brutus

Hello, Apologies for posting on here, but the papillon thread appears to be very dead.... I have 2 lovely toy poodles (female spayed), and am considering adding a papillon pup to the mix. I don't have a lot of experience with the breed, but have liked the dogs I have met. My dogs are my world, live indoors, and I do low-level agility and obedience. Is there anyone that can provide any information on pros and cons of the breed ? I am specifically interested in the reality of how much they shed (as have been very spoilt with only poodles over the past decade). Thank you !

thanks heaps for all the recommendations - will look into both the orbilocs and the rogz ones :)

Hello, I am looking to get a LED safety light for my 3.5kg toy poodle, and was wondering if anyone had any recommendations ? I have heard that the orbiloc ones are very good, but am worried it may be a little too heavy for a small dog (but have only seen these in the packaging). Any recommendations would be really appreciated :) Thanks in advance.

Thank you so much for your comments anne - and mita as well (not sure how to reply to both together). I really am trying to do what is right by these dogs, and really have done my research in regards to rescue organisations. I try to be very careful as I am aware of more than one rescue group who is not overly reputable, and so want to make sure these pups have the best chance at life. I have also signed them all up to petplan through my work so am hoping the new owners decide to continue with pet insurance (but that is a whole other debate :p).

what a good idea. thanks - have taken all these comments on board and am in the process of working things out with a rescue organisation. and as I mentioned before - there are reasons for these pups not having anaesthetics straight away, and I am not on here to discuss those as I trust the vets I have sought guidance from. Who on earth are you goin to rehome 6-7 week old pups with health issues to? I sincerely hope that you do your research on the families that you place them with. They MUST be made aware of the responsibilty they are taking on in getting one of these pups. Thanks for your input - love the fact that you have come up with all sorts of insinuations regarding the long term health of these pups and who I have rehomed them to. And yes I had several offers from rescue groups for these pups - and I advised them all that I would be in touch at the end of the month if I needed help. I have met many different types of rescue groups over the years, and so reserve the right to choose one of my own accord. Which I have now done. Thanks to those people who were willing to help without jumping to their own conclusions. I am only going on the facts that you have presented and there is no insinuation what so ever from me. You stated you have found homes for 6-7 week old pups, the age of those pups alone is a very valid reason for needing to be very careful who you place them with. You say they cannot have an anaesthetic straight away on advise from your vet. So...that was not because of health? They are going to be rehomed undesexed...another valid reason for being extra careful with who they are rehomed to. I really do not want to continue this debate, but will just point a few things out: Firstly, I was never going to rehome the pups at 6-7 weeks of age - I was always going to hang on to them until March, so that they were at least 10 weeks of age. I have been very careful with whom I am rehoming them too, and have certainly knocked back plenty of people who I did not think were suitable. As for the anaesthetic, I am not going to justify my reasons and am content with the decision that I have made with my vet. These pups will be desexed prior to going to their new homes. Thank you everyone for your input - it is appreciated.

The comment re jumping to conclusions was not directed at you. I was very grateful for your help and was honestly going to contact you once I had spoken to a few people this morning. Regardless, the pups will now be desexed prior to rehoming - I do appreciate the opinions I received and have taken that advice. As I have mentioned several times I have no problem with early age desexing (have personally done several surgeries myself) - but it is just not optimal in this situation (and do not feel the need to explain the medical reasons behind it on here). Sincere thanks.

what a good idea. thanks - have taken all these comments on board and am in the process of working things out with a rescue organisation. and as I mentioned before - there are reasons for these pups not having anaesthetics straight away, and I am not on here to discuss those as I trust the vets I have sought guidance from. Who on earth are you goin to rehome 6-7 week old pups with health issues to? I sincerely hope that you do your research on the families that you place them with. They MUST be made aware of the responsibilty they are taking on in getting one of these pups. Thanks for your input - love the fact that you have come up with all sorts of insinuations regarding the long term health of these pups and who I have rehomed them to. And yes I had several offers from rescue groups for these pups - and I advised them all that I would be in touch at the end of the month if I needed help. I have met many different types of rescue groups over the years, and so reserve the right to choose one of my own accord. Which I have now done. Thanks to those people who were willing to help without jumping to their own conclusions.

what a good idea. thanks - have taken all these comments on board and am in the process of working things out with a rescue organisation. and as I mentioned before - there are reasons for these pups not having anaesthetics straight away, and I am not on here to discuss those as I trust the vets I have sought guidance from.

that is exactly what I was thinking of.. but wasn't sure how to work it all out. Do you do the same thing for male dogs (all these pups are male). Would you mind providing me with more info at all (e.g. how much bond etc). Feel free to PM me instead. Really appreciate your input.

yeah its a good idea - thanks. should be doable as its really only the 2 pups that I need to keep a really close eye on. thanks :)

oh ok - my issue is most certainly with the anaesthetic due to their size (& this has been backed up by 3 senior vets at the clinic I am at). They are otherwise healthy, and are ok to go to their new homes in 1-2 weeks. I think I might contact the new owners prior to the time they pick them up and ask them to pre-pay for desexing at their local clinic (or at least ask if I can contact their vet for a reference). In a perfect world I would desex them at the clinic I work at, but this is not possible as I am going overseas, and the pups are not all going to stay in the area where I work. I appreciate that people have different opinions regarding this matter, but please bear in mind that I am not asking for an opinion as to whether the pups are able to have an anaesthetic (+ you are not aware as to all the background with this particular litter) - I was purely asking for advice regarding alternatives. Thank you for all of your help - much appreciated.

I imagine that an anaesthetic is still required for a vasectomy (& so they may as well be castrated instead). I am hoping for an option that delays a general anaesthetic until they are a little bit older. 3/5 pups are going to vets & vet nurses, so it is only 2 pups specifically that I am concerned about (despite the fact that the people seem responsible etc.). Vet nurses are amongst some of the biggest back yard breeders around. Rehoming them to a vet nurse is no guarantee. The only way to ensure they cannot be bred form is to neuter or have a vasectomy performed. Providing they are over KG in weight, there's no reason why they cannot be done before the are rehomed. The recovery time is very fast for babies. These are vet nurses I have worked with for over 7 years, so I trust them entirely (plus I work with them so I will know if the dogs are not desexed). These pups are right between 800g-1kg at the moment. As I said, I am an advocate for early desexing (in such situations), but do not think it is the best option in this scenario. I am confused by what is meant by a vasectomy ?? Have never heard of this being done (but would consider it). Assume what you mean is something different to surgical castration ?

thanks heaps - I normally do not have an issue with early desexing, but these pups have had a rough start to life and so I am not comfortable giving them a general anaesthetic them whilst they are so young. I was thinking about asking the owners to pre-pay for desexing at their local vet clinic and provide me with a receipt prior to pick-up ? (as was not sure the legalities were with taking money and refunding it once proof of desexing has been provided).

I imagine that an anaesthetic is still required for a vasectomy (& so they may as well be castrated instead) - is this correct ? I am hoping for an option that delays a general anaesthetic until they are a little bit older. 3/5 pups are going to vets & vet nurses, so it is only 2 pups specifically that I am concerned about (despite the fact that the people seem responsible etc.).

hello, I have managed to find homes for some little jrt x pups that I rescued from a clinic I am currently working at, but now am just trying to work out the best way to enforce desexing at 6 months of age. I was thinking about not signing over microchip paperwork until desexing certificate is produced at 6 months of age, but am a bit worried should they get lost as I will be overseas very soon. Is there a contract or anything that I can use ? Does anyone have any ideas ? I have screened the homes to the best of my ability, but just want to make sure that I am not contributing to the unwanted animal population. I would provide desexing vouchers but these pups are going all over the country. I would desex these pups myself prior to rehoming, but they are only just 6-7 weeks old (& barely 1kg) and so I would much rather wait. Thanks in advance. Edited to add that all pups are boys.

As much as I do respect your opinion, I do not agree with the above. We have had plenty of cases at work where an entire body system is excluded based on a previous, yet unrelated condition (such as my above example). In these cases, certain Hollards policies have subsequently excluded the entire body system (e.g. eyes), following a claim, despite the fact that the conditions were unrelated. Perhaps I did not completely understand the paying out of the chronic condition under your particular policy, and although I am glad to hear that you have had no problems with your current policy, I also assume that you have not yet reached the pre-set limit for that particular condition/s. Once this limit is reached, I take it that this condition will then no longer be claimable ? This would not be the case for the Allianz policies. Regardless, I am not going to pretend to know the ins and outs of every single policy under the Hollards name - I just think it is important to be aware of the limitations of each policy prior to a problem developing :)

Danois, have you actually had to use the RSPCA policy ? Sure diabetes would be covered in that scenario, but what happens once the limit is exceeded ? You are then paying for a policy that you are not able to use in its entirety, as well as having to pay the ongoing treatment costs in their entirety (e.g. insulin, blood glucose tests etc), despite the fact that you have pet insurance. If this were to happen with Petplan for example, you would only have had the excess to pay (one off), and would then be covered up to your yearly limit (starting from $10 000). Similarly, say your pet has an eye injury in the first year (e.g. conjunctivitis), and then gets a seperate, but different eye condition a few years later (e.g. glaucoma) - you will find that eyes will be an exclusion after the first year, and so the second, seperate condition would not be covered. It makes no difference to me as to what policy individuals choose (I certainly do not work for Petplan), but just think that it is really important that everyone reads their PDS on choosing (as once something goes wrong and you realise you are no longer covered after 12 months, it is unfortunately too late to change as that condition will now be considered as pre-existing by other companies). Petplan is the only policy which has a lifetime policy (so exclusions do not pop up based on what you have claimed for once within the policy period), and it also does not have the restriction of sub-limits per condition (which can be a real issue with tick paralysis in particular - I have seen bills at work in excess of $10 000, and personally I would much rather be able to choose where I would like my yearly limit to go to). Anyway, as I said - each to their own, but I think the most important thing is to be well-informed of what your insurance policy covers, and the other options out there, before an injury or illness occurs.

Ok, so I haven't read the past 5 pages, but insurance is something I do know a fair bit about (having worked at an emergency vet for 7 years, and my recent dealings with the company I am insured with - Petplan). Pretty much in Australia there are 2 insurance companies - those underwritten by Allianz (Petplan & Guide Dogs), & Hollards (all the others - RSPCA, Prosure, Medibank, Bow Wow Meow etc.). The main difference are the following: - Hollards will not cover for 100% of bills (Allianz do) - Hollards are a 1 year policy (e.g. if your dog develops diabetes in a year that you are covered, the following year it will no longer be covered, as it is now an exclusion). - Allianz only offers lifetime policies (e.g. if you dog devlops diabetes during a year that you are covered, they are covered for life, up to your yearly limit of course, providing you do not break your policy) - no insurance (to my knowledge) will cover for pre-existing conditions, however Allianz (Petplan) will cover for genetic conditions (e.g. hip dysplasia), provided that symptoms did not devolop prior to the period of coverage - Allianz will not cover for anything that is routine (e.g. vaccinations, desexing (strangely pyometra is covered), routine dentals), or related to breeding (e.g. caesarian). Teeth extractions are covered provided the animal has had regular treatment by a vet (i.e. if a dog has not seen vet for 6 years, and suddenly gets a tooth root abscess, Petplan may say that the owner did not provided preventative care (i.e. regular checks by vet at vacciantion etc). The same applies to parvo in adult, unvaccinated dogs. In summary, I would only ever insure with Petplan / Guide Dogs, as realistically with the other ones, everything will end up being an exclusion and so you will end up with a policy that covers very little. Please note that Petplan Equine, however, it only a one year policy, and so it is essentially like the Hollards product With this in mind, I have both my dogs insured with Petplan, despite the fact that I work at an emergency clinic. Even if I were to put away money each month, it would never amount to the $10 000 / year I have to spend with Petplan, and I would only use it for big things, given the fact I work at a vet (my excess is $100). I hope this was of some help !

I'll look into the Royal Canin and give that a try first perhaps as he is currently on Royal Canin anyway (puppy formula). I used to have him on the premium performance Eukanuba as that is very high in protein (30%) & fat (20%), but the 4800 looks like an even better formulation. I've had him checked for EPI and so don't think the enzymes would make much difference as his levels were normal, but have certainly seen dogs that they have worked wonders on (older dogs especially). Great idea but. And the T5 is an interesting concept - I had his thyroid levels checked through IDEXX, but shall look into your suggestion as well ? Thanks again - taking everything onboard

oh and Woofen, what is the Artemis Osopure Power Formula ? Will look it up when I am next in at work, but can't say I have heard much about this product.

Thank you very much for all the wonderful suggestions. Had never actually considered Livamol (even though I used to have my horses on it a few years ago) - I do remember it used to work wonders on 'poor doers' back then, so shall definitely give that a go. Brutus currently gets 3-4 cups morning & night, which is over his recommended intake, but he happily eats it and so its hardly going to do any damage. He is a fairly active dog, but he is quite happy to sit and sleep in the sun during the day, so its not as if he is an overly anxious / hyperactive dog ? I would love to be able to give him more 'energy-dense' snacks during the day, but as I am at work / uni, I do rely on my elderly grandmother and don't feel like I can ask her to feed him more than once in my absence. I will make sure I look into the grain diet as well, and may increase the sardines in his diet over winter at least. Thank you for all these wonderful ideas. Oh and he sleeps on a raised surface in the living room (a trampoline style bed) with a big cushion & plenty of blankets so he is protected from the cold. I am very much a believer that it is better for animals to be leaner rather than overweight, but he is at the point where he does look painfully thin (his spine is really evident some days). My toy poodle on the other hand, is continuously on a restricted diet as she will eat anything & everything (and wasn't blessed with his metabolism). Thanks again !

Hello, I have a big problem in that my dog is absolutely impossible to keep any weight on, and with all this recent cold weather, this has become an even bigger struggle. I have actually worked as a vet nurse for the past 7 years, but was hoping that someone may have been in a similar situation, and may have some helpful hints. Brutus is a 5yo, male (n) staffy x boxer, and he has always been a very lean dog. I actually found him as an emaciated puppy (he was dumped in a box ), but I have always managed to keep a reasonable amount of coverage on him. He isn't an overly fussy eater, but has never been very food orientated (compared to my garbage guts toy poodle anyway). That being said, he typically will happily eat whatever is put down in front of him. At the moment, in absolute honesty, he looks like a cruelty case. His ribs are protruding, and his hips are very prominent. I have taken him in to work and had a full work-up done (bloods / teeth checked etc), and there is no obvious problem. He has been his normal happy self, but I just cringe when I look at him. I am currently feeding him premium puppy food 2-3 times a day, and he also gets treats throughout the day (as I live with my 90 yr old grandmother). I have started adding oats to his dinner over the past 2 months as well as this was suggested by one of the vets at work. He has never had any medical problems, and has actually been a regular blood donor (although I have stopped over the past few months due to his physical condition). That being said, he never donated more than once every 5-6 months, and so it was hardly excessive. He sleeps inside at night, and has access inside during the day. He is walked a couple of times a week, but nothing excessive as I have had a few health problems. He does have a large, grassed backyard however, and quite happily plays with my other dog during the day. I have tried to put jumpers & coats on him since he was a pup, but unfortunately they tend to last about a week. He is not destructive with his bedding, but he has never been keen on having anything on him. I have tried doggiejama / weatherbeeta etc, none of which have survived. I would really appreciate any suggestions at this point as am just stuck - I was thinking about adding omega 3s to his diet, but he does tend to get home-cooked fish-leftovers about once a week. Thank you ! - just wanted to add that he gets fed separately, and so he most certainly gets to eat his dinner

There is no need for antibiotics. Just leave the craters alone and let nature take its course. Dont pick at them etc. The only time we ever use ab is with paralysis tick cases who are retching/vomiting - and this is in order to prevent/treat the aspiration pneumonia they are more than likely going to obtain.

Hi, The dandruff will most likely sort itself out... (an guessing pup has only been on the diet for a week or so ?) but you could try using a leave in conditioner such as aloveen once a week (or whenever skin feels especially dry) in the meantime ? It is great as it is moisturising and can be used on a dry coat (and smells very nice ) Best of Luck - I love golden retriever pups - we delivered a litter of 14 at work the other night - such little roly poly little chaps .