hortfurball

I agree HW, he's dreadfully put together, also very underweight and I'd say you're right on the early desexing - my guess would be prior to 6 months, a big no-no for danes. My boy was desexed at 6 months or just over according to his previous owners and he is also not as good as he could be conformation wise, but looks like a show dog compared to this one! Not sure but Zeus may also have wobblers, either that or very bad muscle tone and almost certainly some sort of issue with his hips - his rear legs were trembling when they had the dogs lined up for treats. I wouldn't expect him to be long lived but it would help if they did some muscle building with him and he needs about 8-10 kilos put on. If that was my dog I'd be too embarrassed to be featured on TV, unless it was a special on 'what not to do' and I put other dogs before my own embarrassment.

On the other hand, I just read Melzawelza's link. Lilly the pit bull was hurt badly but her human was unhurt. Witnessed pulling her human to safety. How is it possible that she managed to still be in the path of the train?? Alcohol + human at fault again.

The owner's story doesn't make sense. If the dog dragged the man to safety, the dog would also have been off the tracks. So the his assertion that the dog pulled him to safety has to be incorrect. It sounds to me like the dog may have attempted to drag his owner to safety (or perhaps just sat with him) and the train driver saw the dog and slowed enough to not kill the man, although sadly it did kill the dog. I think the guy is making his dog a hero so that he won't be judged harshly for putting his dog in this situation and getting it killed. Shame on him.

Yes, just as well danes are chilled because there are stupid parents out there! Sounds like they were harlequin great danes, because there's no such thing as a giant dalmatian! :laugh: Piccie of a harlie (perhaps you should show your sister!): http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Dogge_Odin.jpg Congrats on your new addition BTW, I didn't realise you had added a third dog to your pack. Had to read your comment twice and then saw the note under your siggie! Well, your dogs are getting bigger with every new addition so looks like you'll end up with a rottie next then a dane to complete the pattern! :laugh:

I think I would tell him what happened in a matter of fact way. As he was caught out, so were you, so you fed him your westies' kibble, and he LOVED it! Dad has to have noticed he doesn't like the Purina. Then tell him the other benefits you believe he will get from the Black Hawk. Maybe just say that your westies coats improved on it and you wonder if it might also help the big guy, and then tell him outright that the dog has firmer stools and less of them (presuming this is the case) He can't argue with hard evidence, and it wasn't connived by you so all good in my book, be honest. :)

Simply Grand, worth researching VERY well first! They are not an easy dog, as adorable as they are. Although they are usually very eager to please they are not known as the brainiac of the dog world, and they sulk if you tell them off. Read the dane thread in Breeds 101, hang out in the dane thread for a year or so, and try to meet a few in the flesh, preferably a group of at least 4 or 5. You'll either be put off, or fall madly in love. :) Playdates with other danes are a must as well, so you end up with a whole bunch of new friends. :) Remember that these guys can walk up to your kitchen bench and look DOWN at it, or accidentally drag their lips across it (some are counter surfers and will simply take what they want.) Rolf also likes to check on us during the night, pretty interesting the first time I woke to a huge head hanging over me and sniffing my face before he dragged his lips across my cheek! :laugh: Everything is amplified because of their size, although the bonus is that you don't have to bend to pat them! Vet bills are huge, pet insurance is a necessity and premiums are on a par with house insurance premiums! A small dog may chew the corner of your couch when a pup, a dane pup can demolish the couch down to its wooden frame. Worst thing is, they have a short life span. Average is 8-10 years. I researched them for about five years before I got Rolf, and although other dane owners spoke about the horse comments, I didn't realise exactly how extreme and unrelenting it was until we got Rolf, although admittedly he's a particularly tall dane. But they don't make t-shirts like THIS for nothing: http://www.cafepress...on-white_tshirt You go to a cafe and are mugged by strangers wanting a pat. Almost everyone you encounter will have some reaction, from the simple intake of breath through "OMG that's HUGE!" and "Look it's a horse" or "F'in Jaysus!" all the way through to having an extended chat while you are trying to eat your lunch. Oh, and you'll notice tourists change the focus of their camera from their spouse to follow you as you walk past! :laugh: People hang out of car windows and point, and heaps of people want their photo taken with him, or a photo of him with their small child. Basically, if you value privacy and peace, and don't like being approached by strangers, then a dane might not be the dog of choice! If you are gregarious, chatty and sociable, then no problems (once you get used to it of course!) I just remind myself that the attention is on him, not me, and that these people will walk away and won't remember what I look like, but will remember the lovely big black dog. :)

New pics for Rolf fans :) We're members of GDLAWA (Great Dane Lovers Assoc. of WA) and there is a monthly GDLAWA walk to promote the breed, educate the public and dispel any myths. Thirty or forty danes together is a sight to see! We blended into the crowd a bit at the million paws walk just due to the sheer number of dogs but at the monthly walks we tend to stand out like the proverbial... Here are a couple of photos from yesterday's walk. One of the other dane mums is a photographer, hence the awesomeness of these photos compared to my happy snaps! My OH held them while I went to say hi to some other dogs, guess where I was! (hint - check out their focus!) Possibly my favourite ever Rolf pic! And my happy girl!

:laugh:

I can't weigh in much from the new mum side, having never been one, but I do know a LOT of dogs come through rescue because people say "Once baby came I just didn't have the time to dedicate to the dog that he/she deserved." I know you won't abandon a pup if you get one now, just pointing out that this suggests it's not all smooth sailing trying to do both. There is one thing that nobody seems to have covered though - I think it is natural to be desperate for a new puppy after we lose our beloved older dog. Something is missing and we think we can fill that space or distract ourselves from the pain by puppy cuteness. I felt like that and so did my best friend. I didn't give in and so far nor has she. A year later I was ready. My advice is honestly look at the true reason you want a pup so much now and if it is really mostly you missing Atlas unbearably, then it's too soon. I know it must seem like the stars have aligned with this litter, but there will be another, and the fact that you aren't 100% certain what breed you want says this is not the time.

Really good info from Sandgrubber. I stopped feeding my guys canned food ages ago. They get chicken necks for brekkie and a quality kibble with chicken mince mixed in for dinner. No food is ever left out on a help yourself basis or I'd have an emaciated dane and a butterball kelpie x. She's always waiting to finish his food so I have to supervise. Leaner is always better for aged joints - my old dane x lab boy was about 43 kilos most of his life but when he got older I kept his weight down to about 39 kilos to take some of the stress off his joints. He also kept me in the poor house...in his last 5 years I spent about $8500 on his heart pills alone! I don't begrudge a cent of it. :) Glad your boy is feeling/moving better, hope he continues to improve.

I didn't even make it to the end of the first page before I was having difficulty seeing through the tears...so I'm afraid after that I only scanned the thread for updates rather than reading all the replies, and there's snot and tears here again as I relive March last year. MsDani I'm so sorry for your loss and I too understand and empathise with what you are going through. It's absolutely natural to feel guilty, I know I did. No matter what we say we can't make you stop feeling what you will feel. You will second guess your decision simply because there is absolutely NO WAY of knowing for certain when the right time is. I believe that when we act with love in our hearts and in the best interests of our dog, then it was the right decision, and that's what you should hold onto. I also struggled with my decision because my boy was having a good day but in hindsight I am so glad that he wasn't in pain. The pain hits you like a sledgehammer again when their ashes are returned, so just a heads up for that one. There is a 'Rainbow Bridge' subforum here in case you don't know, with some helpful links and poems and a whole lot of dog stories. You may find going there comforting, to know you are not alone. My boy's story is there. Although I stated that I knew it was the right time, I'm pretty sure I was just trying to reassure myself. I asked the same questions as you for years before I finally had to let him go - how will I know? A friend said this "Please make peace with your decision, although it is hard for you, it is the best for him. They are our life companions, and we can't be selfish to hold them with us any longer than they have to. Let the tears flow when you need." Regarding your girl, I also have a 10 year old girl and I just tried to keep everything as normal as possible for her. I did find though, that my bond with her strengthened when we lost our old man, and I hope that you have the same pleasure of really bonding with your girl.

Wow! How to drag someone through the wringer! I'm not shy about telling someone when I think their dog is overweight but when someone has already acknowledged that their dog is carrying extra weight and states that he is on a diet plan for it, why do a number of people then still feel it necessary to tell her that her dog is fat? Why not simply applaud her for the diet plan but suggest the vet take a refresher course or read their own weight charts? It is now screamingly apparent that Janice is aware her dog is carrying a few extra kilos but that the vet is ignorant so how about we all get over the fat comments? I also think the conformation of the dog, while relevant to the arthritis from a structural perspective, could have been addressed more tactfully, or are we all so busy 'telling it like it is' that we don't care who or how we offend or hurt? Janisw, I hope the combination of drugs and diet works to make your lovely old boy comfortable and wish you many more happy years with him. :) EFS

Depends what it says. If it only says "Do not enter - private property" or something without mentioning a dog then it doesn't admit liability. I'd still like to kow what business these people had that necessitated going around the back of the property when the owners weren't home.

Look, the friends are idiots in the first degree for entering the yard when told not to (and you have to wonder WHY), but legally, if they report it, the dog could be seized. In my opinion they should take responsibility for their own stupid actions but I see the end of a friendship if they do report it.

Happy ending - some things are just meant to be, and it seems she was meant to be with you. :)

Sorry, long post! Saxonpup, if my understanding is correct, there should never be a need for others to protect their alpha. Alphas usually have the ability to diffuse the situation so they don't need protection, but they will step in and protect their pack. There would be people here with a much better understanding than myself so I won't go further into my suppositions but can tell you my experiences. The reason the alpha discussion came up was that somebody suggested my Ella is an alpha because she won't tolerate bad manners. She doesn't seek any other dogs but they seek her. She'll play if she's in the mood but she doesn't initiate it. With her history I had thought she was just reactive and so for years she hasn't been off leash in public, but since Rolf arrived she's been getting 'dane therapy' and running with multiple big dogs at the dane playdates and is not only holding her own but they seem to listen to her and respect her when she tells them off for being too rough. The penny dropped a few months ago when, after a young dane jumped on her trying to play and Ella told her off, later that day the same dane pup had been knocked down by a larger dane and was just lying there too tired to bother getting up and Ella ran up and licked her nose. Light bulb moment for me. Funny because she's no good at diffusing situations at all. She may be the alpha among our small group (she's certainly the grumpy nana!) but there are certain types of dogs that I'd rather avoid because Ella won't tolerate a challenge and won't back down. One young crossbreed got protective of his very old dane 'brother' who was lying down having a rest and had a go at Ella when she came near and she was DETERMINED to discipline him! I was trying to grab her but she wasn't going to give up until she'd told him off. Thankfully he was a little more agile and I managed to catch her but he ended up with tail between legs and I'm sure he learned his lesson without her teeth connecting and won't make the same mistake again. With my new understanding of her I am now able to take her to the dog beach and let her have a run and socialise with about 90% of dogs, but I leash her if an unknown dog approaches of the 'sort' I think she might have an issue with and if they don't also leash their dog we get out of there. Had a great situation on Sunday night - saw a dog coming and doing the 'stalking' thing and thought "uh-oh" so leashed both dogs, when the owners saw this, they leashed their dog too. We chatted and ended up letting all three dogs have an awesome playdate! I also call them brother and sister, my babies etc but I try not to attribute their behaviour to human traits. :)

So what DO you think happened then? How would you describe what happened if not protecting/diffusing the situation? See, now THIS is why we need a 'like' button :) Somebody said that Roscoe might be 'quick to anger' but I fail to see how that could be the case when he showed no signs of anger/aggression. To me he showed leadership skills (pack not human.) I think a natural ability to assess and diffuse is one of many qualities that make up an alpha (as I understand it.) I have been discussing pack structure and alpha recognition a lot with a group of dane owners lately. One trait that we agreed on is that an alpha doesn't seek out the other dogs, it tends to just do its own thing and the others then seek it out, which sounds like it fits Roscoe. Anyway, sounds like you have two lovely natured dogs and should be proud of them both. :)

Sorry but I just have to say Wobbly, your sig cracks me up every time I see it, especially the upside down couch/head pic! What an awesome character of a dog you have there!

My previous german shepherds died at 12 Maybe 11 would be old - for a big breed though. Looks like your interpretation of 'old' is where the issue lies. Your last dog lived til 12 and yet you think 'old' is just a mere year before that. I don't believe a dog is the same degree of youthful right up until a year before they pass away. Don't forget they are stoic creatures and may not show that they are a little more achey than they used to be. When you get to my age (and I'm not old :laugh:) a year goes by in a milisecond, or so it sometimes seems. My last dog may well have lived to 16, but that was nothing short of a miracle. Being a dane x lab, I had people telling me from when he was a pup that I would be lucky if he lived past 8, because that was the average age expectancy for a great dane. That upset me at the time, not because I thought they were rude, but because we never have long enough with our babies and I wanted it to be longer. I did some research, decided that as labs tend to go for more like 13 years, that my boy would probably make 10 or 11 if healthy. As far as I'm concerned he was 'an older dog' or a senior by the age of 8 (he had arthritis by then) and spent another 8 years being an oldie. 'Old' to me doesn't mean 'about to drop off the perch', it simply means 'don't expect him to be able to do acrobatic feats as if he was still a two year old.' Also bear in mind that according to age charts that take into account a dog's size, at 16 1/2 he was the equivalent of a 127 year old human, so he was well past what we consider old in human terms, a veritable Methuselah! The box that contains his ashes says "My beloved baby boy" and to me, that's what he always was, even when I knew he was ancient. He was about the same size and weight as a GSD, so to me, old for a GSD is also 8+, and there's nothing wrong with that!

I haven't known a dog yet who's seen the necessity to lie about their age. :laugh: I'm going to be blunt. A 10 year old dog IS a senior, no ifs or buts about it, and their diet plan, exercise level and care should take this into consideration. You love and care for your dog and yet you are in denial that he's no longer young. It's not like these people are saying "OMG your dog is going to drop dead any second." Some of them may have loved an oldie themselves and have a soft spot for them. I lost my boy at 16 1/2 last year and I treasure dearly every year he lived past everyone's expectations, including my own. If I said to you "What a lovely old boy" would you still be offended? Because I can tell you right now, I'm one of those with a soft spot for the oldies. Ella is now my oldest at 10 and a half so she's also an oldie, and I'm actually glad to be reminded of that. She's so youthful that sometimes I forget and I don't want to push her too hard. With today's throw-away mentality people are probably delighted to see someone who obviously loves and cares for their dog enough for them to still be around - I'd be seeing it as a compliment, not rudeness.

It ran onto the road because it was being attacked by the other dogs. So they are directly responsible for the dogs death. The only thing sensational about the title is the reference to pit bulls. The headline actually says "Guide dog killed after being ambushed by pit bulls in Bellfield in Melbourne's northeast" This is true, but what if it was something else that had startled the dog? It wouldn't even have made the news then. Say it was a windy day and there was a tarp that suddenly moved, the dog startled and jumped into the road. My dogs have almost done this on several occasions. What if it had been a golden that suddenly jumped out from behind a corner and startled the dog? Other than the pit bull type dogs involved, it's not even worth reporting. Are you serious? A guide dog is not just a pet, it is a highly trained assistance animal that has had thousands of dollars invested in it and has passed a stringent selection process. Someone relied on that dog just to complete the day to day tasks that we all take for granted, and you think that her tragic death is 'not even worth reporting'? I agree that the media takes enormous liberties with reporting of dog attack stories and is greatly to blame for the bad rep some breeds have, but I really think some are so busy pushing their own agenda that they lose sight of their humanity. R.I.P. Matilda We could learn a lot from dogs.

Cresties need grooming? Now there's something I wouldn't have guessed!

Thanks, will pm her :)

Actually T&S he's taller than I thought. I didn't measure him very accurately the first time. He's 91cm at the shoulder not 86cm. When we brought him home I held the tape measure up to his shoulder. This time I did it properly and stuck the tape measure to a door frame then used a flat ruler and knelt down to make sure it was horizontal. On his back feet he's about 6 foot, more or less. He met our next door neighbour today, over the fence. :laugh:

Yeah, he's a bit of a dork :D but we love him all the more for it!