anthony mazzeri

Spice is looking vastly improved, Kadbury. You're doing a really good job with her.

Thanks Kadbury, that's okay. Keep in mind though that it would probably work better as a preventative to keep the nerves in good condition compared to as a cure after the nerves have already degenerated. Much easier to keep nerves in healthy condition than trying to rebuild damaged ones. I only started giving my dog this B12 after his legs had already started degenerating (as I mentioned, when he was already struggling and after the vet and specialist told me there was nothing I could do to help him) and so always wondered what would have been if I had just been giving him maybe one a day from the very beginning like a daily vitamin pill. Whether his legs would have stayed fine all along through to the end. If it had worked that way, it would also have ended up a lot cheaper than the amount I ended up giving him every day - an ounce of prevention as they say. PS. The warning sign to watch for the beginning of her legs starting to go is when you see her standing up straight but her hindquarters appear to drop slightly, as if someone's pushing her rump down but she's resisting it.

Ouch. That's four times as much as the US site @ USD$32 for 60. That's AU$35 for 60. I've found it's always much cheaper to buy most things from America, even including shipping. I signed up for their membership to get the discount rate (you get a monthly magazine full of ads for all their other products) because I bought so much of them it made it cheaper @ $24 for 60. And even cheaper in bulk as I'd buy them in lots of 10 @ $17.25 for 60. How many bottles did you buy? I was giving my wei 4 x twice a day, which I upped to 6 x twice a day. Your Sammy would be much smaller so I'd recommend at least 2 x twice a day, better more. So if you bought just the one bottle, those 30 lozenges will only be about a week's worth. Don't give up on her. I'd like to help. My dog passed away eight months ago just after I ordered a new lot so I still have 8 unopened bottles of 60 x 5mg. I was planning to just use them myself (the use-by date is January next year) but I think they would be put to better use with your Sammy. I'd like to split the offer to 4 to Kadbury and 4 to yourself if you don't mind. 4 bottles is still two months worth for Sammy @ 4 a day (2 twice a day), although she sounds like her nerve atrophy is at an advanced stage so I'd use them all up @ 8/day (4 twice a day) for a month for maximum hope of repair. It depends if Kadbury thinks Spice's legs need help at this stage as Sammy sounds more in need. Let me know if you're interested, PM me your address and I'll mail them off to you tomorrow (you'd probably get them Monday).

Thanks for that!! Much easier than getting it shipped over from the USA. The other ones were lozenges aswell so it shouldn't be too much of a problem. Even though it's a US website, they actually ship from Fiji of all places, not America. I assume because the US company is owned by an Indian-born doctor who probably has Indian contacts in Fiji (Indian as in Bombay, not American-Indian). It's not actually made in America as there is currently only one manufacturer in the whole world (in Germany, if I recall), so it'd likely be the same lozenge wherever you buy it. PS. That link's not working for me. It says it can't find the server.

Sounds like she's getting good care, Kadbury. My guy used to go over 30 every now and then and I had to give extra insulin even though I used an electronic scale to measure out exactly the same amount of food (Hill's Seniors due to the lower fats etc) for each meal every day and no other snacks at all in order to keep everything as stable as possible. But still, there'd be big spikes or dips for no apparent reason, so from my experience perfect 100% stability is virtually impossible and you have to always be ready to deal with any potential rollercoaster ups and downs. As I mentioned before, you're trying to get her weight up (as opposed to my guy where I had to get his weight down), so you're going to have spikes as her diet increases and you have to increase the insulin to match. Once her weight stabilises at the ideal level and you can start giving her the exact same amount of food every day to maintain that weight, then her sugar and insulin needs should (in theory) also be a lot more stable too.

4.3 is actually a near perfect reading very close to the normal level in non-diabetic dogs. I'd say just let her enjoy the low levels while she can as that is when she will be feeling most normal. You really only need to resort to the honey or glucose as an emergency option if it keeps going down and she actually goes hypoglycemic by hitting zero and going into the trembles. When it's at 4.3 she's still not in the panic zone yet, so if you want to raise her levels you can just give her a bit of food (I used to just give a slice of vegemite toast) to build the sugars back up slowly as she digests it, rather than the rapid rise from honey/glucose. Baifra, the price seems to have gone up from $2,500/eye four years ago. I would have thought it would have gone down as it becomes a more common procedure. Still not cheap! PS. Interesting how the google ads on this thread are relevant to the topic of diabetes.

You did the right thing as she was hyperglycemic. The shaking symptom is actually similar to the opposite extreme of hypoglycemic, so the meter is very helpful! I would advise whenever you get an extreme reading that you're not expecting to repeat the test before giving extra insulin just in case the meter is in error which sometimes happens. Especially if she looks otherwise okay. But in this case she was shaking so the reading matched the symptoms and you did well. Sooner or later, you're also going to get the opposite situation where her levels may drop to zero, so it's good to have some glucose powder on hand in an emergency. Just the standard drink powder from the supermarket and keep it where you can get to it quickly. If it happens, just rub the powder into her gums and mouth, or add a spoonful to water and let her drink it if she's able to. Sounds like you know what you're doing and she's going to be okay and do well. I used to aim for 6 to 12, with 14 to 18 as the maximum level, which is usually before the meal/insulin. Basically keep it below 20 at all times if you can. You'll never be able to get perfect stability of the same levels day to day (at least I never did), so it's always going to be a balancing act from my experience. Damn, I just read the rescue thread for this dog. I can't believe a dog with muscular control issues and cataracts wasn't immediately ringing loud 'diabetes' bells in the vet's ears at first sight and test for it immediately. I see she already has cataracts, so unfortunately she will lose her sight totally as they cloud over 100% and probably much sooner rather than later. Whatever sight she has now will be like looking at vague shapes through a thick cloud of smoke. When total sight loss occurs, cataract surgery is not cheap as I mentioned before but it's possible to have just one eye operated on to give her good vision in the one eye, which is better than no eyes at all. She was in a really bad way, so you've been doing really well and should be congratulated. Keep up the good work, she looks a wonderful dog!

I have, exactly the same as in your pic. It was actually from rubbing his nose against the side of a bucket every time he drank from it. The inside of some plastic buckets are actually rough enough to do that, like very fine sandpaper. The vet also gave me a human antibacterial cream called Bactroban, which made it 20 times worse as the skin reacted badly to it and broke into an open wound. And the more Bactroban I applied to the 'infection' the worse and bigger it got. It didn't begin to heal until I stopped using it when I worked out it was the cream itself causing all the damage. Don't ever use Bactroban on a dog is all I can advise from my experience of it. Never. Don't even think about it. Good for humans for small cuts etc, but there's just something in it which caused my dog's skin to react really badly to it like a petrol burn.

Spice is looking like she's liking her new home very much. Well done to you for taking her on and good luck with her! Unfortunately all the B12 on your link appears to be the basic cyanocobalamin Vitamin B12. Even if it's injected directly, the liver still has to convert it to methylcobalamin, which is what fixes the nerves. If I recall the literature correctly, the liver can only convert about 5% of cyanocobalamin into methylcobalamin. So it still couldn't produce enough of it every day anyway even if you overdosed with standard vitamin B12. Whereas the tablets (lozenges actually) I linked to are pure methylcobalamin, already in its usable form so the liver doesn't have to do anything and it goes straight to fixing the nerves in the adequate amounts required. Just remember when shopping that the label has to actually say methyl-cobalamin and not cyano-cobalamin, which is just standard vitamin B12 you can buy in any chemist and won't make much difference. Good luck with it Baifra. Please let me know how it goes with Sammy.

I think I can help you with Sammy's leg condition. When my pup's rear legs started to go, I took him to a neuro specialist who basically said the longer nerves in the lower spine and rear legs (and throat too, hence the bark gets huskier) deteriorate with diabetes and there was nothing I could do. Said something about arthritis too if I recall. I didn't want to hear that, and didn't believe it, so when we walked (my dog staggering) out her door, I decided to see if there was anything I could do. And there was. That web forum I linked to pointed me in the right direction. To something diabetic cat owners were trying actually. They had learned researchers were trialling the use of methyl cobalamin in Japan to treat long-nerve loss in humans with diabetes and the results were promising. Methyl cobalamin is actually Methyl B12. Vitamin B12 in its purest form which they've only just recently developed. It's the actual form of B12 in the nervous system which repairs damaged nerve cells, and normally the liver can't convert enough of it from standard vitamin tablets to make any difference. So this new form goes straight into the bloodstream and straight to work so it's like a hundred vitamin B12 tablets at once. It wasn't available in Australia at the time when he was diagnosed at age 11 four years ago (about the same as Sammy), so I ordered these from the USA. My pup passed away last year from heart failure at age 14 and a half (older than even his non-diabetic relatives) so I stopped buying them and can't tell you if they're available in Australia now or not. Probably cheaper from America anyway, especially in quantity. And it worked. My pup went from staggering and unstable to walking almost normally again within a couple of months (it takes time for the cells to regenerate in enough numbers before you start seeing results). The vet was impressed enough to ask for details of the research I found and kept telling me I should take my pup back to the neurospecialist to show her the difference so she could recommend it for other dogs. It's not a miracle cure though. The process of nerve deterioration is continuous so it's basically holding back the dam wall, rather than curing it. Just like insulin actually. So you have to keep giving a few of them every day.

Good luck Kadbury. The wobblies is just from too much blood sugar, hence her drinking to dilute it with more water in her bloodstream. Once the insulin starts working and you keep her levels around 14-16 or less at their peak, she'll be less wobbly and less thirsty and will come good as you've just seen this morning. Baifra, I've read that cataracts depend on the individual dog. Some never get them, some get them within weeks (like mine did). The larger the breed too, the more chance of getting them, so it's more likely Hope will eventually get them too. The speed at which mine got them even took my vet by surprise, so it may not be something Kadbury's vet has told her to expect. I think one of the negatives about diabetes, which is the loss of nerve sensation in the extremities, is actually a benefit when it comes to lancets and needles - they don't feel them as much as they normally would! Interesting that Sammy's taking human insulin. I was always told dogs couldn't do that, which is why they developed Caninsulin. Does it work just as well? And yes, worth every cent!

I couldn't get my dog stabilised properly until I started doing the blood testing myself every day. The weekly blood tests at the vets were just too far apart so they actually delayed the proper daily stabilisation. I agree. It's the best way too keep the levels stable. Two smaller meals a day and two smaller injections means the daily swing is half as much as just one big meal and one injection. I also tested twice a day (before meals) with the Accu-chek glucose meter and adjusted the injections accordingly in order to maintain his sugar levels between 4 and 14 (you get the hang of it after a while). Also good to keep track and adjust the insulin as the dog's age, metabolism and body mass changes over time etc, or even if their appetite changes from one day to the next (which is likely to happen as this White Shepherd improves over time, or goes off her food for a day). It also helps to confirm if the dog is ever hypoglycemic and needs a quick feed of glucose whenever you think they may be acting strangely. Urine strips are nowhere near as accurate as a blood monitor, but are important to monitor levels of ketones in the urine/bloodstream. Ketones are the real killers with diabetes. Watch the ketones. You want them as low as possible or non-existant if the diabetes is caught early enough. Here's an online forum for owners of diabetic dogs: caninediabetes They use the American sugar level numbering system though, which is different to ours. With ours, an acceptable human blood glucose range is 5 to 7, depending on what you've just eaten or done. I believe a dog's normal sugar level is lower than ours at 3 to 5. PS. The best place to use the lancet to draw a drop of blood is the top lip, with the lancet set to the minimum depth required to get just a tiny drop of blood. Basically as least pain as possible if you're going to do it every day! There's no need to go deeper and get more than a tiny drop of blood to touch the test strip to. PPS. When this dog eventually goes blind with cataracts, her sight can be restored with an operation to remove the clouded lenses and replace them with artificial lenses, just like they do with humans. It's not cheap though. PPPS. A diabetic dog is an expensive dog. Caninsulin, test strips, more regular vet visits...

That's true. There's no guarantee a human butcher doesn't use it as regular reports on current affairs TV shows prove. One butchers I saw on TV actually had two 4 litre bottles of it underneath the front counter! Because it's to stop meat turning brown before being sold, the best bet is to buy from a very busy butcher shop where they sell all their meat and mince quickly and have to regularly replace it. Shops where the business is very slow and the same meat sits there all day are the ones most tempted to use it. The busy shops simply don't need to. Some info from the CSIRO:

My now 6 month old Cocker Spaniel puppy only sort of pecked at the Royal Canin Junior and so was a bit too thin for my liking. So I switched him to Dick Van Patten's Natural Balance at 12 weeks and he wolfed it down and bulked up wonderfully. But at 4 months he simply stopped eating it one day and looked at it as if it was just cardboard, so I switched back to Royal Canin Junior again. I put a bowl of each down and he eats the RC and ignores the NB. Even if the RC bowl is empty, he'll look at it when he's hungry and ignore the full NB bowl right next to it - the perfect scenario for a pet food commercial! So I'm assuming either as he matured maybe his tastes/needs changed and he now much prefers the Royal Canin (maybe like with humans a lot of stuff tastes yuck to a kid but they prefer it as an adult). Or I got too big a bag of NB and it's simply gone stale before he got through it all. Lots of natural ingredients so that may make more sense. The RC bags are a lot smaller so I go through them quicker so they're constantly fresher. .

I'm not sure if dogs can act as carriers. I can tell you from my own experience, you will know full well when a dog has toxoplasmosis. They get extremely sick straight away and it gets worse as the days pass. I believe a cat on the other hand can carry it and pass it on without showing any symptoms, so there is always a continual risk.

My Weimaraner contracted toxoplasmosis when he was about 7 years old. The vet had no clue what it was, so sent me to the neuro specialist who had no clue either and thought it might be a brain tumour. After an extremely frightening and harrowing week a simple blood test diagnosed toxo, and antibiotics fixed it immediately. I take the whole episode as a signal it's not common enough amongst dogs for vets or even specialists to recognise the symptoms when they see them. The only raw food he ate was marrow bones from the butcher shop. My guess as to the source was most likely feral cat droppings as stray cats had visited our yard and likely used it as a restroom on their wandering journeys. A single infected tom cat can travel a great distance and through many yards. It may explain two different dogs getting it if they are within a few kilometres of each other. PS. Toxoplasmosis is just Latin for 'blood poisoning'. It's a bacterial infection. Single cell parasites.

That's good to hear. That's quicker than recommended and confirms what I've found myself that switching up to or between premium foods quickly does not actually cause the runs. I'm firmly (excuse the pun) coming to the belief that if a dog is on a lower quality food, there is absolutely no reason to mix the poorer food with the premium food over seven days when changing over.

From wikipedia: Royal Canin has seven factories - two in France and one each in Brazil, Argentina, South Africa, Russia and Missouri USA. The USA one was using the tainted gluten from China.

I'm thinking if he chewed on the cable that comes out of the transformer/adaptor like most computer stuff has, he'd have been zapped by a much lower voltage of around 12V. Feels like a bee sting, but he'd be fine otherwise. If he chewed on the cable that actually goes into the wall socket, it would've stung a heck of a lot more! Luckily we have AC alternating current which allows you to break free between the electrical pulses, as opposed to DC direct current which freezes you in place like in the movies. Max won't be chewing on any cables again any time soon I think! Glad he's okay.

I'm curious to know if you did the switch straight away or found some Eukanuba to do a gradual change?

And what isn't Nestle in the supermarket is Masterfoods (a subsidiary of Mars Inc), who bought out Royal Canin in 2002. In terms of parent companies, does having a 'food' parent company like Nestle or Mars seem better than 'non-food' companies like Colgate-Palmolive (Hill's Science Diet) or Proctor & Gamble (Iams)? If you saw some packets of human biscuits on the supermarket shelf and one was from Nestle and the other from Colgate-Palmolive, which would you prefer to eat yourself? Which company would be more into researching artificial chemicals and additives rather than researching natural ingredients, a chemical company like Proctor&Gamble who makes detergents or a food company like Nestle? Being big multinationals they're probably identical, but psychologically the food company gets the benefit of the doubt. Here's a picture of some of P&G's products - in amongst all the toothpaste, batteries, pain relievers and washing liquids you can see two food products - a packet of Pringles chips and a packet of IAMs dog food: So food is not their major focus, they are very diversified. But then again, does it really make a difference if the company making your dog's food also makes drain cleaner? I'd be interested to hear peoples' opinions. PS. Who owns Arnotts now? Did the takeover actually make any difference to the biscuits to how they were before? Personally, I just don't think they taste as good. Or maybe I'm just getting old and my own taste is changing and the biscuits are still exactly the same. Or maybe it's just psychological...

From my very short experience with my new Cocker pup, I just haven't seen that issue. When I got him, I started him immediately on Royal Canin (from the breeder's Pedigree PAL) and had no problems. Then when he got bored with the RC and stopped eating it after two months, I switched him over to Natural Balance straight away and again no problems. I literally just put two bowls down and let him choose which one to eat - he ate the NB and left the RC. Then when he got bored with NB in another month or so, I did the same thing again and he reversed back to RC overnight. So basically he's been switched overnight three times in just three months with no issues at all, no diarrhea or anything. Nice firm stools all the way. I think the quality of the food has a lot to do with that though. So I'm guessing if I went from RC or NB to something cheap like Chum he'd get serious diarrhea, but not the other way around. Switching from a cheaper to a decent, or between two decent quality foods shouldn't be as much of an issue because I just haven't seen that "change over slowly or the dog will get diarrhea" thing. It simply hasn't happened in my case.

A very interesting thread as I've always wondered myself why special 'dog shampoos'! From Poodlefan's provided link: A few thoughts of my own to add if I may - 7.0 is neutral pH, so I read that as both humans and dogs skins are 'acidic'. Only the very uppermost of the dogs range can be considered 'neutral to a tad alkaline'. So from these quoted figures, it's a matter of humans just being more acidic than dogs, with some crossover between the two. Then again, being a serious aquarium hobbyist, I'm wondering now about the water itself? The water coming out of your tap varies in pH from area to area depending on the carbonate hardness levels of the water. My own tap water pH is 6.6 for instance, which is slightly acidic. So according to all the arguments about dogs needing alkaline shampoo - simply rinsing my dog in plain water from the tap/shower would be bad for his skin! But shampoo is all about the hair, isn't it? Alkaline shampoos raise the hairs' cuticles, which makes the hair look dull and lifeless on both man and beast, which is not a good look. So the only thing I suspect to really avoid regarding dogs' skin is shampooing with special 'neutralising' or 'low-pH' shampoos. A quality human 'pH-balanced' shampoo (which means it contains a buffering agent to keep it slightly less than neutral pH 7.0 as it binds with the more alkaline dirt and grime) sounds like it should be perfect for dogs, and make the hair look shinier, softer and healthier. I'm sounding like an advert now! PS. Baby shampoo is made more alkaline simply to avoid stinging if it gets into the baby's eyes. It's a marketing thing, eg, the 'no more tears' thing, not a scientific thing to do with skin or hair or anything. The same way they add foaming agents to shampoo to make it foam like soap. Detergent doesn't actually foam, and nobody bought it for that reason when they first introduced it. No science, just marketing - what can we do to it so we can sell it?

You can always use a pair on the back feet. The one on his good foot won't get worn out as much on the front of it as it will on the bad foot dragging, so it'll stay in good condition anyway. Good luck. I hope Ralph likes them!

I can personally highly recommend the GripTrex from Ruff Wear available from Pet Wares Plus Australia. They're soft and flexible like a human athletic shoe so fit comfortably, but the rubber grip sole (no slipping, even in the wet) is very strong and also keeps the foot flat (no knuckling) despite the boots being light enough to not bother the dog. The front rubber toe guard extension of the sole especially is what you'll be needing if your dog is dragging its foot and scraping its nails on concrete or paving etc. Not cheap though.