Arya

Hey thanks Jules I will check out the Alexander technique as I do lose my balance sometimes (course, this could just be I'm totally uncoordinated anyway ). Mrs D, thanks for the explanation. The dog looks at me great but I must admit, I do look at her right in the eye all the time. It's a contact thing with her- if I don't have it she don't listen! But in the ring I lift my head up and work with my eyes ahead and just a little down to catch glimpses of her. I wonder why people trialling don't bother to find out the rules properly? I mean, the first thing I did and I tell people is to get the little blue book for a start! Dogdude, don't know if anyone else has replied but the KCC Park run-throughs (there's five left I think) are on Tuesday nights at 7pm. you have to book with Nolene McIlroy as it is run by OTEC and her number from VCA mag is 5978 7504. I'm sure she wouldn't mind me putting it here as it is in the VCA mag for people to ring. They are great nights and everyone is so helpful!

Tess and I are going!! Novice. If our heeling hangs in there we should be okay but she went much better last night thanks to help from everyone Should be good night as the weather is set to not be stinking hot and humid, so we may be lucky there. See you there!

CTD, the run-throughs at KCC Park on Tues nights are where I go and they are great Lots of great advice given from judges and helpers. From Mrs D: Arya, rattling the martingale chains I do hope you mean whilst training & not when trialling, that is a definite no-no in the ring >>>>>>>> . AAAH, Mrs D, it's no touching in the ring and I know that. I saw this guy give his dog a correction at the start post once and he lost HEAPS points and then was insulted when the judge told him so!!! Unreal. Re the looking at your dog - I know we mustn't do it in the ring and I understand this. But I must say there are two things I find hard (though I suppose someone has got to be looking where they are going or we'd trip up LOL). I really like to have my dog, being a shepherd and able to do it, to look right up at my face when heeling. It's not a question of how it looks to me but the position it puts her in and also helps to keep distractions out of the picture if she isn't looking ahead but up at me. Plus, I like the bond it creates. Can someone tell me (ignorant that I am) why this is such a bad thing in the ring during a trial? I don't really understand. The other thing is, and I know we must train our dogs to do this and of course, I do, I don't really love the way stays are conducted. My philosophy has always been to teach my dogs to stay close in my vicinity, to be around the pack leader and focus on what I am up to. Then, with the stays, we ask them to stay in one place in a line of dogs giving off different body signals, different levels of tension, and we WALK AWAY from them. I hate this. It is a very tense exercise for the dogs and I think, though a good test of obedience, rather unfair to the dogs. If they were asked to stay on their own I think it would be fairer. Just my opinion and a bit off topic but there you go

woops, sorry the post was so long. my fingers got carried away

Wow, great topic and I've also been inspired by your comments in the topic I started Dogdude. Just have been out there every second I get when it isn't hot enough to fry eggs on the pavement, that is LOL!!! I can't get the videos working with my old computer Shoemonster GRRR but sister is going to help me. Wish I could right now though! My comments would be (and remember, I've got a dog who has been being recalcitrant in heeling in the ring so you may want to disregard anything I've got to say LOL, plus I haven't seen your video) is I always throw the ball first when I start up in training and say 'Are you ready... ready... ready?' My ball-nut tries to break into our training bag as soon as we get to the park to steal them out cos she can't wait to get started I also put shiny tin can lids on the ground to help the dog get used to distractions and markers on the ground, as well as balled-up tissues and flourescent yellow marker-coloured bits of paper. This week I've put Tess back on lead and worked her with it loose (she goes in position regardless) but if she glanced away to look at a birdie or whatever she got a mild pop on the lead to remind her we are working. This hasn't knocked her drive to heel well but that is just her. In the past she has been known to lay down a challenge by refusing to do an exercise. I wish I could get videos working cos I have one of her pulling the funniest body position on change of position, refusing to drop and going 'make me if you can'. It was so plain that I had to laugh and save it on the video as it is so Tess. I have done the big circles that you suggested Dogdude and she really liked these and all sorts of unpredictable changes of direction. Shoemonster, I look at Tess in the face a lot as I heel too cos I have her right focussed on my face and I want her to see my expressions. I don't know, in the ring I look up a little so it's not so obvious but I do like to maintain the face contact with her, which is hard. I guess it loses points, doesn't it. Quite a few handlers in my classes rattle that chain martingale for attention too without a correction involved. It works well for them.

Mrs D, it's really interesting to get different people's interpretations isn't it Then we can store the ideas away and when we come across different dogs we can try out the different ideas! I see it as separation, you see it as getting them to stay in one position in one spot. That's what's great about this site, isn't it! I do see your point about it. The person who asks a questions sure gets a lot of different ways to try to solve their problems anyway, which is good.

Mrs D I teach a metre for the reason that it imho it implies separation for the dog but it is close enough to prevent a big failure of the exercise (so you can train for success) - but it does offer an opportunity for correction should the need arise. I made BIG mistake in not adding that I leave a lead on at this distance... near my foot. Then I progress to a long line and work backwards. I see your point but as you say a metre may as well be a kilometre to the dog LOL. I guess it's up to the individual but I figure when you walk away from the dog any distance at all, in the dogs mind handler, treats, ball etc. is leaving them. So a metre teaches them this is okay without the risk of the dog getting up and nicking off before you have a chance to show them this is not on. If the dog gets up I use a correction at this point. Just my opinion and no two trainers do it the same I guess.

Oh, sorry, forgot to add. I would stand in front, not to side. Five seconds, cool, end it while you're ahead. Then next time six, so on so on. Good luck!!!!!!!

Have a go at starting WAY back at the beginning and don't rush through the process. I find this is often the problem, especially if you have one fantastic dog like Moses and another isn't quite so good yet. Do the stay with yourself a metre in front of the dog. Be very clear with your release word/clicker and reward. Keep the reward with you. Personally I don't think it has to be visible as long as it comes from you. Even put a long line on her but just start at a metre. Then move back slowly, don't rush it. If the dog will do stays and understand the concept well and is not breaking at a metre, they should do it at ten, twenty metres (out of sights another matter though). If the dog is breaking after you are sure they understand the concept and you have the release word and reward just right, and you are sure they fully understand this, be it food or tug or ball, whatever, doesn't matter, whatever drives the dog, then this is a time where I would look at correction on a long line. But, you have to be sure they aren't confused, or worried at you moving away, or could make the problem worse. Just my thoughts, anyway. Hope they help! But I'd start back at the beginning with a clean slate and just start again with the whole exercise.

He he, poor old GSDs seem to be causing a lot of trouble on this forum lately and as I am owned by one, I can surely sympathise!!! As others have said, take heart, 8 1/2 months is still very young and my girl sometimes seemed positively EVIL in the clever mischief she used to dream up at this age . My advice to you would be to provide as much mental stimulation as possible. So teach her a few tricks, short bursts of obedience training each day, say three or four goes of five to ten minutes at a time when the baby is occupied and you're having a coffee break. LOTS of energetic recall games with ball which is much more tiring for the dog than a walk and will help bond her to you. Take a look at the NILIF program which you'll find on the web. Be FIRM but FAIR with bad behaviour. I believe in correction where correction is due (not too harsh for a youngster who is trying you out, but enough to let them know who is Alpha and biting etc. is not on - and not ever during obedience training when they don't understand and are learning stuff). And HEAPS of praise for good behaviour. In time, the wrecking will stop as she gets older and learns what is and isn't acceptable, if you provide the right environment for her. I must say if you crate her or put her in a run, be prepared to make up for that lock-away time with super fun and stimulation outside of it, otherwise you'll create more problems than you solve. I'm biased but I reckon you've picked the best dog and hopefully you'll think so too in a few months

These high action, high activity dogs have me hooked! He he...

BG, I think lots of comments have been made here for you to sort through and choose what you can use to help you so I won't add much except to say that I would be heading to K9 if I had to crawl there if I were you :thumbsup: However, I have GSD bitch who wasn't causing as much trouble as your boy but geez she was trouble initially and what a handful she was!!! She has just turned three and stick with it and stay positive and pro-active because she went from being the most difficult dog - no make that the most difficult animal I've ever owned and I've owned and worked with all sorts of animals all my life - to the absolute most maginficent animal I've ever had the privelege to be around once I found the right way to deal with her, with help. STICK WITH IT!!! Try not to get too upset, or feel too guilty, or take offence at any of the things said. Take em on board, work out what to do next, learn to love him again as you learn to understand him better and GOOD LUCK!!! And by the way, for all the work they are I doubt I'll ever get a different type of dog again after owning a GSD - unless it's maybe a Mal :D

I agree with Erny, a trip to K9 would totally be worth it from where you are. I think someone else mentioned it but Black Dog have a back up in case your dog slips a head halter. It would NOT be my preference though cos I think you need to get a prof trainer to help you decide what is needed for your dog and get control thru training. I sympathise with the travel thing, living in the country myself. But, hey, at least you're in the same state as K9 LOL Good luck, what a lucky dog she is to have someone take her in when she is such an escape artist and give her a good home.

I disagree totally with Staff n Toller about not using a prong collar on fear aggressive dogs. They can be highly successful with such dogs but you do need an experienced trainer to give you a lesson on how to use them correctly - and really, that goes for head collar etc too. My dog is living proof that a prong collar works for fear aggression without being harsh or 'cruel' and you won't find a happier more motivated dog nowadays :rolleyes: Prong collars are definitely not just for dominant aggressive dogs. Don't be put off by what they look like. Go to K9s website. It sounds like you need to shut some of your dog's behaviour's down with a combination of motivational stuff and also correction. However, I TOTALLY agree with Staff n Toller that a good trainer will be able to help you out. Actually, far more than any training tool such as prong or head collar. Go that way and ask the trainer to help find the right training tool (collar) for you. Don't suffer being unable to take your dog out in public or not being able to put her in certain situations. It makes life a lot less fun for you and the dog.

Dust Angel, I sympathise on the head collar situation. In my classes I have found that if they are not fitted exactly (and I've mentioned this on the forum before) the bottom part of the noseband can slip and become lodged in the mouth like a horse bit, or slip off altogether. There is also some evidence that they can hurt a dog's neck if it is pulling out of control. Others will disagree here. A greyhound collar with a martingale will certainly be better but to be perfectly honest, the answer to your problems with a big strong GSP lies in a 'pinch' or 'prong' collar. HOWEVER, you need to get someone to show you how to use this correctly and fairly. If you want further info on this you will find it at K9s website, the address which escapes me. There is lots of info on the collars on this site. People either love em or hate em it seems to me but personally, I love them. You sound like you also need a bit more obedience work with the dog, which obviously you are doing from what you say. maybe a good obedience club in your area can help you. That would also be my recommendation. Good luck!

Really great suggestions from everyone!!! This is a good topic Here is something that you may find useful. I see you are in Sydney. I am in Melbourne and what we have here at KCC Park is the VCA obedience, tracking and endurance committee have some obedience run through nights during daylight savings. You have to book in here but it is REALLY good for proofing your dog in a trial-type situation. The judges and other experienced OTEC people put you through the ring like a trial and you get to talk to the dog, make corrections, give encouragement etc. and get advice. Does NSW have something like that running for triallers? It would be worth investigating if you are considering trialling. I hope you can find something like that as it is not like regular obedience club training and is of immense help, even if just to see where you are up to and what you need to work on with focus etc. Finally, don't underestimate the stress level that builds up in your dog in unusual situations. Watch your dog and take him aside every so often for a game of tug or a bit of ball or something fun well away from the other dogs. Release the stress then return for more work and focussing. This also helped me with my dog in trial situation and she was originally a looney tunes in unfamiliar situations

The vet clinic where I used to work is situated kind of halfway between Croydon Dog Obedience and ADT's centre in The Basin. We had good words from clients about both places. Depending on where you are in the east, Frankston Dog Obedience Club is another club very very similar to Croydon and it has a very good rep too.

A greyhound muzzle doesn't restrict breathing, fair enough. I'll tell you what, those soft black muzzles sure do though! They look like they would be the best option but I'd never leave one on a dog for more than a short time. Dogs overheat so easily. With yoru dog, don't forget the damage ol' kitty can do to your dog's eyes! Look, as a vet nurse I did see this fairly regularly. Even when just playing the cat's instinct is to go for the face and unfortunately, the eyes are vulnerable. As I said in my other post, my two get on great. But always be aware that dogs will be dogs and cats will be cats. Separation is the only truly safe solution. I'm not being critical of you at all. I think it's great you've got the two in the house together. But you just have to make provision for both when you are out, to be on the safe side and avoid vet bills for either pet

Wow, I wouldn't go there again!!! For a start, asking those poor pups to sit through an hour of someone gasbagging is just teaching them to be bored when they come to training - the worst thing you can do! And never saying no - uh oh! A recipe for a naughty pup! Seems like the vote here is unanimous.

I would no way try to do this. Let the dog be higher rank. Never leave them alone together when you are not around if the dog has nipped the cat - or the cat may get hurt or the dog may get a scratched eye (seen this as a vet nurse lots of times). If you are the highest rank, other humans next, the dog next, the cat next, the dog is more likely to accept the cat as he/she is and not try to nip. The cat won't care about rank issues - in the cat's mind it is the king/queen of all it surveys anyway LOL. But as Nekhbet said, never put the cat on the dog's bed. You can't make them be friends. If they are going to be big buddies they will come to it themselves. The reality is, however, that many dogs and cats that live together aren't really big buddies. For example, my dog and cat get along just fine. But the dog feels she is ahead in the pack. HOWEVER, interestingly enough, she never takes the cat's toys when they are lying around and sticks to her own. She does try to stir the cat up now and again but for the most part is peaceable with her and likes to sit next to her. Why doesn't she take the cat's toys? Cos I have told her not to and I am Alpha! Good luck with your pets ;)

Tapferhund, what an UNREAL pic of your little one. I love the pic with the GSD in the background. That dog is looking at yours with an amazed expression on his face! What next? I think I will sign my cat up, as Nekhbet said Seriously though, what a bite on that arm! She's really giving it a good go!

Er... woops, I meant I love it! Freudian slip, I live it too I guess

CaseyKay - husband training... I live it You have to ask, if you are Alpha, exactly who is next in line? Dog or hubby... We have this humorous conversation in our house often!

Best wishes for your poor cat!!! Hope he/she is okay

Nekhbet, I TOTALLY agree with you. Don't let him pull a swiftie on you with the drop thing. Still, the extreme reluctance to eat issue is something that I agree needs checked out by a vet. I worked as a vet nurse for many years and it does flag a bit of a warning. Blood tests, maybe thyroid function test? The vet will know once you dish out the history. We used to see huge number of rottis where I worked.