myValkyrie

http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/world/f...x-1225848293464

Our Maremmas are kept far busier deterring wandering town dogs (they look after goats & mini horses) than anything else - absolutely worth their weight in gold. Horrific story - my heart goes out to this lady & her poor little ponies :rolleyes:

havnt seen one work yet. Just increases anxiety Thanks

Sorry but what's a Husher Muzzle?

You are so right - they are such unfairly gorgeous babies :p - & as adults they don't cope well with changing homes or being in a pound. Nor do pounds cope well with them - 2 we tried to get out were PTS for "poor temperament" as their smiling was completely misinterpreted

Very familiar story - gorgeous fluffy white puppy, he/she's just "so kyooot" - then they grow up (& up & out & then up some more) & start to behave like a Maremma - OMG it barks (& barks & digs & barks some more) & the neighbours are complaining & that beautiful white hair covers every available surface - & the pet shop said they "were just like a Golden Retriever only white"................... One of my rescues has a similar story - he was cute & adorable & then he matured into what he was always going to be - a large, hairy & very dedicated (read loud & vocal) magnificent Maremma - he was never going to be a dog that would suit unit (with a small courtyard) living but when he failed to meet expectations, he was passed on. He's now a complete foster failure - it took him so long to settle & he has bonded with us so completely, that I couldn't possibly rehome him (besides, I love him to death )

Dogs here (11) are all either registered pedigrees or breed rescues. Horses are 1 reg TB, 1 rescue TB (I'm sure you could chase his rego up but I've never bothered) & 1 Paint/QH (eligible for rego but I'm slack & have no plans at this stage to show him) & 2 reg Miniature horses. 1 cat - rescue moggy 40 goats - 37 registered fullbloods (Boers) & 3 Boer x. 21 Guinea Fowl - have no idea if there is a fancy, club or register for these guys but they look purebred

http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2010/01/25/2800176.htm

No ;) what makes a dog the best at what it does, is not only the combination of the physical and mental - but how the physical and mental are pefectly attuned to the total dog. ie The Maremma and Central Asian are both excellent stock guardians, but they each go about their guardian roles differently because of their unique mental and physical attributes. The maremma prefers to outhink and out manouvre, barking to raise alarm and to warn off threats, only using physical confrontation as an absolute last resort. the central asian is not as lithe as the maremma, it is not going to run back and forth from the fence line to issue warnings. when it gets up it goes straight to physical confrontation. it is not built to run the yards the maremma does, it hasn't got the subtle strategy that the maremma knows. The central asian's upper hand is in physical force and ingrained physical and mental resilience. A maremma x central asian will never have the full strength and physical capability of a pure central asian because the maremma is not built to take and dispense physical assault the way a central asian is similarly the central asian doesn't know the maremma concept of subtle strategy. So a maremma x central asian will not last long as a stock guard and will always be an inferior dog to its pure bred counterparts, as a dog cannot address 'threats' with a central asian game plan if it hasn't got the physical and mental material to carry out that game plan - a maremma strategy to deal with threatening feral dogs would be to stay close to its flock and shepherd and protect whereas a central asian would ride out with guns blazing - each breeds methodolgy is a success only bcz of their respective physical and mental characteristics. Totally agree Lilli - I have been able to observe the results of a local "breeder" with Kangal x Maremma pups, over several litters (perhaps aptly named, & marketed as 'Mangals') & the outcome is not nearly as effective as a livestock guardian as either of the orginal purebreds are. They tend to be "neither fish nor fowl", not working like either breed would - their unpredictability (particularly suspiscion & aggression levels) would be their greatest drawback - they are however, 'rare' and are available in unusual & pretty colours

Sorry to cut your post Lilli - but that is just everything I wanted to say - brilliant

Whilst I agree wholeheartedly with your first point - the price of a puppy doesn't even begin to reflect the amount of time, research, money, effort and a lot of times, sheer blood, sweat & tears that a breeder has invested in that puppy - what do you believe driving that price upwards will achieve? I see the pedigreed purebred struggling now - we are trying to contend with the DD breeders, the "purebred but no papers" backyarders, the "registered but dodgy" breeders and the "pedigree dogs are inbred & unhealthy" brigade - by making puppies more and more expensive, are we simply placing them further out of reach?

Our guys have mostly raw but when we do feed kibble, we use Enduro (made here in Qld so not sure about availability in other states). It's available in a range of Complete, Plus & Puppy and costs around $38 for 20kg - our dogs are very active & have done really well on it.

Pretty correct - they don't require training as such (to guard) - just opportunity, guidance and encouragement. It's instinctive to a point - it varies between individuals & I personally find the two breeds work quite differently. They do learn different ways of handling different levels of threat but the basic desire to guard is already there.

Not sure if this is relevant (or even interesting ) for the purpose of this thread but I take great interest in watching my LGDs (a Kangal & several Maremmas) at work - none of whom have had any formal obedience training - just basic good manners. I think their behaviour is a little "different" to what a lot of dog owners expect. There is a very definitive pack structure - the lowest pack member, if threatened will be defended vigorously, as will any other pack member. The dominant male is less tolerant of lower pack members but the dominant female runs the show. My dominant female is very protective (of her territory) so will defend me because I am within it. If I tell her to "leave it" she will, however she is extremely watchful & will threat display if a stranger moves too far away from me (& in doing so becomes 'fair game' IYKWIM). If she perceives a definate threat (carrying a stick, stamping at her to "get away", raised voices or aggressive behaviour), she will require physical restraint. I don't believe she is fear aggressive - but maybe I just am not reading her correctly? She will not approach strangers at all & even once introduced remains highly suspicious - the Maremmas once introduced are really social - so long as me or OH is there, they adore visitors.

I knew it was time for you to go, old man - but I was still so not ready for it. The gap you have left seems enormous, matched only by the hollowness I feel. It's been a long journey - I remember when you were born, you were the little guy who had to push your way through the bigger pups - you didn't know you were small & you strutted right into my heart. I was so proud of you - not just for the ribbons & trophies - but the way you made little kids fall in love with you, the way you were always the life & soul of a party, the way you had your own fan club at shows - yep that was you sitting on a chair ringside with the sunnies on I love the way we used to chat & how your whole life you knew you could fit on my lap. How you loved a good BBQ, a big fire and a cold beer. I know Sal will be waiting for you - she'll show you the ropes little man. Hope there's lots of footballs, squeaker toys & long grass for you to stalk through. You save those cuddles - both of you - til I see you there. We'll have some catching up to do. Rest easy old man.

I can just imagine - I'm not sure if it's the way she's looking full on at the camera or what but the look says to me "yep that's right I am gorgeous - deal with it". Such carriage & arrogance for a baby - bet you had fun in the ring with her

Completely OT - but how gorgeous is that black girl? Love the expression on her face

Yes, I know it can be persistent. The query though was on the fact that it 'migrated' from upper layers of skin to layers further down. I have never heard of a demodectic mite burrowing down to a layer where it can not be eradicated. Bad case of demodex, yes. A case that seems impossibe to control, maybe. Mites burrowing further down the epidermis layers of the skin... I am not certain of. I'm not sure about the "migrating" - the way my vet explained it to me is that the demodex, whilst it is an "illness" as such in itself - is really a symptom of the inability of the dog's immune system to cope. All dogs have demodex mites on their skin - and the dog's immune system somehow controls the population of mites - when the immune system falls down, the mites rapidly overpopulate. Which is why puppies (and older dogs) under stress are more likely to have breakouts of mange. If the dog or puppy is simply "run down", neglected or experiencing a hormone rush (anything really that challenges the immune system) , the condition will improve as the dog's system recovers (sometimes needing treatment & sometimes not). If the inherent problem with the immune system cannot be rectified, the dog is unable to recover. This helped make it a little clearer for me & I hope it helps some of you too

Sorry to drag up an old thread - but just wanted to give a quick update on Bose. He was treated for his demodex with Advocate & am really pleased with how well it has worked :D Would recommend giving it a go to anyone with a pup with localised demodex - only took 10 days to see a difference & now he is growing his hair back & his skin looks great. So relieved to have it under control :D He goes for his vaccination next week

Frank - I'm going to try & make this very simple, easy & painfree. As I think someone has already said, Cockers are lovely soft dogs to train (stubborn maybe ) but they WANT to please you. Your dog is not pleasing you & you have tried to correct this. It is not working. Please just chalk it up to experience or whatever & try something else. Get some advice - whether it's a professional behaviourist, your local obedience club (I'm sure other Cocker owners would be more than happy to help) etc The same method does not always work for every dog, they are all different & there is heaps of help available to you - cos you are the one who can make it work. Every dog has a "key" - this little bloke could be just as great a dog as your old GSD - please try to give him the chance to be all that he can be

Hi Frank Have been watching the thread with interest - tho I haven't contributed - so glad that things seem to be working out with Bailey - keep at it, hope it works out well for you guys

Low immunity which enables the mites to multiply to such numbers where they become a problem. He believes that, although there are several reasons for the low immunity issues and the suseptibility to this condition, it may be hereditary and linked to the mother. He advises anyone that has a bitch producing pups that develop localised or generalised demodex to have her desexed. Obviously, a dog with immunity issues relating to other illnesses or just 'because' is not the same. Once a dog has issues with demodex it is likely to recur all through it's life, particularly in times of stress, and in the elderly and in sickness when immunity is normally low. That is what I think too - I believe the tendency to a suppressed immune system (which is what allows the mange to "take hold") is hereditary & would certainly not breed with an animal which had suffered an outbreak of demodex which required treatment.

Sorry Puggles - didn't realise she was generalised from the pic - you've done a great job getting her back. Rang my vet yesterday & she reckons to leave it for a week or so & see how we go - so fingers crossed, must say he looks better As an off shoot, what does your vet believe causes demodex? Just wondering as a few vets have had pretty different opinions

Thanks for that Puggles - and yes, having had to battle it with Nikki for most of her short life has probably made me a bit overanxious with this little bloke. So glad that little Bubbles has bounced back after all she endured. I think most localised cases can be successfully resolved with some effort, time & TLC. Generalised demodex is a horrible, heartbreaking condition & if there is any chance that vaccination could possibly put my boy at risk (at present he just has the littles bumps round his eyes so hopefully we've caught it nice & early) then that makes my decision easier. Fingers crossed for an outcome like Bubbles

I mean that the mange did not respond to a variety of treatments & progressively worsened (over a period of months) to a point where the dog had no hair, uncontrollable secondary bacterial infection & skin with the resilience of tissue paper. My vet & I persevered with her to a point where her quality of life had deteriorated & her discomfort level was increasing to a point where it was cruel (mine & vet's opinion) to persist with treatment when there was no indication of recovery. I made the decision to euthanise her. To me, that means I "lost" her.