TNT

A couple of 'experts' use the calm and assertive theory- especially after a separation. We tried it with our two- and the response was amazing and almost instantaneous. Our dogs became a lot calmer and a lot more responsive.

Thanks for that! The instructors just thought the dogs didnt get along- but they seem to be fine in certain circumstances. I admit my guard was down last time as they had been fine for a couple of weeks when looking directly at each other- so wasnt prepared. The second time it happened I turned my dog away from the other one and got her to drop and look at me- which seemed to work. Another trainer suggested I carry a squirt bottle and squirt my dog when she does this. But when it only happens say once a month. Besides- any water squirted is instant play time with my pup.

I figured this might be the best place to post this- and I would really appreciate opinions on what is the cause of the issue with my pup! She is a 10 month old ACD (posible X) and has been doing VERY well at obedience. We have one issue- and it only happens every now and then. She is quite a confident dog and will happily say hello to anyone- dog or human. In most cases she will take the submissive position when meeting a dog- by this I mean she will either drop and crawl on her tummy towards the dog- occasionally rolling over. There has only been a handful of dogs that she has taken the dominant stand on- but she hasnt had any issues. An angry kelpie even got away from its owner the other week and while both dogs were scared and hackles raised- after about 10 secs they were sniffing each other, hackles down. This is where my problem starts. For the past 2 months - almost 3- we have been in the same class as a very timid border collie. I noticed the issue almost straight away so approached the owner of the dog at training to see if they could meet, to get used to each other. This was fine- no issues- they will walk next to each other and work next to each other. They will even sit across from each other looking at each other without a problem. They have also done off lead down stays next to each other without a problem. The problem seems to arise when the bc lays down when we are relaxing between exercises. The bc seems to stare my pup out- everything is calm- then all of a sudden my pup will jump up, hackles raised and start barking! This has only happened once when active in class- but the bc stepped on my dogs tail in that situation. Its quite startling becasue it seems to happen out of the blue and my dog isnt usually a barker- or instigater. The only thing I can think of is that something is making my dog feel threatened.... but I dont know why its this one dog! I know its hard without seeing of knowing the dogs- but does anyone have any insight as to why it is happening? Is my pup feeling threatened? and why is it the one dog- who is timid, normally lying down with ears down and back???

I was told that 1) Cattle dogs are hard to train and 2) that you'l never get anywhere if you dont continually praise and loudly. Well after 5 months of training the instructors at my club have learnt two things 1) you can train a cattle dog and 2) some dogs just get way too over excited if you constantly stimulate them with praise! You never learn anything if you dont listen to people though- take what any instructor says into consideration. If your not afraid of hard work I dont see any reason why being desexed or not will cause an issue- I've seen undesexed dogs trial and they dont seem to have an issue.

perhaps this is why with working breeds their is now the concept of a 'working line' and the conformation lines basically? I'm not into showing yet- but have a strong interest in breeding from a genetices perspective and also livestock. In a lot of breeds and even species it seems that what is marked for in the ring doesnt necessarily conform with what is needed from the animal in a comercial or work sense. My personal opinion is that the conformation standards that are used in the showring is just like a rule book for an obeience trial. If you can breed or own a dog that meets the rules- then you have a 'show dog'. Almost like a Miss Universe thing- they couldnt have a plus-size lady winning the swimsuit competion now could they? Even though as a human being their is nothing stopping them from functioning- it just wouldnt happen!

Just wondering if perhaps your poodle was bitten by a green ant??? I realise I may be totally off track here- but saw two dogs limping- with one leg up off the ground- both due to green ant bites. Regardless, I hope your dog is okay.

we have a big cement area too- which is where the pups are kept when we go out. Daily poo patrol is a must- and we clean the area with a kennel cleaner product from the pet shop. I hose the area and then scrub the stuff into the cement with a broom.

how do we find these so called 'balanced trainers' ? so far, Ive only ever heard about them on here!

Lyn- I think ACV is Apple cider vinegar!

I wish the thread had been started about 2 weeks ago! My ACD developed hot spots either side of her neck due to the new pup grabbing and hanging off- rough play really. Its cleared up after a shave, visit to the vet and less playing! atleast I know what to do next time now!

Hi everyone- just wanted to know of people's experience with different clubs in the areas mentioned in the topic title. If you do both obedience and agility, is this with the same club, or a different club?? So I basically just want opinions as to which club you go to and why you like it- and what the club's main focus is?? Love the club im at now- but they dont do agility :D if you dont feel comfortable about posting, feel free to send me a PM!

Hi there- on cessnock training clubs flyer there is a contact for show enquiries- so that might be an idea. They take dogs from 12 weeks for obedience training.

if anyone is interested- google liver cake- alot of links come up!

mine love chunkers- near the dog food rolls at the supermarket. liver cake/bread sounds interesting!

Hi all, was just wondering if anyone had some contact information or knows of someone or somewhere that does herding training in either the lower hunter/newcastle/ central coast area? or even when the herding training is one on the weekends at erskine park? other than that- can anyone reccommend any good books about herding or training for herding? would really like to see if either of my dogs or I could cut it..or give it a go atleast! btw- have a 9 month old cattle x kelpie and a 3 month old cattle dog- have some livestock i could practice on- but have no idea where to start!

I would think it was a BC natural instinct to want to herd the ducks- my cattlex kelpie tries to herd the pigeons in the backyard- but they wont be in it!

Have fun!- and have faith! I was a steward in the novice ring for a trial recently with one competitor who was so nervous and full of doubt as it was her first time in the novice ring. I was talking to her before she went in and said-" dont worry- good dogs have a bad days and bad dogs have good days" well, wouldnt ya know it? she managed to get a pass- just- but it was still a pass! I'm nowhere near trialling stage yet- but hope I can get there one day!

If it is close to the cetre of the belly- it may just be a hernia from the umbilical cord- our pup had one and (on a cattle dog x) was probably the size of a pea. If you're worried but- take her to the vet- or atleast ring up if you're really that concerned. If it doesnt seem to be affecting her too much, its probably nothing- but better to be safe than sorry.

i'd never be able to use the squirt bottle with my two! they'd just try to catch the water!

Being new to dog ownership and dog training- its not only confusing but very interesting to see all the different view points and theory's on the establishment of the pack. I'm currently reading a few different books which discuss the pack etc- and I'm still confused where I stand, or infact where my two dogs stand in relation to each other. I think it all is a wonderful learning process. I also think that what works for one person, may not work for another- and the same with dogs. But its great to see so many people in the know sharing their wisdom...

Hi all... When I got my first pup, I didnt think about crate training as I didnt feel that it was necessary. I now have a 9 month old and 3 month old ACD and I think that crate training may be beneficial. I've had no trouble toilet training either pup really- although- they havent really been toilet trained as such- but they do know that they have to go outside to the toilet and we have very few accidents. The reason I'm considering crate training now, is that I think that maybe the two pups might like to have their own 'place' to sleep and eat.The 3 month old is happy to stay in a doggy bed all night- but the 9 month old will go to sleep on a mat- but ends up on the bed. We have a 4wd that has a cage in it and both pups will go in their quite willingly. They will snuggle together to sleep sometimes- but I think that they would really appreciate being able to have time out from each other. Dinner time is a bit chaotic as the pups will go from one bowl to another- sometimes with snarls, sometimes not. Feeding them either side of a door is not an option- as both refuse to eat unless the other is near. Just wondering what thoughts people had as to how well the pups at that age will adjust to being in the crate? and is it worth the money of buying the crates?

Our two cattle dog pups are having their puppy vaccinations- and will be doing obedience etc so will probably do what is necessary to comply with club/competion- if it gets to that... On the other hand- My dad has a very healthy and happy 14 yr old maltese- who has only ever had his puppy vaccinations. Like anything with a scientific or ethical debate involved- there will always be two distinct sides. Its always good to have alternatives to consider.... Personally- I think it should be a personal choice made after consideration of the facts on both sides. There is always the chance of an unvaccinated dog never getting ill- just as much as there is the risk of an immunised dog getting sick from, or getting the condition immunised against- it happens in us humans too!

Maybe try teaching the dog using 'sign' language- like they do with deaf dogs- If it works for a dog that cant hear it should work for a person that cant talk! Just an idea of something to try...

thanks- Ive seen an example of clicker training in action- but my OH was intially worried that we would have to take food everywhere with us- on the other hand- I think that the fact that they are high energy pups it might work better to maintain focus. The check chain does work- but I think being an ACD the whole forcing into position thing just really doesnt work that well- these dogs are meant to fight back- and I think this my be an issue with the 3 month old as even with the other pup he wont back down. The club I currently go to will not allow food on the ground anywhere whilst training- and the other club wont allow check chains. might have to look a bit further for a club...

thanks for the quick replies...I wouldnt leave a check chain on a dog for agility- too many risks! just concerned that my dogs may get confused if we do obedience training with a check and then agility/flyball etc with food...most clubs seem to be all for one way of the other...most clubs around here you choose the method by which club you use and its hard to make that choice when you dont know enough to see what method works best!