Jaxx'sBuddy

just tested the link it works. people need to scroll down the page to get to the petitions

i agree. i love my kid but i dont care for other peoples kids I'm with both of you. What makes somebody elses children more important than your OWN dogs? Not everybody likes kids - especially other peoples! And (dogs or no dogs) not everybody enjoys having their privacy invaded by someone elses kids looking over the fence all day. I'd ask the neighbours to move the trampoline. Tell them your dog is very old, suffering from dementia and confused and upset by the kids. If that fails tell them you like to garden in the nick and dont feel it's in the kids best interests to be looking over your fence. yep thats what i think. i dont want kids looking over the fence at me whenever they like. i want my privacy.

I think you're right on the money. eta if you think about the average Joe who wants to buy a pup, they dont care about the standard - they just want to hear about the little fluffball who has a good temperament, a nice set of pearly whites, four legs and a tail. i agree, we need to showcase the pet buyers because they can show that pure bred puppies are great family dogs.

Well that begs the question - why arent the breeders out there for the breeders. How long do they have to wait before they work out that their CCs are not going to do it for them and do something ? I find this completely ironic. Not that long ago, there were a number of DOLers who wanted to do something for purebreds - promotions at shows, brochures, etc - and it died a death because the majority of breeders on this forum dismissed it as unnecessary. yes i get quite confused as there are a few double standards/mixed messages from breeders No. I see no point in breeders being keen to see a hastily organised 'promotion' of purebreed dogs to go ahead when many good breeders cannot currently fill demand for their pups. And it certainly wouldn't do anything positive to address this topic "How do we counteract the bad press for purebred dogs?" A tent full of people at the Royal show shows self interest, it doesn't counteract bad press. Yes. But who is 'we'? the we i am talking about are the key stakeholders, which includes but not limited to, breeders, peak bodies, pure bred pet owners

Ok if you think so. It makes no difference really, as you are going to get your wish and we will all see what happens. Maybe you see a future of perfectly healthy giant danes, all breed by great breeders following the magic breeding proticals (which will be set up to do away with all problems attributed to breeding to standards, extremes, show and purity). I hope you are right. People like you are not what the 'cause' needs. You choose to misinterpret what you wish because you only see your own point of view. I never said anything about perfectly healthy giant breeds - I'm not actually talking about my breed specifically I'm talking about all dogs. We have problems across all breeds - problems that can be addressed and worked towards however if we keep patting breeders on the back and saying there there it's ok, we won't ask you to be accountable nothing will get better. sas i agree, this "woe is me" attitude is not helping anything

i agree. i love my kid but i dont care for other peoples kids

i dont think so. they are ruining the peace and enjoyment of their neighbours which is really selfish. it is not necessary the trampoline can be moved to a more appropriate place.

so i still think education, marketing and strategy are required i think we need to be more business like

it is far from over steve there is much that can be done

You have more faith than me then. maybe not more faith but i have experienced some things being turned around in business by education, marketing, lobbying, development and cooperation

if we get back to the topic, i think pet owners would be more understanding of issues that arise if they knew breeders used all the modern tools at their disposal to ensure their new family pet had the best chance at a healthy life. there are no guarantees but there is best practise and if breeders adhere to those then puppy buyers i believe would be more understanding.

Yes. Exactly the same thing applies to many human conditions. There's far, far less than 100% knowledge about nature, prevention & cure of all conditions in humans. So why has this expectation grown up that it's somehow negligent & irresponsible that conditions occur in dogs, to which there is no current easy answer??? Except winging it with protocols that do the best in the circumstances. All the pedigree dogs exposed stuff, never addressed that. so just to be clear, what is the recommended protocol?

well i first call the council to see of there are any rules re what the issue is so o know what i can do if talking doesnt work

Sorry Mita, difficult to be specific sometimes. I know what you meant. However, my experience is that when people are told, they do not believe. I don't understand it. You and shortstep put up those links, or copy and paste - no one seems interested. Yet they fully believe PDE, guess it is the power of the TV. Yes purebreds do need promotion, and proper promotion on a regular basis. I'd like to think it might happen. Jaxxs Buddy, you may have found the truth "arrogant" - but the person Mita refers to is known on forums worldwide we are all on and I am not allowing someone to misquote what I said so that I appear dodgy when I am not, and leave it unchallenged. Fact is, no one knows what causes SM, no one knows how to breed away from it, all people are doing is the best they can according to the recommended protocol, not breeding A to A because that's the way to the end, as the forum member well knows. Jed I can assure you i do not find the truth arrogant, arrogance belongs to humans however, i am astounded that breeders seem to think they can do everything on their own without paying any attention to pet owners who buy their puppies. well in my experience people tend to need allies and the only way that happens is through mutual respect and understanding of each other opinions, whether we agree with them or not

The public doesn't get told. There's no coordinated public relations efforts on behalf of purebred dogs. It's skilled PR that's catapaulted rescue dogs into the public consciousness. You are correct. Problem is, when they ARE told, they don't believe it. Read what Shortstep wrote on SM in cavs. Excellent studies were presented to the forum, and the recommended protocol, which most breeders are using. Yet some on the forum were prepared to believe the opinion of a forum member in preference. Not a scientifically tested protocol, an OPINION by someone who is not a breeder, and which opinion will lead to the demise of these dogs - and is against the recommended protocol as well. Breeders who don't believe it will ever happen couldn't be bothered with promotion. Those (like me) who think it is all over red rover - and that is a hell of a lot of breeders - are winding down, as I said before. They will continue to wind down. i dont actually think thats what happened in that thread. the breeders became quite arrogant and sarcastic. just because we are not breeders doesnt mean we have zero grey matter between our ears. you will never get broad support until there is no us and them attitudes

Well that begs the question - why arent the breeders out there for the breeders. How long do they have to wait before they work out that their CCs are not going to do it for them and do something ? I find this completely ironic. Not that long ago, there were a number of DOLers who wanted to do something for purebreds - promotions at shows, brochures, etc - and it died a death because the majority of breeders on this forum dismissed it as unnecessary. yes i get quite confused as there are a few double standards/mixed messages from breeders

The public doesn't get told. There's no coordinated public relations efforts on behalf of purebred dogs. It's skilled PR that's catapaulted rescue dogs into the public consciousness. totally agree with this

lets not bother, i mean we are already defeated , now that's a cop out

i dont think it is all doom and gloom and if we think that way then we are defeated before we start.

no you have understood except the "crime" was not the debarking but the showing of a debarked dog I am amazed. Honestly I think that makes it even more absurd. If debarking is against the law in that state, or was done unlawfully in some way, then surely a fine would suffice. To the owner and maybe also to the vet who did it. But I don't see the point of seizing the dogs. And if showing the debarked dogs was against the rules of the Canine Council, how does that become a crime? Why would showing vs. not showing even be relevant from a legal/animal welfare standpoint? excellent and logical questions ZZ unfortunately there are no real logical answers

no you have understood except the "crime" was not the debarking but the showing of a debarked dog

i agree with the branding and marketing and to get this done professionally we need to aim for a wider audience eta we can learn from other..for instance i think the gap program has done really well in branding and marketing

Just interested were the parents tested for SM. Have been doing some reading and seems the Boston's get this disease too and they think the rate could be getting up there and that testing should be done. Don't forget the spinal deformaties related to the twisted tail, (had a friend with 2 bostons that has this problem, it was so sad) need to make sure the breeder has done spinal xrays on both parents and hopefully the grandparnts too not sure how early you can screen the pup for this. Of course none of screening the breeders do will stop them from being banned eventually, they are doing lot of research on pug faced breeds and just the deformed skull shape (did you se the study where the olfactory center has moved to a different place in the brain!) and the dwarfism will be enough to do them in. So make hay while you can! Yes we all have opinions about who the fools really are. yes bostons get this disease too which is why i was interested in breeders opinions. i suspect the parents weren't scanned for SM and yes there are a few nasties with spinal and skull deformities. i am active on a usa forum and there seems to be more info there on boston issues ss i agree anyone who loves the brachy breeds need to make hay on the olfactory centre, i am very interested on the plasticity of the human brain and there are amazing things that happen...for instance there is one woman who was born without the left side of her brain and she functions extremely well because the right side of her brain does both sides job. they have done mri's on people with brain injuries and found that the speech centres move to another area....it is fascinating stuff so i suspect dogs brain can change as well I hope your dog is OK, were you lucky and did not get one with a nastie from a bad breeder? It is great to speak to someone who holds the wish for purebred dogs that I now intend to support to the best of my ability. All good luck in bringing about the changes you think are needed in the breeding directives for Bostons in Australia. Just how many litters/pup a year are there in Australia? Any idea how many breeders will drop out of breeding if you can get the SM and other tests maditory by law? Have you done any reserch on how the decreased numbers will affect the breed in Australia prior to it getting banned for good? How many years do you give the breed before it is banned in Australia? mine seems ok for now, she is 3 years old and very healthy apart from some allergies to rye grass which i manage. good questions SS i will ask on the US forum and come back with the answers there are few well bred bostons in australia and there is a usually huge wait if people want one. if the numbers are decreased at all it will be the end of the breed here for pet owners i fear. i think the writing is on the wall with airlines refusing to carry them

Just interested were the parents tested for SM. Have been doing some reading and seems the Boston's get this disease too and they think the rate could be getting up there and that testing should be done. Don't forget the spinal deformaties related to the twisted tail, (had a friend with 2 bostons that has this problem, it was so sad) need to make sure the breeder has done spinal xrays on both parents and hopefully the grandparnts too not sure how early you can screen the pup for this. Of course none of screening the breeders do will stop them from being banned eventually, they are doing lot of research on pug faced breeds and just the deformed skull shape (did you se the study where the olfactory center has moved to a different place in the brain!) and the dwarfism will be enough to do them in. So make hay while you can! Yes we all have opinions about who the fools really are. yes bostons get this disease too which is why i was interested in breeders opinions. i suspect the parents weren't scanned for SM and yes there are a few nasties with spinal and skull deformities. i am active on a usa forum and there seems to be more info there on boston issues ss i agree anyone who loves the brachy breeds need to make hay on the olfactory centre, i am very interested on the plasticity of the human brain and there are amazing things that happen...for instance there is one woman who was born without the left side of her brain and she functions extremely well because the right side of her brain does both sides job. they have done mri's on people with brain injuries and found that the speech centres move to another area....it is fascinating stuff so i suspect dogs brain can change as well

Yes I agree with this I can remember some years ago having a conversation with the owner of a med/small breed about HD. I was doing a lot of work in this area in my dogs. The affected rate in my breed was about 1 in 8-10. I am proud to day that my rate is currently 1 in 40 in 4 generations. Anyway they were suggesting that that I only breed 0-0 dogs and a few other things which were not things I was doing. It then came to light that this persons breed had a higher affected rate than my breed however they did not do any screening. I never made a point about it. Not my breed not my dogs. This was their choice and I am sure that this person who felt it was not needed knew what was important in their breed. This was truly their ground not mine and I support their decision both privately and publically to decide what health tests to do on their dogs. I would hope for the same from others, but this no longer happens. As I said above, there will always be some breeders, maybe even most of the breeders in a breed, that do not do what you think they should be doing. So now what? Do we decide for them? I think the answer has already been made by the 'us', the 'public', even if it is not our breed, and even if we are not experts in genetics and even if we are in different country and even if we have respected the breeders for many years. It is no longer their decision, the decisions now belongs to the world. The best I can see happening is the decisions gets taken away from the world of public opinion and given to some experts. I do not think that the experts will decide that differently from what the breeders are doing in most cases. We shall see. However I hope that people do understand what they are asking for. There will not be any more pug faced breeds, no breeds with curly tails, no breeds that are dwarfs, the list goes on. As the old saying goes, 'Be vary careful what you wish for, you just might get it'. These things will be changed, they have made this very clear. So what brought about the change, I am tired of trying to prevent wishes from coming true. i hear you ss, i have a boston and if it was up to some people they wouldn't be around and i have just found the boston to be the dog of my dreams. i think some breeders will go their own foolish way and that will be bad for pure bred dogs because the public always remember the horror stories.