jesomil

Well, i have been waiting for one of the "guru's" to answer but they havent just yet so i will throw in my observation be it right or wrong. I think you are not being a good, strong leader and i would be working on leadership with them both. They should not be fighting and especially not fighting in front of you. They dont sound like they have enough respect for you. I would also not try to identify heirarchy because it changes alot and i doubt that we mere humans could pick up all the little signs. My dogs are all treated equal, they are all bottom of the pack in my eyes and they know it and are secure in it. Fighting is completely unacceptable at all times so i think you should get the help of a professional who can work with you.

I also had a chat with the melbourne franchisee a few years back after seeing him do a demo. He had just finished his short training course to become a fully qualified dog trainer!!!! He showed little understanding of dog training methods and little understanding of the methods he was teaching. He also announced that the dog i had with me (an afghan) could only be taught a basic level of obedience and would never have a reliable recall .

I think group training is great for your average pet owner who wants to learn manners but for trialling and to preserve drive in a dog, one on one is best.

This is one thing that really makes me cringe. I hate seeing overweight dogs doing sports, it is so unhealthy. But it is a problem with how to approach the subject as people get very defensive about their dogs. I think it is up to whoever is running the sport to take the person aside and mention it. I like to have the last rib or two showing on my adult Kelpies. They are not thin, just lean and fit.

This has been my exact experience. Well said.

That makes sense. I have read that wild dogs dont often eat stomach contents but they will if they are desperate for food. Yes, that would be the best way to feed but a bit hard dragging home whole beasts to feed them . I wonder, in the wild, what the dog who eats first eats. I mean, do they go for the organs or muscle meat? Wouldnt the dogs lower down in the pack have to survive on whatever the other dogs left? Very interesting. I would love to learn more.

Hi, I have been doing alot of research into raw food diets but am a bit confused. Some people feed only bones, meat and organs and some people do the Billinghurst style food with veges as well. Some people say dogs only very rarely eat stomach contents some people say that they eat stomach contents regularly. I am very familiar with the BARF style diet with veges but wonder what others think about diets giving them very little, if any veges. Anyone here do this? Thanks.

Great post Amhailte Makes perfect sense.

I know i am quoting myself here , but maybe i made too big a call on that one. I have a friend who had a not so good experience with a vet behaviourist so that is more where i am coming from. I have never seen a problem that cannot be helped by a very good, experienced trainer/behaviourist so i would see no need for the vet side. Just my thoughts . Edited cause i cant spell either.

I would purely go to someone because of their experience and ability to train and help dogs with problems regardless of what qualifications they have or what courses they may have done. Some of the best have no qualifications at all!! I think the practical learning is so much more important and would avoid a vet behaviourist completely.

Congrats on the baby to be. Exciting times ahead :rolleyes: . I had a baby just over a year ago and was able to get back into training and trialling when she was 6 months old. For the first month my dogs were basically neglected by me as i was too tired to do anything but after that everything started getting into a routine and settled down. I now have the dogs as my "time out" and husband looks after baby so i can still do my dog stuff. I find it really good to get out with the dogs so i can feel normal again and gives my baby brain a work out . Just so long as your dog is fit and healthy and still keen to participate,you can take as long as you want to settle into motherhood before getting back into training. Congratulations!!! How very exciting for you !!

I currently use the JerHigh treats. They say that they are made with real chicken. They are in thin strips and are soft so easy to chop up small. I have used cabana chopped up but i dont like all the fat and spices. Sometimes i will buy a small pack of kitten bikkies. They are tiny and the dogs love them. I generally make up a mixed jar and grab a handful when needed. It curently has in it dried liver, cat biscuits and JerHigh all chopped into tiny pieces. Luckily my dogs are all very food motivated so i can get by with just using dry treats.

;) Well you cant say that and not tell the story :rolleyes: ;) My exact thoughts. Now we are left to wander exectly what your OH got up to with an e collar .

Thats because other things became more interesting to him. You should be the most exciting thing when training and only train for short periods like 15 - 20 mins at a burst because he is a pup. You may need to involve more toys or food into training to get him keen. Use whatever he loves most. If his attention is wandering, chances are you are not being very much fun. He still needs brain exercise. You can run and swim a Kelpie all day and they wont be tired....well maybe a little . If his brain is tired, he will be far less likely to get into trouble. Kelpies really need that brain work, especially when they are an active teenager. I wouldnt recommend you get stock unless they can be securely fenced away from the dogs and you get lessons on how to introduce and teach your dog to work. If you let him loose on stock, he would probably chase and scatter them and have a whole heap of fun doing it. I would think him a little young to be having those kind of thoughts, but you never know . Glad he is being good now. Leadership is the most important aspect of his training. Dont worry, teenagerhood doesnt last forever .

Totally agree. Walking a young Kelpie will not tire him out at all. Free running is great but they also need to have their brain tired by work of some sort. You will probably find that you could run him for an hour and he will not be at all tired. Work him for an hour and he will be exhausted. At this age he will naturally try and test you but you must always win and spend time traning him. He will settle down eventually.

I think you have just hit the naughty teenager phase . Its a bit hard for anyone to say if you should give him the snip or not. It probably wont change his naughtiness. Desexing has so many pros and cons and it also depends on what you are planning on doing with the dog in the future, and what sort of a set up you have to stop him wandering etc. I remember the teenage stage well :cool: My boy was a naughty monster who forgot all his training and was hard to live with. He then went through the hormonal phase where he was trying to exert his maleness . My husband threatened to snip him many times. At 2, he has gone through all that and is back to being an easy to have around, good dog. So i guess, the decision is up to you and your preferences.

I agree with what Amhailte says. I think the owner has so much to do with whether the dog can get trained. If we were all natural, fantastic dog trainers there would be many less problems around. ETA I was editing to quote something great that Erny said but then it disappeared as she edited it out of her post . It was very confusing for a minute!!

Sounds like alot of fun. Just out of interest, how could they get injured doing it? My dog does it most days down at the park. Here is a pic at our local river. Sorry its a bit dark.

Ok, i am no Kelpie expert but i would think that white feet could suggest a hint of Border Collie. I have never seen a pure working Kelpie with white feet. The odd working Kelpie has a thin strip of white on its chest but that is all. But then again, these dogs are not bred for looks but workability only so who knows. One of my well bred Kelpies has white on its chest and the other well bred one has big floppy ears Our beautiful foster boy who has unknown parentage has perfect ears and markings and has to be one of the best looking Kelpies i have seen. He has fantastic instinct and workability to boot. But as i said before, they are not bred for their looks :p . By the way, should we move this discussion to the Kelpie page. I think it is on about page 5 in the breed sub forum . No one wants to talk Kelpies .

I think Cesar is great !! I like most of what he has to say. I recently got the whole first series on DVD. Good stuff!!

That is my wonderful Terra in the pic. Thats pretty good seeing the white on his chest in that tiny photo . Yes, he does have a strip of white on his chest. He is not the best looking Kelpie in the world but he is a brilliant worker and thats what its all about . He is all Kelpie from many generations back but that white has still snuck in somewhere .

There is something strangely addictive about herding. Getting to work with those amazing instincts and the thrill of when you both click is amazing. When my dog did his first real job, i was on cloud nine. I was so excited and annoyed my husband for hours going over and over every detail . It was one of the biggest dog sport thrills i have ever had. I couldnt think of anything else for days . There is something about herding................. Glad you are having so much fun!!

Well done

I think it is fantastic for pups. It helps with toilet training and also a great place to put a pup to sleep. You can use the wire type or the more enclosed airline type. The previous description sounds like alot of work..... I basically put the pup in with its dinner and it learns pretty quick that it is its place of confinement. As it gets older, you can leave the door open and it goes in there for sleep. My adults never get crated anymore but it is handy that they know how to be for when we go away, or in season, or illness etc etc.

What is the difference between Schutzund and IPO? Does that mean that dogs cannot get Sch titles in Australia? I have recently learnt a little about this type of training and was able to watch a trial not long ago. Many years ago i thought schutzund training basically meant that a dog was trained to attack. I have since learned that the protection phase is a character test to test their confidence and ability under pressure etc. They only ever bite the sleeve, so they are not attacking a person at all. Just biting a sleeve. It is a shame that so few dog people know anything about this type of training. I still have tonnes to learn but i think it is a great sport that requires alot of dedication and should have alot more recognition.