the sale of cats and dogs in pet shops ..... but leave them to be sold to the same impulse buyers at flea markets, car boot sales, farmers markets, etc .......

Ya mean ya don't psychoanalyse your puppy buyers? Never occurred to Souff NOT to do it .......... and if they don't return after their 4th session with Souff :D they've got theirs & Buckleys of ever getting a pup!

Um, I know several who are over 80 and they have to stoop to shake hands with the shorties

Steve, unless they come in smaller versions I can see that many people would need another car space to house the 2 bins that have the crank and the feeding tube. I am all for recycling poo into something useful and if it helps to bring down somebody's lighting bill then that is good, but the way house block sizes are shrinking I cant see this taking on in suburbia, other than in parks and at the grounds of the canine council, or in some of the larger dog shelters. Septic tanks, if they are kept functional, can work well and the run off can be used efficiently if the drainage is adequate. Souff

ASAL Yes, Great Danes and many other breeds, and it is a pity that some of the Cavvy bashers don't find something more useful to do Souff

Aaaaaah, the light of my life .... All done underground eh ..... hope that underground composter doesn't need any maintenance

My thoughts exactly. Why is anyone asking "which breed"? It is a dog, it has teeth, and it bit a child who probably should not have been anywhere near it. Another inconvenient truth for us all to remember. Souff

Souff probably needs a hit around the head or something, but I cant help thinking of all the other dog breeds out there (and many other animals for that matter) where it is a rarity to reach the age of 10. Sure, identify and minimise any problems that we can, but I think there should always be a reality check to see if we are not trying to push water uphill and trying to achieve something that even good old Mother Nature cannot achieve. Souff

I share your suspicions. Dog poisoners need to be caught quickly and all the dog owning neighbours of these people need to be on alert. The statement by the RSPCA Inspector is interesting though - I wasn't aware that children were now eating raw minced meat. Ugh! Souff

There is an issue of being "unwell" here ... but there are many many households where there is a similar scenario (minus the bodies of 2 dead dogs in the living room hopefully). Where? In many houses in towns and suburbs all over Australia. It has almost become an "acceptable neglect", that is, it is accepted as "normal" amongst the person's peers and family members because they never see things in any other condition. Home computers are a wonderful tool, but they are also part of the array of things that are wrecking the lives of some people. The saddest victims are the children because they spend their childhood in this filth and disarray and see it as normal. The term "generational welfare" is often bandied about. Sometimes it is "generational neglect". Souff

Unfortunately parents cannot be with children every moment of the day. And, ahem, as one of those kids, little Souff did almost everything I was told NOT to do by my long suffering parents! I would not be too sure that the professional dog handler had not told his kids about leaving the dog alone near food .... we simply dont know what education he had passed on to the kids and if the little girl chose to ignore it all on this occasion. He is now helping to educate other parents of the dangers. But if I were that little girl, I would feel very pleased to have a brother like Connor! Stick around, Connor, you might have the type of sister that needs you to get out of more scrapes! Souff

Ah Mita, their state of mind, or lack thereof, is probably a whole lot different to yours and mine Souff

Obviously a very much wuvved spider ... perhaps it was removed from the freezer every now and then for a little cuddle ... isnt it nice that the world is made up of all different people? Souff