poodlefan

I support what David Suzuki said about "think globally, act locally". There are a hell of a lot of dog owners on this forum. If we all had access to a few brochures we could download and hand out to folk we knew were in the market for a dog that would be a start. If we all had good answers (and not long ones) about why you'd only buy a dog from a responsible breeder or rescue (and what that meant) that would be a start. There's always going to be folk who want only a purebred pup or only a rescue dog. We need to acknowledge it, ditch our own prejudice and help people get the right dog for them. Advocating your own breed because YOU like it, advocating only pound rescue for novice family owners with very young kids.. that's not about who's asking but about our own beliefs. The PR nightmares of snobbish breeders and dog owners, that you only need papers to show etc can be overcome. Health testing is a message most people get. If rescuers acknowledge that stopping dogs being dumped is as important as saving them, that's start too. If people want a purebred puppy, then telling them they're killing a pound dog is hardly going to help.

Any train of thought that sees a member of the public "blamed" for this attack needs serious rethinking. I agree with posters who have said that, startled or not, there is no excuse for the kind of bite (or any bite) that inflicts this kind of injury. Startle reflex is real. But clearly this dog lacked bite inhibition - seriously lacked it. As dog owners, we are responsible for what our dogs do - end of story. This dog clearly has issues. Blaming the jogger for startling the dog tells me the dog owner has some issues with regard to knowledge and management of her dog too. Dogs have great hearing. My guess is that the dog knew someone was coming.

Those messages need to be simple and linked to good sources of information. Places like the Petcare Advisory Network offer a lot of ideas on how to do this. If once a year, the CC's organised open days with breed stalls, dog sports demos and lots and lots of handouts, it would be a start. However, to be quite frank, a lot of breeders lack the necessary communication skills to sell the message to folk who haven't got a clue. As I said, folk would need to park their own agendas (and egos) and work within a plan. Perhaps the first place to start might be to educate WITHIN the dog community about what the issues are and what needs to be done. I'd also like to see the CCs clean house. We all know there are registered puppy farmers :D: They also need to do better than turn their heads away when puppy buyers get ripped off - I get a sense at least locally that people realise we need to do better. We need to work on a community perception about what "better" is. Perhaps, as a start its as simple as an "INFORMATION" sign and a few folk decdicated to the task and willing to talk to members of the public at shows. A handout that covers what most of us consider as the basics of puppy buying would have a lot of value.

Territories are AWD not 4WD as are the outlanders and ravs, I'm not sure on the xtrails, I think they are 4wd. Put it this way if you need a 4wd then I probably wouldn't buy any of them, I'd be looking at navaras, bt-50s, pathfinders, ranger, izuza dmax etc, they actually have 4wd capabilities. Although getting one in a dual cab for $35k brand new may be near impossible. Yep, Territories are AWD and a bit higher off the ground than most passenger cars. However you'd have to be a nut to try rock hopping in one. They probably aren't much chop beyond gravel and slow paddock driving.

Ah, now for the work. Who do we educate? I'd be specifically targetting parents and the wider general public. All the channels currently used to talk about pets are potential avenues for these messages. Child safety networks AND animal welfare networks are potential avenues for education. We have media like Better Homes and Gardens, Dogslife and others that might be approached. "NO puppy farms" doesn't offer an alternative source. People need to know about those sources and how to sort the wheat from the chaff in terms of ethics. Essentially I think we all need to talk to come up with a few key messages and flog them hard. At a practical level, approaches to local pounds requesting that they give those surrendering dogs a tick and flick questionaire and ask if they're willing to be interviewed about their dog would be good. A few folk in a few regions who can objectively gather and interview (non judgementally) could be the start. People would have to be able to park their own agendas and work with the plan. Questions to ask: * breed/crossbreed of dog (if known) * age when purchased * source of purchase * any training undertaken - puppy pre-school, dog club, private trainer * family composition - genders, ages of family members * a few questions around reason for surrender -behavioural, economic etc * If willing to give name and willing to be interviewed. My guess is anonymity might encourage more frank responses from some. Steve, I think rather than scattering efforts nationally, selecting one or two regions for pilot programs of education and information gathering and a third 'no change'monitoring site for just information gathering might be the basis of a 3-5 year study. The issue then comes down to funding but with a limited scope, we might get a few of the bigger players to chip in. What's needed is a project plan I suppose. So I'd say choose three areas with pounds likely to be amenable to assisting with collecting surveys and that have a few interested folk to do legwork. The ACT seems a likely one to me.

There isn't one.

Good point. I hadn't factored towing into this. When they come out, a diesel Ford Territory might be one to consider.

Offtopic but the sooner people stop using those front of body crossing flyball harneses the better. They really do restrict a dog's front movement.

I think the problem needs to be broken down a little. What can we do now? 1.We can educate puppy buyers that they should put more effort into adding a dog to their family than they currently do to adding a car. The myth that the only differences between dogs are size, shape and hair length are pervasive. Many dog owners have no idea about temperament, activity level etc. Most folk do some research on cars, test drive, don't buy from dodgy sources and check for any interests in the car if buying privately. If we could educate them just to do the equivalent for a dog, we'd be on our way. The more they know, the better they can understand what sort of dog might suit them and what sort of care it might need. The irony is that many family dogs will spend way longer in the family than any car ever does. If people really grasped that their choice of dog and how they raise it made a difference to the safety of their kids I think we might get somewhere. I have a slogan in my head. It's never "just a dog" - finding the right dog for your family. 2. We can gather information about where dumped dogs are bought, who buys them and why they are dumped. If we gather information on these issues we can move to step 2. A lot of us have ancedotes, gut feelings and limited statistics. If we want long term solutions to the issue we need to arm ourselves with facts. What can we achieve in the longer term? A balance of laws that protects buyers (as consumers), breeders (as suppliers) and the dogs themselves by specifying minimum (and potentially ideal) standards of practice for both breeding and pet dogs. I support owner licensing because you can at least ensure that a potential owner must past a knowledge based test before purchase. I also support mandatory cooling off periods on purchases. Impulse buys are never good, no matter where the pup is sourced.

The X-Trail is very popular with show and dog sports folk. I had one for a week when my Magna was off the road and it was a very nice car to drive. Its on my short list for my next car. They are good value. I'm not a fan of having the dogs in the back of the commercials because you can't keep them cool back there in summer. That said, my friend has a Triton and its a very comfortable car but way more expensive than your budget I think. I can't comment on the others on your list.

What's your budget? How many seats do you need? There's plenty of folk with large dogs using the 2 seater smaller commercial vans these days - Caddies, Caddy Maxi's, Citroen Berlingos and the like.

I read somewhere that dogs that double pump the weavers are faster than single steppers anyway. I'd not attempt to change a style either. Reliability might suffer as a result.

And leave the Ipod at home and keep your ears open. I've missed being mown down by plenty of lycra louts on bikes because I hear their wheels. I'm tempted to get a T-shirt that says "Use Your Effing Bell" on the back.

I agree Jed. I think that dog is as much a purebred Labrador Retriever as Howard is. :p Oh, cos we have some showing in the local area now: Blue Beagle

Group 4: Friday: Beagle Saturday: Whippet (not mine but :p anyway)

Congratulations!! :p Lovely looking boy too!

What dog smell? Lots of hard surfaces, lots of washing (dogs and beds etc), pay attention to teeth and bot bots and don't feed canned food. :p

To me the benchmark of a good breeder is what they produce. I'm not necessarily talking about how much their dogs win or how well they do in point scores either. Word of mouth from happy dog owners would be my recommended method of starting the search for a dog. Or, for those who know a couple of good breeders (doesn't matter what breed) a recommendation from one would be good to have. A great breeder may have all the charm of Vlad the Impaler, the PR skills of Attilla the Hun and the computer skills of a Neanderthal but its the dogs they produce that matter. I figure I"m buying a dog, not a friend. The after sales support is very nice to have but a good spiel and a charm offensive is no guarantee of getting a great dog. I'd say at least half of the top Whippet breeders in this country don't put their dogs in the point scores here. At least a couple probably struggle to find the on switch for the computer :p A schmick website doesnt' mean happy healthy dogs of good temperament (doesn't rule it out either).

Did it rain? Was the ground wet when you got home?

Agree. Very handsome dogs!

Not at all like a Lab If it was a Lab it would have eaten the car. :nahnah:

I likey that one!

One for the Spitz Fans The Lundehund And one of its distinguishing features:

Lets just hope they stay out of the hands of idiots.

Fox red Labrador Retriever (on right). The Lab folk can set me straight but I think its still considered to be "yellow" in the Standard. Love this colour.