Wyn

We are going through this at the moment, bitches either not getting in pup or being scanned in pup but not having the litter. I know it isn't the stud dogs because other breeders are using them and getting good sized litters. I don't feed flaxseed oil, they are on a raw diet they do get coconut oil , went away from feeding them chicken as I was concerned about drug use in the growing of the chicken, but it has made no difference at all, very disheartening when others use your stud dogs and get lovely litters but we are not getting anything, even using an outside stud dog didn't work. I would be very interested in hearing more about Aloe juice as well.

Google nasal parakeratosis, this is an hereditary problem, seen in Labradors and husky breeds, The nose get dry and cracked around the top and almost raw looking where they can lick it, there is no known cure or treatment, but vitiumn E cream or oil or petroleum jelly does help alot and you will notice the difference. It is inherited but just how they don't know, I have one with it, yet his mother,sister,father, half brothers and sister ( same mother) in fact all reletives I can think of are not affected at all and his didn't show any sign's of a problem until he was at least 9 months old. I have never seen any thing like it. Hopefully I have attached a photo, not of my dog but of one I found on the internet.

Just to clarify - I didnt say that I wouldnt pay more than $1500, simply stated that the hightest I have paid has been $1500. I also am aware of at least 4 breeders in NSW cashing in on the chocolate's. Which are prices of $2500+ I think if you are in NSW and are breeding I would be more concerned about the silver and silver factored ( carry silver apparently) dogs that have gone to NSW from New Zealand. $2500 is a pretty normal price for a show quality puppy of any colour with health guarentee's of course. When it comes down to it you would be paying around $11,000 to $12,000 for an import with no gaurentee's, thats purchase price and freight, would I pay $2500, don't know, it would be on a case by case basis I think.

Ok first up, if it was me, he would be going back and refund would be asked for, nicely at first but be prepared to take it to court. 17 is too high although for a stud dog, particully if you expect to stand him at public stud, no one will use him, but also of a concern is is the 1 /1 elbows, while this is breedable according to breeders it is not something I would want to be looking at in a stud dog, it means that at the age of 1 year old there are signs of changes in the elbow joints. Now the dog will never have problems with a 1/1 elbow score but I as a breeder would be very unlikely to use a stud dog with the hip and elbow score of your boy.I do tell all puppy buyers that all parents are score and original paperwork is here for them to view and they get a copy when the pup is taken home, but I also tell them that there are no guarentee's, as genetics can come back and bite on the butt when least expected, having said that of course I would work out something with that buyer if there was a problem, however if I had bred your boy and was selling him for alot of money I would have done some pre lim x-rays before sale, just how much money are we talking about, because as some one has said they wouldn't pay more than $1500 for a puppy, ( I know yours was older) but $1500 is quite cheap. I also agree that it is extreamly irresponsible of the breeder to say it doen't matter as you are only going to breed pets, well it will matter if you breed pets that then have problems and you have to start refunding and paying for surgeries on the "pet" puppies, there aren't that many breeders in NSW that I am aware of that are breeding chocolates and then selling them for obsene amounts of money in fact I only know of one. Send the dog back

Quite expensive actually, just found an account from 2009 10 matings went and it cost $1100 au for shipping, this DID not include the NZ MAF fees so it was close to $1500 I think, much cheaper if you are not in a hurry and can wait until there are a couple of people wanting send semen.

My Specialist Veterinary Ophthalomologist tells me it isn't inherited, can happen in any breed, may disappear as the dog gets older but isn't a problem if it doesn't. No breeding restrictions as far as he is concerned.

Isn't it great when you get good scores, always a nervous wait,just had 2 (labradors) done both came back with 1/1 hips and 0/0 elbows both PRA and EIC clear, VERY happy

Ring Maree at Veterinary Associates in Takanini Auckland 09 2998250 website http://www.netvet.co.nz/ They are really good and very easy to deal with

Try this web site http://www.blueknightlabs.com/content/view/167/143/

Absolutely !!!! If a litter comes along and runs smoothly, one tends to be looking over a shoulder waiting for the ogre to appear - is this really happening? Even with this occurring, a minimum of $1,000 would be a conservative estimate of the costs involved. The focus is generally on the mother and her puppies costs, but one forgets to allow for the fact that all adult dogs, youngsters coming up, baby puppies that have been kept, all need ongoing feeding, care, innoculations, housing and on and on. And, if we received payment for our time and stress (yes, it's very stressful, at every stage) - well we probably would make a bit of money. Anyone who believes that breeders are pricing their puppies too high and are 'in it for the money' can't seriously be breeding is all I can say. One occassionally has a little extra to spend and the first priority is always something you've been wanting to get for the dogs - not the household or yourself - the dogs. The long-term breeders are really those that enjoy what they're doing. Have a litter of 9 3 week old Labradors on the ground costs Semen from the UK $4000 stud fee $1800 Implant $800 C- section cause $840 one big boy got VERY stuck puppy food at $143 per 20 kilo bag X 5 bags $715 Vacinations and Microchips @ $75 per pup $675 oh goodness this is depressing, I need a drink, and then people tell me I must make lots of money, and I agree, if there is anything spare it is always spent on the dogs.

Aren't you lucky that you now have them in Australia, (NOT) They are Wei X Lab and to continue the colour they have to do VERY close matings , father/ daughter brother /sister mother/ son, and as such they get dodgy temperments, and some major health problems, the unfortunite thing is that these "breeders" and I use that term very loosly comit fraud when they register them, as they register the silvers as chocolates, and the kennel clubs say there is nothing they can do about it, more likely they are more concerned about missing out on some revenue.

Yes, I could not stand not being able to let my dogs run free. Did you take any "Aussie" dogs back with you

Ha ha, this is why I will be staying in New Zealand, no creepy crawlys yuck

Awww...lovely bubs. Are they all black? No 3 black and 5 chocolate although the sire is a dominant choc I expected a yellow too and much to my surprise there was only 1 chocolate that I think is yuk in colour the others have chocolate pads, nose and a dark coat. All are going to lovely family homes and I am running on a black bitch. If the father is dominant chocolate then there is no way you would have got a yellow, in fact if you had there would have been a miss mating, some of my darkest chocolates have come from a yellow chocolate mating. As for feeding, I just tend to let the puppies tell me when they want food, they get unsettled and not happy if they are underfed, my week old babies ( 9 Labs) are doing so well on their mother it is unlikely I will supplement them anytime soon, unless of course their mother for some reason decides she has had enough, I just soften puppy food, we used to be able to get a puppy mash which was fantastic but they no longer make it such a shame !! Good luck with your babies.

Thanks all, I was quoted by another company $1,300 - I wasn't sure about it - to me I felt it was a little expensive? but then this is a first for me and that did include everything. I have sourced out approved vets in my area as listed on the AQIS and are happy to do that myself and anything else if that will keep the pricing down for the lady - will jetpets or dogtainer be happy with that?? And be prepared to pay GST on the cost of the pup and the cost of shipping when you try to get it from customs. You can tell them it is a pet until you are blue in the face won't make much difference. Although it does seem to be a matter of who you are as to whether or not you get charged, or even how much, so make sure you have a receipt from Jet pets that doesn't include vet charges, cause customs just see the total amount and charge on that. Hello Wyn, Is that for NZ pick up - or Australia? I know we were to expect to pay the GST when we picked up Edward our NZ boy - but lucky enough they appeared to have forgotten LOL! This pup is heading to NZ, cost of sending him etc will be up to the lady - I am just trying to make it easier on her pocket at the end of the day, so doing as much research into it - NZ have a higher GST don't they? 15% I think I heard? They will have to pay GST on the pups entry to New Zealand. Australia is much easier, I have sent a number of dogs/pups over there and all anyone has paid is a $77 au inspection fee.

Thanks all, I was quoted by another company $1,300 - I wasn't sure about it - to me I felt it was a little expensive? but then this is a first for me and that did include everything. I have sourced out approved vets in my area as listed on the AQIS and are happy to do that myself and anything else if that will keep the pricing down for the lady - will jetpets or dogtainer be happy with that?? And be prepared to pay GST on the cost of the pup and the cost of shipping when you try to get it from customs. You can tell them it is a pet until you are blue in the face won't make much difference. Although it does seem to be a matter of who you are as to whether or not you get charged, or even how much, so make sure you have a receipt from Jet pets that doesn't include vet charges, cause customs just see the total amount and charge on that.

Do you still have the list of shippers in Sweden, we have a pup to come in later in the year, the only pet shipper I can find is Scandi pet I would like to compare a few more, Scandi pet is based in Stockholm and the puppy is quite some distence from there, so would like to try and find one a little closer to the pup.

Thanks for the replies, I have already been in touch with Debbie and she has sent me their prices which seem resonable, but don't seem to include any of the vet work but I could be reading that all wrong. I will e-mail her back and find out. I imported a Bloodhound pup from Sweden this year using jetpets & their agents Scandipets. The vet fees were not included...I paid my breeder to get all the necessary blood tests etc done. The breeder also had the Cert A completed for me, as this also was an additional cost if you want Scandipets to do it. Hope that helps!! Yes I was hoping to get the breeder to do the vet work as it is very expensive to get Scandipets to do it, just out of interest, what was the all up cost, I have imported from the UK before and as a rule the total cost including the price of the pup was around $9000/ $10,000. But have no idea what to expect from Sweden.

Thanks for the replies, I have already been in touch with Debbie and she has sent me their prices which seem resonable, but don't seem to include any of the vet work but I could be reading that all wrong. I will e-mail her back and find out.

I am thinking of bringing a puppy in from Sweden later in the year but I am having trouble finding a shipping agent in that country. I have found one called "Scandipet" does anyone know of any others, Thanks

Hi, Anything around 60% is excellent. You won't find many semen post thaw past a mobility of 60%. Gee I just checked out my boys report and it has Post thaw 65% (conservative)

And in fact it has long since been thought that the appearence of Bolo spots suggested that the litter was a "typey" litter, or in other words true to type, and I would have to say so far that has, for the most part been correct.

Good luck with that one, if you find a cure please let me know, I hav a 4 year old that is like that, we have already spent lots of money getting stones cut out of his stomach. he has chewed so many stones he has worn his teeth down quite abit, I try now to replace the stones/rocks with a rubber ball.

Not speaking for Sylvia, but she typed 60% carrier, which should mathematically translate to 8% affected, but the latest figures showa higher total in Australia. Sylvia's numbers: (700 affected +2595 carriers) /6959 total =47% affected or carriers . . . but 40% or 60%, the point is the gene is widespread and the decision to breed it out will mean dropping a lot of dogs from the gene pool. Hells bells - serves me right for quoting from memory. I have found the email (dated Sep 1) with the Aus numbers in it: 98 tested 51 carriers 52% 23 affected 24% 24 clear 24% BUT - remember these are really skewed as there has been an influx of presumed DNA affecteds (ie dogs that have collapsed) and their relatives and also it is a really small sample. The figures from U Minn are much closer to the mark. Yes, SG I have seen dogs collapse with EIC. I had a bitch collapse several times in the mid nineties; try as I might I couldn't get to the bottom of what was going on. I sent blood to Susan Taylor for the original research, however was told my bitch can't have had EIC as they were working with US field trial lines and my bitch's pedigree was so far removed from those as to be of no use. Rather unscientific I thought, but there you go. Having been cleared from all known genetic issues at the time, that bitch had three litters; there has been no report of collapsing dogs amongst her offspring, however her daughter came back DNA affected (as of course did she). They are boarding with me at the moment - the collapsing bitch turns 15 next January. We now know what her issue was, however I concur with SG and BlackDog's concerns re making rash decisions based on the EIC DNA test. For me, PRA is almost a non issue now - yes, there are still a few carriers around and I would certainly use them if I thought they were the best choice, assuming the partner was clear. In fact I have a carrier bitch (daughter of my Master Mariner son Pete, who was a carrier) who I'm waiting to mate next season. She's also an EIC carrier, which is making life interesting Sylvia Well I will throw a spanner into the works, personally I think we are getting too far from what some of the really nasty problems in Labradors are, epylipsy(sp) being the top of my list. I own 2 imported chocolates from the UK both are EIC clear, I have just tested a 10 week old dog pup from a Frozen semen litter (UK) I was testing him for colour PRA etc so got EIC done as well, he came back clear as well as did his litter brother. My dogs hunt, really rough shooting to boot, they run all day, no one as yet has collasped. The only reason I tested them as 1) their DNA was already in Australia and 2) a litter by one of them had 2 carriers in that litter, I guess if he is clear then it come from their mother. I might consider testing other dogs (stud) if a bitch owner requested it, but at this point in time I think it is all a bunch of cobblers, and just another test for someone to make money on. I don't know about other Labrador breeders whom have had Labradors for years and years, but I don't see a rash of collapsing everywhere and didn't years ago either, Interesting that Master Mariner was a Carrier, I have Master Mariner in all my pedigrees and as yet not problems or they have been tested clear, does anyone really know the mode in inheritence. OOPs , me bad, you haven't said Master Mariner was a carrier, but I did hear that some where, not that it would make any difference, every dog has to be judged on its merits and what that dog can bring to your kennels.

Not speaking for Sylvia, but she typed 60% carrier, which should mathematically translate to 8% affected, but the latest figures showa higher total in Australia. Sylvia's numbers: (700 affected +2595 carriers) /6959 total =47% affected or carriers . . . but 40% or 60%, the point is the gene is widespread and the decision to breed it out will mean dropping a lot of dogs from the gene pool. Hells bells - serves me right for quoting from memory. I have found the email (dated Sep 1) with the Aus numbers in it: 98 tested 51 carriers 52% 23 affected 24% 24 clear 24% BUT - remember these are really skewed as there has been an influx of presumed DNA affecteds (ie dogs that have collapsed) and their relatives and also it is a really small sample. The figures from U Minn are much closer to the mark. Yes, SG I have seen dogs collapse with EIC. I had a bitch collapse several times in the mid nineties; try as I might I couldn't get to the bottom of what was going on. I sent blood to Susan Taylor for the original research, however was told my bitch can't have had EIC as they were working with US field trial lines and my bitch's pedigree was so far removed from those as to be of no use. Rather unscientific I thought, but there you go. Having been cleared from all known genetic issues at the time, that bitch had three litters; there has been no report of collapsing dogs amongst her offspring, however her daughter came back DNA affected (as of course did she). They are boarding with me at the moment - the collapsing bitch turns 15 next January. We now know what her issue was, however I concur with SG and BlackDog's concerns re making rash decisions based on the EIC DNA test. For me, PRA is almost a non issue now - yes, there are still a few carriers around and I would certainly use them if I thought they were the best choice, assuming the partner was clear. In fact I have a carrier bitch (daughter of my Master Mariner son Pete, who was a carrier) who I'm waiting to mate next season. She's also an EIC carrier, which is making life interesting Sylvia Well I will throw a spanner into the works, personally I think we are getting too far from what some of the really nasty problems in Labradors are, epylipsy(sp) being the top of my list. I own 2 imported chocolates from the UK both are EIC clear, I have just tested a 10 week old dog pup from a Frozen semen litter (UK) I was testing him for colour PRA etc so got EIC done as well, he came back clear as well as did his litter brother. My dogs hunt, really rough shooting to boot, they run all day, no one as yet has collasped. The only reason I tested them as 1) their DNA was already in Australia and 2) a litter by one of them had 2 carriers in that litter, I guess if he is clear then it come from their mother. I might consider testing other dogs (stud) if a bitch owner requested it, but at this point in time I think it is all a bunch of cobblers, and just another test for someone to make money on. I don't know about other Labrador breeders whom have had Labradors for years and years, but I don't see a rash of collapsing everywhere and didn't years ago either, Interesting that Master Mariner was a Carrier, I have Master Mariner in all my pedigrees and as yet not problems or they have been tested clear, does anyone really know the mode in inheritence.