Quickasyoucan

I cannot recall any attacks on people by APBTs in the ACT. Given that apparently they'll attack anything, I have no idea how this is the case. ;) That's what my memory was telling me and you do see a fair few red nose PB's (or crosses thereof) coming through DAS, so they are out there... maybe the ones in the ACT are just better educated ;)

Out of interest, because we are talking about Australia here, are there any Australian statistics re: dog attacks in non-BSL states/territories) (I believe NT, WA and ACT) vs BSL states and also what has been the effect on dog attacks in BSL states since the introduction of BSL ie pre- and post- statistics. I would be interested to know if anyone has ever done a comparison. This is not to take away from the horror of the attack and what that poor family is going through, my thoughts are with them today.

One thing I forgot (though how I could when I was born and lived there for 27 years) is how muddy the UK countryside is. Went back last January and it was wellington boots every day, rain or shine. If your parents don't want to do much grooming I would go the pointer or another short coated breed. Someone mentioned welsh springers, that is my dad's heart breed. We have had about 10 (including pups) over the years growing up in the UK. They very definitely require coat attention, feet trimming, burrs taken out between toes, we trim back the feathering on the chest, legs and feet, top of the neck and the ears. Otherwise they are mud collectors They are a lovely happy breed but I would not call their coats low maintenance... this is George in the UK in the flowers

I think PF said it all so well as usual. Whilst the focus is on the breed we never learn why these attacks took place and attacks keep happening. I would bet my last dollar that unless something is done about looking at why these attacks take place and throwing the book at irresponsible owners even if PB's were wiped off the face of Australia these types of attacks would still take place.

Genuine question, but do people think that a lot of the prong's image problem comes from the way it looks. I mean if we look at check chains (hanging in the aisle of the supermarket every time I do my shopping), they have a potential to strangle a dog if severely misused, not to mention that awful strangulated panting sound I remember from dogs on choke chains when I was young, can't have been good for the windpipe. But they look pretty innocuous and I haven't seen any campaigns out there to ban them. I bet a lot of people who think prongs are cruel have never seen one used just an image of the prongs on the inside of the collar, so I am wondering is it just because it looks a bit 'off', because like loads of other people I have tried it round my neck, my arm, my leg and I can tell you it sure doesn't hurt, or even pinch as much as a check chain tightened around your arm (wasn't game enough to put that round my neck LOL). So is it really a true "image" problem like the tough looking bloke with tatts we assume is dodgy or is it an actual useage or potential misuseage problem??

Animal Welfare League have legacy cats whose owners pay to have them loooked after for the rest of their life. Not sure about dogs tho.

Steve at K9 Pro also has distance learning packages for basic behavioural issues. I don't think an hour or so drive is a long way to set up good behaviours for the future? Not everything needs to be on your doorstep. And he gives heaps of follow up support. Besides Kurrajong is very pretty and the cafe there has good sweeties and coffee

Looking at surgery (and particularly post-op care) it often looks scary before you get it done. My boy had a TPLO for a cranial cruciate ligament tear last October. Not only did the op sound scary (and there are lots of horror stories on the internet so don't read the internet!) but the post op 8 weeks confined then build up exercise for 8 weeks on leash sounded like a lifetime. Actually once the stitches were out about 14 days post op it was pretty easy to handle and not nearly as bad as it sounds. My boy was pretty much back to 90% by the time he was given the all clear to be off lead and I reckon was back to as good as new by about 1 month after that. So just to say though it sounds daunting if you have a good specialist, orthopaedic issues don't have to be nightmare to deal with. BTW to the person who said their dog has an intermittent hind limb limp my boy had that on and off for about six months to a year and I mean really on and off (would have had an op earlier otherwise) ie great for months then bad for a couple of days and I think cruciate tears can be a bit like that.

If the lab pup was too full on I wouldn't get a stafford pup. They are great with kids and love them (and being dressed up ) but they are also pretty full on as pups. Also they suffer from the same image problems as rotties unfortunately in that some people will cross the road when they see you coming. Neither breed deserves it of course If it were me and I had 4 kids (perish the thought )I would get a cav or better still two!

Chris Brown has been mentioned on here before because he has also said some pretty out there things about breeding, cross-breeding, breeding your own pets etc. Not to mention how he treated his own dog by forcing it to learn to surf on Bondi Beach (where no dogs are allowed) and then watching it run off scared through a busy car park. I wouldn't think his opinions would be too far off those of Mr Burke.

I get pretty excited when I meet breeds I have seen on paper but that you don't come across very often. Recently I have met: a boston two portuguese water dogs a lakeland terrier a basset hound a couple of Irish terriers on different occasions a saluki a pembroke corgi (okay not that uncommon but not that common either) a soft coated wheaten a parti coloured poodle (the colour is unusual). an affenpinscher a miniature bull terrier I am often guilty of trying to strike up a conversation with the owners , but most people don't seem to mind chatting about their breeds if they own an unusual one.

"Savage" is such a wonderful emotive word loved by the media. Hey it could have been "multiple maulings by mutts" - hey presto alliteration... the media loves a good mauling story even when it isn't really a mauling. Sorry just being facetious

Of course the flip side of breed prejudice is assuming a breed is going to be "safe" just because it is a certain breed. Look at the outcry when Busta the GR (who is now owned by K9Pro) was in the news for allegedly biting several people. People couldn't believe a GR would do that. Yet, setting media hyperbole aside, on the assessment of a professional, that dog does have some resource guarding tendencies. I have met another GR owner whose dog did not like children by her own words and was in the process of being declared dangerous because she left it tied up outside a shop and it bit a child who came to pat it. Stupid owner in that case to set the dog up to fail and I am not singling out GR's, but simply mentioning that they are a breed that joe public assume will be friendly and it is not automatically the case. I have a friend with a very attractive looking bearded collie. When I was out with him and my stafford cross, people automatically gravitated towards the pretty fluffy dog. Yet that dog goes into active avoidance behaviour when approached by kids and its owners have to be on constant alert for random kids whose parents think it is okay just to let them run up and pat the puppy. We had welsh springers as a child, again attractive soft looking spaniels. Yet one of the pups we bred (interestingly to a stud dog who it turned out did not like children), would growl and stare every time she saw a toddler. Nothing ever happened with her, but we did have to be careful not to put her in situations where young children were around. I think the old adage never judge a book by its cover should be borne in mind by all of us...

My worst dog park experiences have been in situations where there have been two or more border collies. My boy (who is a stafford x) has been herded and rushed and growled at on more than one occasion. I am also more wary, and I recognise that, as we had a very bad tempered BC down the road when I was growing up and I was nipped and rushed at on more than one occasion. I know BC's are not all bad and have met some nice ones too, but you have to work to get over it. When I did a bitsa test on my boy the irony is though (and I know people say its rubbish but he definitely has some herding breed in him) he came back secondary BC, I think fate is trying to tell me to get over my prejudices!!! The only other breeds I find difficult in parks are the boisterous labs whose owners do nothing about their behaviour. But htat is probably more of an owner problem than a dog one. Funnily enough have never had a problem with another stafford, though I recognise like labs they do play too rough for many people's tastes. Apart from that I tend to take each dog as it comes. If you asked my dog he would tell you he doesn't like GSD's but that is because there is a HA and DA GSD down the road who has attacked him and threatened him on more than one occasion. He tends to tense up when he sees them but once he knows it is not THAT dog he will then ignore them...

I think it is the right decision and also good on you for realising you may not be able to meet the pups needs and being selfless enough to let him go. If you miss having a dog and you have the tim once your partner is away you could always look at volunteering to walk dogs at your local shelter or an organisation like the AWL. Just a thought if you want a doggy fix.

If grooming is not an issue what about a Bichon Frise? A friend's sister has just bought one and he has blended beautifully with my friends 2 small rescues (one of which is not that friendly to other dogs) and her aunts older rescue. They don't have to be totally boofy, depends on grooming and I would think the exercise requirements would suit.

Sunnyflower, first I wanted to say I am so very sad to read about Oscar, but I am sure he knows you love him and will do the right thing by him when his time comes. That is one of the greatest gifts we can give as a dog owner, unselfishly knowing when the time is right to let them have their wings. As regards timing of the dog, my fifty cents would be to wait until your baby arrives and see how things are going with being a mum. Children and dogs can be great together, but I have so many friends who thought a baby and a dog would be easy and things would not change for the dog when bub arrives. But they do. The reality is bub of course has to take priority and (I am not sure if this is your first) a first child in particular is going to keep your tired, constantly looking out for their welfare. If you are set on having both at the same time, Dee Lee's suggestion of an older dog is a good one. I know she had only good things to asy about Golden Retriever rescue, would you consider an older rescue who might have come from a family? With an older dog you would also have a more certain personality. There is a lady at my park who breeds goldens and reguarly brings 5+ beautiful dogs up there. Of them only one is what I would call a real snugglebum seeking out attention like a cav. One in particular is quite aloof. Obviously I don't know what they are like at home they might be quite different but I am sure that there can be variety in personality and with a small child you would want to make sure you had a dog that was able to deal with a toddler etc. Anyway that's just my fifty cents worth. We grew up with welsh springers, great dogs, but not like cavs. Can't think of another spaniel that is like a cav really. I love cavs will probably have one one day and they have a personality all of their own

Don't always rely on cops to know the law properly! There is NO law in NSW that says dogs must be restrained in a car. If I was pulled over for having my dog unrestrained in the back of my 4WD I would contest the fine and the onus would be on the police to show that I was not in effective control of the car. I struggle to see how they would do that. I called my 'friend' who used to to defend traffic matters in court. I had a cop pull me up for a breath test recently and she said to me after what a nice dog and he's even got his seatbelt on that's so cute (he was in a harness). I thought it was the law and said so to her, she looked bemused (and probably thought what a smart ar#se driver )

Oh really, can you keep us updated Wazzat - These guys have really caught my eye I just found this when I was looking at Lakelands, looks like they are here: http://www.vicoridge.com/cirnecci.cfm

This is off topic but I prefer male dogs too, less complicated On the subject of related dogs, we bred a litter of welsh springer spaniels about 25 years ago. We kept a bitch puppy from the litter, and two other puppies a bitch and a dog went to separate relatives. The mother of the litter, Sian, tolerated, Bronwen, her daughter for the eight years of Bronwen's life (she unfortunately died of mammary cancer). No serious spats but she was definitely happy on the rare occasions Bronwen wasn't around. When Bronwen passed away, Sian, who was by then about 10 got a new lease of life, it was like "thank god she has gone". Sian contined to nearly 15 and passed away of old age. Bronwen met her litter brothers and sisters semi-regularly and didn't like either of them past puppyhood, they had to be kept separate, but I suspect that was more to do with the infrequency of meetings than lack of sisterly love!

Poochmad has a couple of my choices there I have a list of "I loves, but in my dreams" ie I don't think I could do the intellect/exercise requirements justice, which are: Kelpie The vast majority of the HPR breeds Basenji Then there are the terriers (which are a possibility) Irish Staffordshire Airedale/welsh/lakeland. Finally I have a not so secret soft spot for Cavaliers, can't help it just love them and they are a distinct possibility for a next couple of dogs. However I also like the sound of lagottos but am not sure as I have heard mixed things about resource guarding issues. Need to do more research Oh and I forgot how much I love frenchies too! It really will depend on how much energy I think I have to offer my next breeds depending how quickly I feel old pretty much!

I don't know enough about this type of law to know whether they would have taken into consideration the role of other parties' negligence in the size of the award? Or can the court only deal with the role of the parties in front of them? Clearly the dog owner played a role in this, but he obviously has no money. Clearly the child's mother played a role in this, though no real mention is made of her currently and would doubt she has any money either. Don't like the chances of any of that award being used for any good given Mr Kuehne's long history of drug abuse, brushes with the law, unemployment etc as per the judgment. Regardless of this court decision, I still think both parents need to take responsibility for a 4 year old child regularly wandering the streets and on this occasion with a dead chicken.

Seems like a question of find the Defendant with money and sue, I see in the judgment it even notes that no action was brought against Mr Wilson. The argument by the council about the fact that Wilson was unlikely to have built any enclosures even had the dogs been declared dangerous is an interesting one. After all he had a history of non-compliance with anything. There is a certain mentality of finding someone else to blame.... Not to take away from the tragedy of the poor girl's death and by the sounds of it her life wasn't that rosy either

Our springer chased and caught our pet rabbit when I was young, horrific as it was the rabbit was unscathed and went on to live to old age. So yes gundog vs rabbit can leave them "unmunched".

I can see flood gates opening for lawsuits against councils. Wonder if contributory negligence was taken into account ie the allegations that the child was left unsupervised and often found wandering. I thought the law relating to pig dogs having to be kept in enclosures was post this poor child's death? Therefore why did the dogs need to be declared dangerous okay I see there there was prior history of unacted upon complaints.