Steve

No way would I breed a dog which had this.

No matter where you buy a dog from you need to be very clear about what it is you are hoping to gain from your breeding program and once you do that the answer to your question will be clear. There's been a lot of talk on genetic diversity and widening gene pools etc and there is no doubt these are important things to consider.If you go looking for a dog which is the best you can find and you have confidence that its healthy and well tempered if its related is a minor consideration.If your main goal is to widen the gene pool and you go after the best dog you can which isnt related then thats the main thing you go looking for.If you can get the best dog which isnt closely related thats a bonus. But only you can answer what is going to most important to you or your dogs into the future.If you breed a linebred bitch you can buy semon from anywhere so you need to work out what you want in your foundation. So identify what you want most then look at what you are not prepared to compromise on to get that and that will tell you what you need to go shopping for.

http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2010/01...?site=riverland The South Australian Environment and Conservation Minister, Jay Weatherill, has asked for a review of the RSPCA's role in prosecuting animal welfare cases. Five prominent south-east graziers had about 100 counts of animal cruelty against them dropped last week, after it was revealed the RSPCA was unable to tender any evidence to the courts because of an error made by a staff member. Mr Weatherill says he has ordered a report on the RSPCA's handling of the prosecution case. He says the RSPCA generally has a long history of successfully prosecuting cases of animal cruelty, but says a review is still needed. Some SA independent legislative councillors and the Greens have called for the RSPCA's powers to be handed over to the police.

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/news/breaking-...x-1225823920905 A DEBATE has erupted between the RSPCA and Police Association over a policeman's decision to shoot an injured kangaroo. An image filed by Preston Leader photographer Adam Elwood shows a police cocking the trigger and pointing his revolver at an injured kangaroo in a Melbourne street. The big kangaroo was hit by a car and severely injured before struggling on to tram tracks in Plenty Rd, Bundoora. Police phoned for an animal ranger to assess the kangaroo and its badly broken leg, but there was no one available. The sergeant raised his .38 revolver and shot the kangaroo. A police spokesman said the kangaroo was unpredictable and might have injured somebody or limped back on to the major road and caused a collision. Start of sidebar. Skip to end of sidebar. End of sidebar. Return to start of sidebar. Dr Hugh Wirth of the RSPCA told the Herald Sun it was inhumane to kill the kangaroo in more than one shot and the animal should have been assessed before being euthanised. "Two shots can’t be humane,” Dr Wirth said. “One shot yes. One shot has to be put into the base of the brain so that it knocks out all the vital centres in one go. “If you don’t know where the vital centres are in the base of the brain of the kangaroo, you don’t shoot it.” But the actions were defended by the Police Association and hierarchy. "An experienced sergeant humanely disposed of the roo with two shots," the police spokesman said. Police Association secretary Sen Sgt Greg Davies said country police officers were often required to put down injured wildlife. "It’s not common in urban areas, but police quite regularly in country areas have to put down injured animals of all makes and models and kangaroos are not exempt,’’ he said. "I would have put down 20 animals in my time, perhaps more. "City people think kangaroos are like Skippy, but they can actually be quite vicious animals.’’ Read more about the policeman who shot the kangaroo at the Herald Sun

Raw meat as in meat without bone ? Mince, bones? How old is he? What cereal? Are you cooking the vegies?

We have a new puppy and he has a BM about six times a day. Is this typical on BARF? This is our first puppy although we have had an adult dog before. Is there a link on DOL to more info on BARF. My concerns with this diet for us is getting the balance and all the nutrients right. Puppies poo more than adult dogs.What are you feeding him?

Aloe Vera juice for both male and female.Every amino acid and stacks of vitamins and minerals. Angelson if adding thyroid drugs does this - do you think this is an indication that the thyroid is under active or that there is a lack of iodine in the diet? What drug specifically do you use?

My youngest son told me he was never going to get married.When I asked him why not he said. "Because if thats what happens and you get stuck like that for so long being pulled around by your doodle Im not going to do it. ;) "

What breed are they?

Quote- Clouding the issue further, some syrinxes have spontaneously regressed end quote That should be telling them something too.

It all depends on which food and how long its fed for. You already know if you have Macdonalds once or twice a week you remain healthy assuming the rest of your diet is balanced. But if you changed from a good diet to nothing else but big macs every single meal every single day you would expect over a short period of time to develop health issues.If your kids eat a balanced diet the odd junk food is no big deal etc. Some scientists are telling us we should only feed cheap commercial because a good diet hides the show of genetic issues.As a Mum I think if I allowed my kids to eat food which had no enzymes, no live vitamins but minerals which need vitamins to assimilate and throw in some pesticides to prevent fleas,a chemical which would bubble away in their bloodstream to prevent heartworm,and vaccinate them yearly when they dont need it I would expect to see problems and I dont think that would be evidence that I carried bad genes. In other words that theory is that no matter what - a dog shouldnt develop any symptoms. Studies with HD show that if you feed a dog considered suseptible to HD raw food rather than commercial you can keep the HD at bay in 60 % of dogs more than you can if you feed commercial. So some scientists are saying we shouldnt do that because it masks the genetics - but really recent studies are showing we can alter DNA by diet. You know if you eat the wrong diet you will be more suseptible to heart diseases, cancer etc. From a science view if you put in the nutrients needed to feed the joints properly the joint will remain healthy feed foods which dont have all thats needed the joint doesnt function.Yes some dogs which eat commercial foods dont get HD but we dont know what their Mum ate and bunch of other stuff which might also impact on that. Way back about 60 years ago a guy called Pottinger did a big study on cats and that showed that many things we consider to be genetic are in fact nutritional and they can be passed down from Mum, Grandmum etc to the babies. On the whole that theory went to sleep for a half a century but now there are new sciences which are backing up what he said. So its kind of like what came first the genetic predisposition or the diet. Dogs havent evolved to eat commercial dog foods.Their digestive tracts are different to ours and they are only born with a certain amount of enzymes to live on so if they dont get live enzymes in their food they have to use up what they have in supply and when that runs out they cant break down their foods and they cant convert certain nutrients to others.For example They dont need vitamin C because their system produces vitamin C by using others assumed to be in their foods -if thats not there you expect to see problems.If you try to head that off and add vitamin C that means other enzymes have to be there to convert it to a usable form. Its simple feed your dog a varied balanced diet. If you have to feed a commercial food then add to it live enzymes such as Thrive D and some multivitamins and pro-biotics.Live enzymes ,vitamins and pro biotics CANT live in commercial dog food no matter what it says on the bag and no matter when they are added because heat and storage kill them off .The plastic most are packed in also leeches into the foods and becomes a cancer causing agent too. Dont only feed one brand of commercial for long periods of time no matter where you buy it or what quality you think it is. Before Commercial everyone fed table scraps and raw food - it was all we had.

The MDBA has both working kelpie people and show kelpie people in our membership.

Selective breeding is how most of them came about, NOT cross breeding. This is a misconception most people have. Purebreds did not start out being different breeds that were crossed with each other to make different purebreds. They started out as purebreds who were selectively bred to set desirable traits which were then carried on down the generations. Here is the origin of one of today's purebreds (From the GR Club of America website): Golden Retriever: Dudley Marjoribanks, (later known as Lord Tweedmouth) mated a yellow Wavy-Coated retriever with a Tweed Water Spaniel (a breed now extinct) between 1868-1871. This resulted in several yellow pups that became the foundation for a distinctive line of yellow retrievers. Descendants of this mating were combined with wavy and flat-coated retrievers, another Tweed Water Spaniel, and a red setter. The breed was officially recognized by The Kennel Club in 1911 as "Retriever- Yellow or Golden" and finally, "Retriever- Golden" in 1920. To me, this definitely sounds like cross breeding, not just selective breeding within a breed. Of course that started with cross breeding but thats not where it ended. They used those pups as a foundation and selected only those which fitted what they were aiming over generations of puppies until they got something that bred consistently the same look, characteristics and temperament.

You still have to be able to present your goals and convince the committee that you have everything covered and while you are developing your lines back to purebred breed you simply put your kittens or puppies out with different papers. There would only be a role for total mutts if they were cleared for what ever it was you were breeding against. A total mutt could have many more hidden recessives than another purebred which would show up in your future generations. Years ago I bred ragdoll cats and some said the gene pool was too small and they wanted some new colours so they got approval to introduce other breeds of cats into their expermental breeding programs. Within a few generations things such as cardio myopathy and immunE related issues began to show up where they never existed for 20 or so generations prior to that.

The criteria for having a new breed accepted and recognised by the ANKC is clearly spelt out on the ANKC web site. However, if people want to develop a breed and never have it accepted onto the ANKC registry thats their right too. Many of the other registries are much harder than the CCs have ever been.

Being anti BYB doesnt mean I am O.K. with the welfare of dogs being over looked by some knee jerk reaction to a perceived pet over population which doesnt exist or that Im O.K. with denying people their basic rights or in favour of breed specific legislation. I certainly dont condone a government making decisions which does nothing more than line the pockets of a non government organisation or promotes their product over and above any others.

So they can still breed cross bred dogs or unregistered dogs.By the way even a registered breeder can breed cross bred dogs as long as they dont use their papered dogs to do it. Lets be honest about this - all this does is increase income for VicDogs. It gives Vicdogs an unfair market advantage, it discrimminates between one resident based on where they buy their dog and who bred it and any other and it denies the right of Australians to enjoy their basic National property rights conferred on us by our constitution. It assumes every person who is a CC registered breeder is the antz pantz - what a joke- and that everyone else are morons not capable of deciding on whats best for their animals. If you want to put a monetary value on breeding dogs it also allows someone who is a Vic Dogs member to make money off breeding dogs and prevents someone who is not a member form doing the same. Its called National trade laws which take precedence over any state or local law.

Of course there are the same options available for dog breeders. Its all clearly written up and anyone who want to develop a new breed recognised by the ANKC has a list of things they have to do to get there. That takes about 15 years so while they are working toward that they have to have their own registry to keep the records in order so people know the lineage and ancestors. The ANKC have opened their stud books and would consider it again tomorrow if the people asking had a good reason and specific plan to explain what they are intending to achieve.Right now there is one with - I think - bull terriers. Thats still not the point.If you make state or local laws which are different depending on the type or breed of dog or whether its recognised by one purebred registry thats BSL.

No debate from me I agree with you. Julie

Dont most purebred breeders select for temperament as part of what they do?

There is a small thing here which bothers me. I dont understand why dog owners and breeders would be so keen to give up their rights. You see purebred dogs and registered breeders are the minority group and far more people think we muck it up more than we think they muck it up. Don Burke told people that cross breeding made for healthier dogs and that is perpetuated by media,much of the scientific community and those who want to breed and or own cross bred dogs.RSPCA Australia have plugged ANY breeder of any dog which fits their "breeder" criteria. Just because we think its the best way to breed dogs that doesnt mean everyone agrees with us and before we know it we may find we are the group which is told they cant breed certain dogs or certain types or certain breeds.There are several breeds which are currently in development which will eventually fit the criteria and apply for ANKC recognition but there are also some who DONT want ANKC recognition and even though they do everything the same as us and simply have their dogs registered on a different registry in some shires they cant keep their dogs entire because their dogs cant be registered with the states Canine Association. Pedigreed purebred dog breeders breed approx 3% of dogs bred each year in Australia and our numbers have dropped.Thats much different to the UK where about 75% bred are purebred dogs though not that many of them are CC registered purebreds because they have a different registration process.Even if we went nuts and started promoting pure breds and their breeders we dont breed enough dogs to fill the demand anyway. Why do we care if someone breeds cross bred dogs as long as the dogs dont suffer and they are doing it all right ? Why do we care if someone wants to buy a cross bred dog over a purebred? Why do we want to see dogs bred by anyone other than a registered purebred treated differently? Why is it O.K. to remove the rights of a dog owner to make the same decisions with their dogs that we can make with ours? Why cant we just promote what we do and our dogs and make sure we are getting it right and let them worry about what they do?

http://www.cotswoldnews.com/news/1571/cots...g-pedigree-dogs Following the recent release of the report of the Independent Inquiry into Dog Breeding, by Professor Sir Patrick Bateson FRS of Cambridge University, on Thursday 14 January 2010, Cotswold MP Geoffrey Clifton-Brown has today spoken of the hard work and commitment of his constituent Carol Fowler in raising the profile of the issue of hereditary health problems in pedigree dogs. Mr. Clifton-Brown first met Carol in November 2005 when she came to him to discuss the problems in the dog breeding industry and the lack of will to address the welfare problems caused by inherited diseases. Carol’s involvement in this issue began after the death of her Blenheim Cavalier, Bonnie, in 2003, who had suffered from the disease Syringomyelia, in which the brain outgrows the skull, causing the dog excruciating pain. With Geoffrey’s assistance Carol was able to meet with DEFRA officials in 2006 to discuss the Animal Welfare Act, and with officials’ from the Kennel Club. Carol also gave evidence to the Companion Animal Welfare Council (CAWC) prior to the publication in 2006 of the report, ‘Breeding and Welfare in Companion Animals’. In 2008 Geoffrey accompanied Carol to the House of Lords for CAWC’s workshop meeting, ‘Fixing ancestral problems: genetics and welfare in companion animals.’ Carol’s hard work was spotted by Jemima Harrison, a producer working on a documentary film on this issue, who asked Carol to be a part of her work. The film entitled ‘Pedigree Dog’s Exposed’, was broadcast on BBC1 in August 2008. The film caused a significant amount of controversy, and led to the decision by the BBC not to broadcast Crufts, over concerns about the health of pedigree dogs. An important further outcome in January 2010 was the publication of Professor Bateson’s Inquiry Report, funded by the Kennel Club and Dogs Trust and supported by Defra. Mr. Clifton-Brown feels that the report, along with those produced by the Companion Animal Welfare Council, the All Party Parliamentary Group for Animal Welfare and the RSPCA all point to the clear need for a change in the Animal Welfare Act, and the MP has arranged for Carol Fowler to meet with Andrew Rosindell MP, the Shadow Minister for Home Affairs, and Richard Benyon MP, the Shadow Minister for Environment, Fisheries and Wildlife, to present the case to decision makers in the Conservative Party. Commenting on Carol’s work, Mr. Clifton-Brown today said “From the very first moment I met with Carol I was struck not only by her compassion for animals and her dedication but by the strength of her case. It was quite clear that the issue of the health of pedigree dogs was being overlooked, but the film in which Carol appeared demonstrated the case to the animal loving people of the United Kingdom and I know she received a huge amount of supportive messages which has continued to spur her campaign. However, there remains more lobbying to be done and I know Carol will be right at the head of this work and remain delighted to offer what assistance I can.” Source: Geoffrey Clifton-Brown

There are many people who are breeding dogs now who are working toward their breeds being recognised.They register their dogs with their own registries to keep track of ancestry. There's a big difference between that and someone who has no plan for how what they breed today will impact on dogs in 5 years time.

There are many people who are breeding dogs now who are working toward their breeds being recognised.They register their dogs with their own registries to keep track of ancestry. There's a big difference between that and someone who has no plan for how what they breed today will impact on dogs in 5 years time.