Sandra777

I would definitely get an appointment with a Chiro. Not necessarily instead of a specialist but certainly give it a go. What does the breeder say?

If she is going to be with the dogs at all times ie doesn't need them boarded while she goes on ahead, can go to the vet with them, can take them to the airport herself then it really doesn't matter who books the flight because they will never have charge of the dogs and all dogs travel in the same part of the plane regardless of who booked them on. If she needs the transporter to actually have the dogs in their care, then obviously she's going to want lots of personal recommendations ETA: Yes, both the ones you mention do overseas travel. Are the dogs used to being crated? If not, she will need to get on to this quickly as it's really not fair on the dog for it's first crate experience to be on a plane. Make sure she has with her (not packed with household effects) multiple items of proof that she owned the dogs in Australia (vaccination card, council rego receipt, ANKC rego certificate etc) AND proof that she lived at the address on these items (power bill, phone bill, bank statement etc) In NZ customs gouge GST out of you for dogs if you can't prove they've been yours the whole time - even if you have it in writing that you paid nothing for them.

Just choosing two of your statements 1) That "clearly more of these type of dogs involved in attacks than anything else" and 2) That "These attacks for the most part were unprovoked active and predatory type aggression" I don't think there are any statistics to support either of these beliefs, could you cite your sources please. ETA: No BSL doesn't work. This has been proven over and over.

Up to you about the breed and yes, careful selection of a pup/adult PLUS rearing will have a lot to do with the dog's ultimate interaction with your son, but I can understand the breeder's reaction completely. To ME the Tenterfield and "mini foxie" would be a bit too breakable for the situation you describe, not saying anything would happen through cruelty or even deliberately but a child with control problems can hurt a smaller sized dog without meaning to, and despite your best efforts you can't guarantee 100% supervision at all times for the next 15 years. I would suggest you have a look at the Staffordshire Bull Terrier, and by that I mean the genuine article, not a random brindle mutt from some BYB or pound. I have placed a number of Stafford puppies with special needs families in the past 30 years and without exception they have all been brilliant. One became the unofficial kindergarten class dog at a school which took solely special children (mostly autism). Another one went ot a family with a Downs Syndrome child and within 6 months 2 others were booked to go to other families with Downs children who went to the same specialist classes at a school and who had got to know the first girl. They aren't a big dog, if you choose your breeder and litter right you can easily find a good one which won't be much over 14kg fully grown and although that is obviously bigger than a Tenterfield :D it's not a large dog.

x2 And 10 + bundles of joy all full of puppy poo & pee make a lot more mess than one in season bitch! Talk to your flat mate calmly and quietly, and if they still don't listen take the bitch and get her spayed yourself. Chances are they won't even notice if you do it when they're away for 2 or 3 days

My understanding is that PA is at least polygenic and could well be a high degree of environmental - along the lines of HD so crossing breeds prone to either can bring a whole heap of polygenic causes together and they don't all have to be identical to cause a problem (I know that's not a scientific explanation) PRA is simple recessive but the recessive is not necessarily the same in all breeds as I understand it so you would need to get the same recessive from two different breeds to have a problem.

Can't help you with not sounding judgemental - I'm the crazed dog lady at work and it's only the fact that I do the payroll that keeps them all liking me You COULD point out the new BSL laws in Victoria (assuming the pups aren't registered) and keep them up to date with all the dogs being taken and killed. People like this just drive me crazy.

I still laugh at the thought of one stud contract I read. The owner of the stud dog would tell the bitch's owner which puppies could be registered (others had to be sold unregistered, this was OK with the canine control at that time and in that place). They could decide that none could be registered. The owner of the stud dog would be allowed to use FREE OF CHARGE any descendant of that dog owned by the bitch's owner for 4 generations. (I think it meant only 1 mating, not every single dog) There were various other clauses. The kicker of all this? The dog was 2 years old. The dog had never been used at stud before. The dog had been bought by the owner when it was 6 months old so not owner-bred AND the dog was the first pedigree dog they had ever owned. I owned the sire (an imported dog) and the dam was owned by some friends who had bred the bitch but she was from their first litter and this dog was from their second (and final) litter. They had kept the dog out of the litter but split up so had sold him to these people, with the verbal agreement that I was the only one allowed to approve or otherwise this dog being used at stud. Not because we had any agreement at all over this, but because they thought it was best the new comers have some guidance. Needless to say the long standing and very successful breeder who had enquired about using the dog said no thanks and came and used his half bother that I owned. Some people never fail to amaze and amuse!

Can't see why any vet would prefer a syringe to feed over tube feeding - syringes are a really good way of getting milk into the wrong place and if the pup is weak to start with you have to drip the milk in to them so slowly they use more energy than they get swallowing one drop of milk at a time. When you pick the pup up does he lie flat on the palm of your hand or curl up? What did the vet say about what was wrong with him?? DID the vet check his palate?

Have you checked his palate? What do his lungs sound like? New born pups don't do anything, so I'm not sure what you mean by lazy. Quiet is often good in that pups that are cold, sick or hungry usually scream a lot. Of course it could be because he's too weak to cry but usually the weak ones whinge even if they can't scream. I would get him onto tube feeding straight away - syringes are an easy way to cause pneumonia. If you wipe his stomach around his penis you will definitely know if he's passing urine or not (usually they pee ON me ) Me I wouldn't persist with a pup like this, but good luck with whatever you decide. Edited because my keyboard can't spell

I seen this for myself Well someone was smokin' somethin' :rofl:

Being ill knocks dogs around a lot, he may lack energy because he has been sick and being only small it takes a lot more out of them than a bigger dog (think 6 year old sized human vs adult sized human). I wouldn't mess with his food until he's back to normal. I raw feed and don't use mince for anything except very small puppies, but with a Chi I think you would need to get advice from people used to feeding very small dogs as what I can tell you about raw feeding a dog which can chew up a pigs head probably isn't very relevant to Rascal :D

In defense of the indefensible. If a dog came up to one of my dogs and bit it on the ear the biter would almost certainly get bitten and yes the one who bit first would have started it. Big dog vs a little dog is bound to not end well for the little dog, but the little guys don't know that when they approach. Even a small breed/cross puppy could easily be killed by an illmannered older dog of a large breed/cross even if the older dog didn't actually "attack" the puppy. But then none of mine would be wandering around loose in the presence of random other dogs. About 8-9 years ago there was an incident in NZ where a poodle (toy or mini, little guy anyway) jumped over it's front fence and latched on to a Bullmastiff being walked ON LEASH by it's owner on a public footpath. One bite and it was goodnight poodle, and the media (aided by a local vet and an MP) was baying for the blood of the vicious Bullmastiff that "mauled" the poodle. Jim sounds like a great piece of work.

Holy **%%%!! Don't you own a shotgun Steve

That is appalling, so sorry for you and the pup.

Yep, but jakeyjangels suggested interceptor monthly, which is an overkill on intestinal worming IMO.

Why would you want to treat a dog for intestinal worms every month?? Me, I would choose a different produce for intestinal worms and only treat if there was actually something to treat (fecal count)

She won't come back in to season any earlier. Dogs don't do it that way. If you want to remove the puppy do so. Don't allow her to take it back, put it somewhere she can't get it. Me, I would let her keep it until she decides for herself

Line breeding is when it works, In breeding is when it doesn't Depends on who you believe but my definition has always been sire/daughter, dam/son, full brother/sister is in breeding, further separation is line breeding. Some would say anything which would produce pups with a COI higher than the breed average is inbreeding, but this isn't very helpful unless you have a large database to calculate the breed average on in the first place. In breeding/line breeding is a emotional issue where people tend to put a human spin on the whole deal. If the animals involved are temperamentally and physically correct and genetically sound in breeding IN ITSELF does no harm at all. It's in the choice of parent stock, not the breeding method that most inbreeding programmes fall apart. Google Orlov Trotters - they were developed in Russia in the early 20th century and mating one stallion to his own female offspring down through 4 or 5 generations was quite normal.

Sorry things haven't turned out well, all part of the ups and downs of dog breeding unfortunately No it's not morbid of you to take photographs. It's not something I would do but if it makes you feel better then go for it. Me, I would leave the dead pup with her for a little while and monitor what she does. She will either loose interest and push is away or she will try to tidy up her nest and eat the body. Both are perfectly natural things for her to do. When she pushes it away you can swap it for a soft toy (or even a pair of rolled up socks) for the moment. If you want to, you could phone around the local vets and make it know you have a potential foster mother available, but for me with a maiden bitch I would not be willing to risk other people's puppies just in case she turns out not to accept them or is a poor mother (both things you can't tell from her current behaviour). I would give the stuffed toy or rolled up socks and leave her alone in her whelping box until this evening, then get her out for a pee and poop and a little walk, then give her a VERY small dinner. Old timers maintained extra fat slowed milk production, but whether this has any basis in truth I can't say - but high quality puppy food and lean protein will definitely boost milk production so avoid giving her "all the good stuff" and give her a small amount of basic food (unless you have a lead on getting her some fosters pups of course!) If you decide not to get her foster pups, give her a day or two of quiet and peace with her substitute puppy/socks. Give her small amounts of food at her normal meal times, get her out of the box regularly for pee breaks and a small walk. Keep the other dog away. Almost certainly within 48 hours she will have done her grieving and be ready to get on with life. Check her regularly as she may decide to produce gallons of milk and this can cause all sorts of problems, but usually without pups suckling and without a lot of good tucker nature takes it's course. As for spaying her, well that's up to you. You can't assume it's her "fault" at all and if she is a good example of the breed and part of a long term breeding programme, then there is no good reason to make a rash decision right now. (Not that you would spay her right now of course!) I had a number of bitches conceive singletons. One has since had a litter of 5, another a litter of 4. One I forgot to mention in the last thread had a litter of NINE (breed average is 4) then conceived a singleton on her second (and last) litter. I have also had a bitch that conceived a singleton twice, so it is possible she will only ever have one pup at a time, but nothing is set in stone. For now - IMO she should be allowed about 48 hours to grieve, recover physically and get her hormones and instincts under control. After that you can start to make it less comfortable for her to stay in her nest. Replace all the blankets and everything that might smell of the birth/her pup (leave her toy/socks) make her get out of bed to eat and drink, take her for small walks (around the yard first) on a leash, make her get out of her nest even for a pat. Let the other dog make noise and gets lots of fussing close to where she is (separated by a gate or playpen at first in case she reacts badly), basically get her out of her nesting mode and back in to her normal life mode. ETA: no you don't need to do anything for Dogs Queensland and no IMO you don't have to breed her straight away either.

Love the way they will fly the pup to you anywhere in Australia or Tasmania. If I was Tasmanian I think I'd take offence at that ;) Had a fair bit to do with "foxie"/poodle crosses (the foxie wasn't a Fox Terrier in this case) and they were actually nice dogs - if you like very active, very agile, very noisy, very intelligent dogs with terrier temperaments. The "breeder" called them Foodles which is slightly less repulsive than Fox Poo

Yes you certainly can mix two types of food together, but you will find that generally speaking feeding a more expensive brand means you feed less food so the price per portion isn't hugely different from the cheaper end to the more expensive end of the market. Every dry food I have fed recently comes in a 20kg bag and I'm feeding 5 dogs which are between 13 and 17kg each and a bag of dry lasts about 6 weeks here - BUT I don't feed dry exclusively, they get meaty bones, lumps of meat off the bone, sardines, eggs, scraps, etc I have fed everything from Royal Canin (I have one that hates this) to Uncle Albers (same bitch hates this too) and found the dogs have done pretty much the same on all of them, except you do notice the increase in the output on the cheaper brands! At the moment I'm using Black Hawk but the next bag will be something different again, I used Enduro and like it more, just need to get off butt and go to the stockist. Black Hawk is mostly sold through agents AFAIK rather than a lot of main stream shops (although I know of at least one shop close to me that stocks it) so someone on here will be able to point you in the direction of your closest agent.

I don't think the prices are too bad, but if I'd approved my dog to go under anasthetic to find a grass seed then they charged me $80 to do a dental (or are those prices after the discount?) I wouldn't have been paying the $80!

How did I get my first show dog? I looked in the newspaper, phoned up about a pup and brought him home. No contracts, no joint ownership, no drama. The breeders weren't hugely experienced but were part of a network of people all working together so had plenty of resources to fall back on and use to guide me. They later gave me my foundation bitch with a verbal agreement which was upheld in part, but by the time it came to fulfilling the second part of the agreement they had lost interest in the breed and were happy for me to have her outright and do as I wished (with the guidance of others in their group).

Some people believe that the dry food and the raw food (or left overs) will take different amounts of time for the stomach to break down and pass on to the intestine so cause problems for the dog's digestion. AFAIK there's no scientific basis for this, afterall if you give the dog an edible bone some parts of this are going to take longer to leave the stomach than other parts and they cope perfectly OK with that!