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Since when was it illegal? It's the oldest profession in the world. I didnt realise it was illegal.

Oh for goodness sake. How to wreck a thread - just throw genocide into the discussion. FFS

Interesting thread. There are some really good comments in here and a couple of standouts from non breeders. I think that's probably where you need to take the lead, steve. Puppy buyers generally have an impession about breeders and it's not helped when the bla bla bla dog politics happens. There are more of us (puppy buyers) than you guys (breeders) and like it or not, the general perception is that registered breeders are just selling puppies for showing or breeding. All the passion behind what you guys do is lost on the average Joe Blow. They just want a dog.

No chopping block from me. Good on you, melt. My bro has also used live animals - so the people screaming can have their bloody children live a long and healthy life. I dont have a problem with it - no way in hell would I sign that petition

I think it's actually fueled by this idea that breeders are elitist snobs. I dont actually know any - every breeder I've dealt with has been great - but members of the public have this idea. Maybe work on that first, and that has to come from the breeders themselves. No need to police it. As for the state canine councils...I hate to say it but forget about them. They dont seem to give a rats about purebreed dogs in Australia. I actually dont know what they think about these days apart from registration fees. Very disappointing.

Thanks rappie. Your responses are really professional.

God it's fascinating for a lay person. Thanks rappie. So as a student, would you have preferred working on a model or a live animal? What would you have thought back then would best prepare you for working on someone's family member? ( I'm just now really interested in what vet students think about how they learn and prepare for cutting open an animal in the real world)

Sure for sure but I'm just really curious about foam models and how it prepares a vet student for blood suddenly spraying all over the ceiling. I know fx artists in the film industry who make realistic models and I cant think how Syd Uni pays for that stuff. It's really really expensive. I was talking to a phlebotomist just the other day (something totally unrelated to this thread) who said once the artery goes, it's like a bomb going off. Seriously, is a foam model going to prepare you for a real life situation and someone's family member on the table?

How do you learn to tie off a gushing artery if you're using a foam model?

It means you cant exhibit the dog. Really frigging stupid law, isnt it. And your vet who debarked the dog legally will get crucified.

I'm going to tell him you said that!

That's good to know. Thanks steve.

Sydney doesn't do non-recovery surgery, but it does use cadavers from the pound for surgery training. Really? How do they learn to do things like correct arterial bleeding?

Thats true but they didnt have Judy's dogs for that long as her legal people went in to help pretty quickly. What's the daily rate? I remember when Judy's matter first hit General someone mentioned the rate and all I could think was that I can commercially board all of my dogs for less than what they charge for one dog.

Stop taking the piss. She said sorry so let it rest. I'm the one she attacked and I dont have a problem with it now so let's just leave it. She said sorry.

Can we not argue over this, please. This is really important for all of us so let's just have a calm head at this point in time. Steve, I seem to recall when this first happened that someone said that if any of us (animal owners) have our animals seized, that we are liable for day to day impound costs until the animals are released ? eta regardless of the court outcome

Nice one. Good on you, Hoffpig.

Come on now. How is a petition Bullying? How do you think people should lobby for change?

Just on that point again incase anyone is confused, the wording is (using nsw petition as an example) This external process protects the organisation, any people under investigation and members of the public from unfair or vexatious notifications or corrupt activities and brings the RSPCA into line with other organisation’s best practice. The petitioners are acknowledging that it isnt just members of the public who are protected by an external process but the organisation and it's officers are as well.

And on that point - no it doesnt. The wording was very carefully chosen.

Well that's the thing, Woof - it's not regardless of where they source their money from. RSPCA is funded by the Govt so there should be a complaints procedure for wrong conduct as there is with the police, govt depts and council officers.

That's funded by the taxpayer. Ofcourse they should be accountable. As it is, they are not answerable for complaints of wrong conduct by members of the public.

Bingo!

Yep - Check Steve's latest thread on Judy Gard. 12 months in court. 12 frigging months.

Unbelievable. That poor bloody woman. Just shaking my head. I hope she can one day get on with her life as well.