Are You Serious Jo

One of my friends works at one of the big pet stores in Toowoomba, I'll pass the info on to him, see what he says. He was there that day so he knows what went down first hand.

I took that to mean more than a nip, so this dog would go to heaven if it was me I'm afraid.

One thing that jumps out at me, the dog may have shown signs yet the owner may not have been experienced enough to pick up on it. I personally wouldn't want the liability of a dog like that, so my response would be no, I'm not that forgiving of HA.

That's because they aren't PASSIONATE DOG LOVERS :D Oh noes, there goes another pm

Damn. I am breaking my ignore rule again (thanks for all the PM's everyone) There are some of PETA'S agenda that I 100% disagree with. I certainly don't subscribe to PETA's extreme view that all pets are slaves, and should be set free. So it's ok to agree with some of an organisations philosophies and not others, but still support them overall?

I wonder if Annie knows about the PETA agenda to stop the keeping of dogs and cats?

Now do you see why I was asking her for more information about her beliefs. I doubt she is able to integrate anything we say and it is probably a waste of time trying to do so.

Numerous people have PM'ed me to ignore you but I will break the rule just this once. I am concerned when people treat animals as commodities with little or no concern about the home they go to (ie impulse buy in pet shops) or the welfare of the breeding females, dogs being mass farmed in conditions that have no concern for their physical and mental state. So I am I have been an animal lover since I was born and love all animals and it upsets me when I see suffering of animals/cruelty to animals/laws that don't protect animals/animals natural environment being destroyed (oratatangs in Bornio - sorry for spelling), dancing bears etc etc That didn't actually answer my question. None of us support cruelty here. I'll spell it out. Some people come here and are ignorant of how good breeders work, they see that they have a lot of dogs or cats and assume that equals puppy farmer. We have to then outline to them that having more than a few breeding animals does not automatically make someone a puppy farmer. You said this person had 30 cats, so it sounded like you were lumping her into the farmer basket based on simply the number she has. It is not that black and white as people has said, some can manage large numbers well, some can't mange 1 successfully. Not a trap, trying to educate someone by ascertaining their beliefs beforehand saves a lot of wasted time.

The balance is showing how to obtain a puppy from a registered breeder or ethical rescue, not another pet shop.

Annie, animal rights or animal welfare?

You can have over 30 cats and still not be a farmer, if those cats are well cared for. I'm guessing you are one of those people that associate volume with quality and lump all breeders who have more than a few animals as evil farmers?

It's not as black and white as that, for example, when the question was asked here to define puppy farmers there was no clear definition. It is not as black and white as you are making it to be, life isn't that simple for the rest of us.

Yes, I agree, Annie you have been asked nicely to stop using caps, it makes text harder to read and is very rude. If you want people to read what you write it is good form not to scream at them.

Is that right? How do you know? From reading this dog forum? If we are talking anecdotal what about the people who buy from backyarders and shonky breeders/puppy farms who have a great dog and couldn't be happier? Logic dictates that if you buy a dog whose parents are not health tested it has a higher chance of carrying a genetic disease than from parents who have been eliminated from carrying those genes. Sure there'll be some dogs who never develop any health issues, statistically that will happen. But it isn't rocket surgery, if a breeder sets out to only breed from dogs that don't carry a gene then the puppies won't carry it.

Who do you think the new vets ask for advice when they first start consulting, that's right, those dumbarse nurses

Mita doesn't breed dogs.

Well facts aren't as exciting as sensationalist press, which is what gets people to protest. Shame we can't debate those who claim the practice is inhumane, those who say it here just won't answer the question. I guess they should also consider desexing inhumane too?

I'm still failing to see how operating on an animal that is under a GA is inhumane, and WTF, are they saying pound dogs are an OH & S risk?

I'm so sorry pheebs, I know how much you loved Tess, RIP old girl

Don't worry about QLD, Mita will just call the rspca and the state government and explain why it's a bad idea and all will be good

Sorry I'm not getting that particular point. So you're saying if I have 5 dogs, but my council says I'm only allowed to have 2 dogs, I'm going to be unable to register my 5 dogs on my breeder's number?? Umm, yep, if that's the case, fair enough. I am NOT saying that I agree with current council dog limits. I AM saying if you are the breeder with 3 dogs over your council's limit, then that is not a very smart choice to start with. efs I know, it is one of the things I do have conflicting views about, on one hand rules are rules, but on the other is someone has had no hassle ever with neighbours and their dogs are well cared for and never cause a fuss then I can't see the harm. After all, in some places local council can't tell you how many dogs you can have, it is ok in NSW to have no limit, as long as you cause no trouble with your dogs. The reality is that some good dog breeders do go over a bit on their limits, they don't have enough dogs to warrant buying a property to set up kennels and can't often afford to for what is a small hobby. So we enforce dog limits everywhere, force out small breeders who produce quality puppies and all you have left are commercial dog farms who can afford to comply with increasingly strict and sometimes ridiculous new laws.

Well if they aren't going to have property inspections to give out a breeders number then how could they police it and why bother doing it in the first place, it would be meaningless. But even if a property inspection isn't done then you might find council will be your hurdle. What if they require that you have council approval to register and you can't get it? A lot of people are technically over the council limit but they never cause a fuss and do the right thing otherwise, those people would be gone.

How long is a piece of string? What area are you specifically referring to, QLD is a big place?

Fingers crossed for no c-section.